[aimless]

Originally Posted by Arial Type

Syberia is a product of modern marketing technoligies.

Oh, please. I'm not sure what you meant, but I'm taking it as a put down. Syberia (I'm talking about both games since they are one and honestly should be listed as one) is beautiful, it speaks to the heart, it's a lovely adventure with a very unusual setting. Sokal can be justly proud of it.

[Fien]

Originally Posted by diego

Fien, what is PH?

Eh... Ph the acidity measure?
Prins Hendrik, one of our ancient Dutch princes?
Phoenix Height?

Oh wait! I remember now... it's a typo. I meant to say HaPpy CHristmas and it came out all wrong.

HaPpy CHristmas, Diego!

[Arial Type]

Originally Posted by aimless

Oh, please. I'm not sure what you meant, but I'm taking it as a put down. Syberia (I'm talking about both games since they are one and honestly should be listed as one) is beautiful, it speaks to the heart, it's a lovely adventure with a very unusual setting. Sokal can be justly proud of it.

Of course you are free to enjoy Syberia) I'm only talking about marketing side. It was advertised as a "unique adventure, emotional characters with feelings, logical puzzles well-integrated into the storyline, etc", the mainstream press started to praise it as a "modern classic" the first day it came out. It was praised to the extent that saying you didn't like it was like saying you didn't like Shakespear I was disgusted with myself at first for not enjoying it like everyone else did, as everything about Syberia felt very ordinary. Now THAT'S a good marketing.

According to Wiki, it was developed on a budget of €2 million. It doesn't live up to its production value, not now, not back then. I believe that at least half of the budget was spent on marketing with a very talanted team behind. Oh, and of course Sokal is a vey talented artist, I always gave him that.

[Gabe]

Originally Posted by Arial Type

Oh no, not Samorost again What's so great about it anyway?

Originally Posted by Drolin

I dont know either. In my opinion, Samorosts are quite overrated for an 20-40 minutes long games.

Originally Posted by Kurufinwe

Yeah, I don't know what's so great about Samorost. It's cute and all, and was a fun meme on these forums a few years ago, but top-60 material? Seriously?

Sheesh,listed game title is not Samorost but Samorost 2. There are quite big difference between those two and i think Samorost 2 deserves it be in top 40 in ag history.

[Kurufinwe]

Originally Posted by Arial Type

Of course you are free to enjoy Syberia) I'm only talking about marketing side. It was advertised as a "unique adventure, emotional characters with feelings, logical puzzles well-integrated into the storyline, etc", the mainstream press started to praise it as a "modern classic" the first day it came out. It was praised to the extent that saying you didn't like it was like saying you didn't like Shakespear I was disgusted with myself at first for not enjoying it like everyone else did, as everything about Syberia felt very ordinary. Now THAT'S a good marketing.

Right. So when people like something that you didn't, it has to be because they're idiots who let themselves get brainwashed by clever marketing techniques.

I just love getting insulted in the morning. Such a fantastic way to start the day!

[Arial Type]

Originally Posted by Kurufinwe

Right. So when people like something that you didn't, it has to be because they're idiots who let themselves get brainwashed by clever marketing techniques.

I just love getting insulted in the morning. Such a fantastic way to start the day!

Oh, c'mon! You're just insulting yourself. I wrote only about marketing side, as a marketer myself. There's nothing bad about good marketing campaign, especially in 21 century, when companies spend millions on advertising and PR. Syberia is a nice, quality game, just not THAT special.

I can give you an example. Syberia exploits many Russian stereotypes. As a Russian myself, I know that it may be hard to sell such product to Russian audience. But marketers and Sokal made it sound like a completely different universe with fictional history, charaters and everything. "SYberia, - they told us, - not SIberia. You see? Completely different!". And it worked. They made people believe it has nothing to do with stereotypes, that it takes place somewhere in Europe, even with stereotypical songs, names and all. It was a huge success in Russia and all over the world. I find this amusing.

And it's evening here

[diego]

Originally Posted by Fien

Phoenix Height?

You should have said PW

AND - it's spelled pH

p.s. MCF! (decode! )

Btw, nice to see Myst 3 which reminds me again i need to play it - and every other Myst game , but i think i'll start exactly with this one.

Star Trek game is a surprise for me, i think i've only played one Star Trek game from late 90s, which wasn't necessarily an adventure game. Yeah, it could be said i'm more of a SW than ST "fan", but i'll keep an eye on this one.

Indigo Prophecy - there's already been much discussion about the game and its gameplay mechanic controversies, but i've always said that Indigo Prophecy didn't do anything that hasn't been done earlier with Interactive movies of 90s, which is not a bad thing per se. It maybe didn't rise to the general popularity when i've played it, but if you're gonna make a diverse selection and list of games that had a noticeable impact, you can't miss it, although truth to be told Omicron was first.

In Memoriam - a revelation for me. I did hear about the game earlier but somehow it completely went out of my radar. As i'm a big detective/mystery buff it's going straight to the "top priority".

Return to Mysterious Island - haven't finished it but i would agree with the choice of the Kheops bunch. The inventory, even tiresome at moments to me, was really a revolutionary and i wonder what would have happened if Kheops further developed their formula.

[aimless]

Originally Posted by Arial Type

Of course you are free to enjoy Syberia) I'm only talking about marketing side. It was advertised as a "unique adventure, emotional characters with feelings, logical puzzles well-integrated into the storyline, etc", the mainstream press started to praise it as a "modern classic" the first day it came out. It was praised to the extent that saying you didn't like it was like saying you didn't like Shakespear

Can I use that as another reason why everybody and his brother likes The Longest Journey, which I am sure will make it close to the top of this list (Please, Lord, not the pinnacle!) and I think it sucks? I have no idea how much they spent on marketing for that one but I like the notion that brainwashing created its popularity.

[Arial Type]

Originally Posted by aimless

Can I use that as another reason why everybody and his brother likes The Longest Journey, which I am sure will make it close to the top of this list (Please, Lord, not the pinnacle!) and I think it sucks? I have no idea how much they spent on marketing for that one but I like the notion that brainwashing created its popularity.

Sure, Ragnar is a marketing genius Well, at least he knows how to position his game to the public. Then again, the sales of TLJ were far from those of Syberia as far as I know. About 500000 copies compared to what, 2 million? And that's only HALF of the full game)

[Drolin]

Just installed Myst IV and Black Dahlia (plus Runaway 3) because of the list. I overlooked these games for some years and now I am discovering how good games these are. In that case, I am pleased with the top 100 list for new ideas what to play .

Originally Posted by diego

Oh, i totally forgot about Cryo They're somehow in the similar position like Kheops for instance - without the big names, but with many solid titles. That's why they're often overlooked. But at least Atlantis 1 or 2 could make it, if anything - for the great music

Couldnt agree more. I just love music from Cryo games - especially Dune (my favorite game OST), Lost Eden and Atlantis which you mention.

And I am secretaly hoping for DreamWeb in top50, but since on most adventure sites this game got 1 or 2 from five - its quite unreal. But its really good game with interesting perspective, mature story and solid cyberpunk atmosphere.

[Gonchi]

Originally Posted by diego

Star Trek game is a surprise for me, i think i've only played one Star Trek game from late 90s, which wasn't necessarily an adventure game. Yeah, it could be said i'm more of a SW than ST "fan", but i'll keep an eye on this one.

As a Star Trek fan, I was pleasantly surprised by its inclusion, although as a fan of both The Original Series and The Next Generation, I was annoyed by the slight against A Final Unity by proclaiming Judgment Rites was the last Star Trek adventure game.

[rtrooney]

@F Absolutely. FPFP.

[Jackal]

Originally Posted by Gonchi

As a Star Trek fan, I was pleasantly surprised by its inclusion, although as a fan of both The Original Series and The Next Generation, I was annoyed by the slight against A Final Unity by proclaiming Judgment Rites was the last Star Trek adventure game.

Oops. No slight on TNG. Simply a brain cramp on my part. (I even have A Final Unity.) Will adjust that wording.

[Siddhi]

Originally Posted by Kurufinwe

Yeah, I don't know what's so great about Samorost. It's cute and all, and was a fun meme on these forums a few years ago, but top-60 material? Seriously? On the other hand, Machinarium is great, and it looks like it's going to make the top-50.

Exactly. Both the Samorost games were so-so, 1 hour distractions, small flash games you'd play for a few minutes to pass the time.

Machinarium, on the other hand, is top-20 for me.

[Oscar]

I think Machinarium will be higher up on the list and enjoyed it more than Samorost, but Machinarium wouldn't exist without Samorost. Making any top games list is a matter of balancing innovation with enjoyment in games - both are just as important as each other.

[Tiocfaidh]

I´m crossing my fingers for Byzantine to make it into the list, but I doubt it.
Very underrated IMHO, maybe not Top 50 material but definately Top 100.
At least more deserving than a few that already made it into the ranking.
But that´s just my opinion.

Still, a great list & highly enjoyable read !
Thanks very much

A Flop 100 would be a lot of fun as well

[Gonchi]

Originally Posted by Jackal

Oops. No slight on TNG. Simply a brain cramp on my part. (I even have A Final Unity.) Will adjust that wording.

Cool, thank you.

[Iznogood]

Am I the only one that fells that this list is somewhat presumptuous?

Don't get me wrong, there is also a lot of nice things to say about the list. You can find great games you have never heard of before, or reminisce the great games you have played.

But ranking each game against each other like this, is always going to be a subjective opinion, and will end in discussions like "How the ... can they claim that game x is better than game y". And it will only get worse when we get to top 10, and especially when it comes to naming "The Best Adventure Game Ever Made"

I personally know that i will post something angry, if neither Grim Fandango nor The Longest Journey is at number 1

Imo it would have been better simply to name the 100 best games in no particular order, or to group them into 1-10, 11-25, 25-50 and 51-100 but not rank them within each group.

[Fien]

Originally Posted by diego

You should have said PW

AND - it's spelled pH

p.s. MCF! (decode! )

MCF? Ah yes, Mystery Case Files. The only casual series I enjoy playing. You're wrong, they won't make AG's top hundred.



Iznogood:

Imo it would have been better simply to name the 100 best games in no particular order, or to group them into 1-10, 11-25, 25-50 and 51-100 but not rank them within each group.

I agree. That's what I've done with my own top hundred, which I made some time ago. It doesn't have much in common with AG's top hundred, BTW.

[Jackal]

Originally Posted by Arial Type

Syberia is a product of modern marketing technoligies.

That is complete nonsense. Marketing makes people notice a game, maybe even buy a game. It doesn't make them like it. In fact, it often ends up disappointing people if a game doesn't live up to expectations. You really need to accept the fact that Syberia is beloved because it does a lot of things that people genuinely enjoy and appreciate, even if you don't.

The title (and the spelling) are incredibly dumb, by the way. Certainly didn't impact my view of the game either way.

Originally Posted by Iznogood

Am I the only one that fells that this list is somewhat presumptuous?

We're not presuming to speak for anyone but ourselves. This is our list of top games as we see it, plain and simple. It's no more presumptuous than you having your own list of favourites. In fact, we're encouraging people to share their own opinions.

Imo it would have been better simply to name the 100 best games in no particular order, or to group them into 1-10, 11-25, 25-50 and 51-100 but not rank them within each group.

How on earth is that better? I agree, arguing over what game should be #59 or #72 is hugely arbitrary, but ranking them is part of the fun. And ultimately we DO end up favouring some games over others. Dumping them all in a generic list would just come off as lame and non-committal.

Originally Posted by Fien

It doesn't have much in common with AG's top hundred, BTW.

Only 50 of which you've seen, of course, excluding the top half which will almost certainly have far more similarities.