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So what’s Jane Jensen up to these days?
im saying I dont know where he got those numbers from gk2 was no where near 10 million to produce. im willing to bet telltale games are pretty cheap to actually make as well. they are using the same engine from like 4 to 5 yrs ago still. Im willing to bet telltate spends more money on acquiring the licenses for properties like game of thrones than they actually spend on making the game lol.
Given he said he wouldn’t be surprised if the budget approached that amount, it sounded to me like a guess rather than any kind of authoritative figure - the point was that budgets for high-profile new adventure games were a lot bigger back then, and the shape of the market was a lot different.
You might be right about the division of Telltale’s budget - they have been using the same engine for a while now. They do seem to put a lot of work into getting the art style and voice acting right too, though - I don’t know how much of the budget would go into that.
just playing telltale games I can see them reusing the same art assets from game to game, with better shading. its getting kind of sad its time for a major overhaul of the engine in my opinion.
adventure games as a whole have been for close to two decades the cheapest games to make as a genre. shooting, racing, and action/adventure games all could balloon close to or over 100 million dollars to produce. case in pt metal gear solid 5 was over a 100 million dollars to make, that was the whole reason the publisher konami made fans pay for a glorified demo with ground zeroes to recoup some of the money they lost.As a side note I dont see many mid tier games being made anymore, they are either the ultra expensive blockbusters like COD, battlefield, and uncharted or very small/indie games. the days of games like beyond good and evil being produced are probably long gone bc to make a game like that you need more than 1 to 3 million; you are probably looking around 20 to 30 millionto produce that game and publishers dont like taking those type of risk anymore without a guarantee on returns. that is why we are on call of duty 108 and halo 46 lol bc the publisher knows they will recoup their investment and turn a profit.
Not to mention AG fans are only hardcover on paper, many of users here even go for sale promotions, leave games for later time, playing years later even, thats your core AG pnc attitude, that doesnt fulfill Devs labor of love, as love becomes one sided.
Yet they even fail to gather enough money for many KSs.
And AG KS are themselves are aimed for niche.Thats why the other market is necessary, and that market is full of gamers getting quality experiences in other genres.
So your point is right.
AG games are easiest to program too, ofcourse TTG are just cutscene makers.
Rest have no AI or enemies to code for.
Even some NPCs in Witcher3 or Skyrim has more complex routines and dialogues.
Where AGs stick to linear most, simple scripted experience
By and large.
You can summon Rats to launch on guards, attach mine on rats to kill them, or possess one of the rats and run away while guards are distracted by other bunch, thats 3 ways to deal with in Dishonored, to solve puzzle of getting on other side using just one power.
The emergent coding behavior allows the narration, your story of dealing with situation.
Emergent behavior , badass coding.
How many times we see them in AGs?
We just use scripted inventory puzzles in linear fashion.
Customers attitude shape the market, if customers had been super positive, AG genre would have been back already like before(not saying its back).
Reusing same engine make sense if customers buying their shit, heck i say their price point is cheap enough to justify cheap engine.
Get season pass for 15$ in middle of season for 5 eps. Thats good enough.
exactly pnc is my favorite genre but they are by far one of the cheapest to produce, all the fun and excitement comes from story, characters, dialogue, and these days to a lesser extent puzzles, with very little to do with actual gameplay. in fact when devs try to include some real gameplay (besides just point and click) a lot of hardcore adventure fans hate it; case in pt full throttle or even the new kings quest game, the quick time events were very simple and some even hated that as well. thats why so many adventure games are made by extremely small teams or even just one person bc it really just takes a dev with a good story to tell. even modern day adventures with up to date graphics are made by small teams, take a game like “the book of unwritten tales”, it was made I think by just one person and its done in the more up to date/modern art style with a lot better graphics than say a retro wadjet eye game, and still was produced on a shoe string budget
Which genre label a game should get has nothing to do with how big or small the budget should be to get it done properly or how complicated it is to make. Which tasks have the highest degree of difficulty during development obviously varies between different games (sometimes even if they belong in the same genre). Bigger budget means bigger team and more time. That does in no way mean that the game will automaticly be better but it sure helps regardless of what type of game it is.
im not quite sure what exactly you are trying to say but if you think creating and coding a pnc adventure game is as hard as coding and creating whole worlds such as the witcher or metal gear solid than that is crazy talk. there is more variables and coding in one level of metal gear solid 5 than a lot of whole adventure games
as far as budget goes it has everything to do with genre. a company like EA is not going to invest millions of dollars into a genre that doesnt have the fan base to support their investment. so they will never spend 50 million to do a pnc adventure game bc they would lose money.
what you do get is hybrids like a heavy rain or an LA Noir which I have always said is an adventure game with grand theft auto gameplay mixed in for good measure
The African Voodoo religion, Ludwig II of Bavaria with Wagners lost opera, religious mystery at Rennes-le-Château… what’s next? I’m not convinced that TTG could pull of an equally fascinating subject on their own. Their lack of puzzles is the least of my concerns.
Voodoo, werewolves, and vampires, and magic. Hardly fascinating. JJ is mistress of the cliché.
Cliché or not, she is a good writer. It has passed my mind that it is possible she is tired of the supernatural elements that gamers tend to expect. Gray Matter and Moebius were toned down from GK in that aspect and more realistic, focusing more on science, characters and relationships. And now she’s writing romance novels. I would buy a game from her that is purely romance or drama - but I don’t think many others would. How many adventure games can you think of that have nothing supernatural? How many successful ones? It may be she has lost interest in that.
The African Voodoo religion, Ludwig II of Bavaria with Wagners lost opera, religious mystery at Rennes-le-Château… what’s next? I’m not convinced that TTG could pull of an equally fascinating subject on their own. Their lack of puzzles is the least of my concerns.
Voodoo, werewolves, and vampires, and magic. Hardly fascinating. JJ is mistress of the cliché.
Cliche or not, she is a good writer. It has passed my mind that it is possible she is tired of the supernatural elements that gamers tend to expect. Gray Matter and Moebius were toned down from GK in that aspect and more realistic, focusing more on science, characters and relationships. And now she’s writing romance novels. I would buy a game from her that is purely romance or drama - but I don’t think many others would. How many adventure games can you think of that have nothing supernatural? How many successful ones? It may be she has lost interest in that.
I would also buy that I love a good mystery that is grounded in reality
Which genre label a game should get has nothing to do with how big or small the budget should be to get it done properly or how complicated it is to make. Which tasks have the highest degree of difficulty during development obviously varies between different games (sometimes even if they belong in the same genre). Bigger budget means bigger team and more time. That does in no way mean that the game will automaticly be better but it sure helps regardless of what type of game it is.
im not quite sure what exactly you are trying to say but if you think creating and coding a pnc adventure game is as hard as coding and creating whole worlds such as the witcher or metal gear solid than that is crazy talk. there is more variables and coding in one level of metal gear solid 5 than a lot of whole adventure games
as far as budget goes it has everything to do with genre. a company like EA is not going to invest millions of dollars into a genre that doesnt have the fan base to support their investment. so they will never spend 50 million to do a pnc adventure game bc they would lose money.
what you do get is hybrids like a heavy rain or an LA Noir which I have always said is an adventure game with grand theft auto gameplay mixed in for good measure
The Witcher and Metal Gear Solid games belongs in different game genres (catch my drift?). If you would replace combats with puzzles would these games automaticly be incredibly easier to make? I agree that the general rule is that adventure games are easier to program and harder to design but that doesn’t apply to all games.
NP: A Link Between Worlds, Beneath a Steel Sky and Vampyr
first you say genre labels dont matter than you say they do so nope dont catch your drift, and designing a puzzle is a lot easier than making sure npc AI and enemy AI behave and act at least in a semi realistic manner
first you say genre labels dont matter than you say they do so nope dont catch your drift, and designing a puzzle is a lot easier than making sure npc AI and enemy AI behave and act at least in a semi realistic manner
What? A puzzle can involve AI too. My point is that it’s to much generalisation in this thread. 
NP: A Link Between Worlds, Beneath a Steel Sky and Vampyr
first you say genre labels dont matter than you say they do so nope dont catch your drift, and designing a puzzle is a lot easier than making sure npc AI and enemy AI behave and act at least in a semi realistic manner
I doubt that. The Witcher 3 took four years to make, The Witness took nine.
first you say genre labels dont matter than you say they do so nope dont catch your drift, and designing a puzzle is a lot easier than making sure npc AI and enemy AI behave and act at least in a semi realistic manner
I doubt that. The Witcher 3 took four years to make, The Witness took nine.
Huh, not same team size bro, Witness was made by one genius mind supported by some others, witcher would have taken 30 yrs for Jblow to conceive.
first you say genre labels dont matter than you say they do so nope dont catch your drift, and designing a puzzle is a lot easier than making sure npc AI and enemy AI behave and act at least in a semi realistic manner
What? A puzzle can involve AI too. My point is that it’s to much generalisation in this thread.
List games with those AI based puzzles or npcs, i want to play those AGs.
first you say genre labels dont matter than you say they do so nope dont catch your drift, and designing a puzzle is a lot easier than making sure npc AI and enemy AI behave and act at least in a semi realistic manner
I doubt that. The Witcher 3 took four years to make, The Witness took nine.
Huh, not same team size bro, Witness was made by one genius mind supported by some others, witcher would have taken 30 yrs for Jblow to conceive.
exactly let the witcher team make a pnc adventure game they could knock one out the park in a yr or less bc they have the man power and also the creative know how to do it. that team put together a fully lived in world that was on par with anythin jane jensen ever did with gabriel knight as far as world building goes and thats no disrespect to jane its just true. but on the opposite end we would be waiting 60 yrs for Jblow to make the witcher 4 bc he would have to learn some very complex programming skills, and ps by the way I hate the witness thought it was a very poor follow up to braid.
I don’t feel like getting involved in most of this discussion, but I did feel I should correct this—
take a game like “the book of unwritten tales”, it was made I think by just one person
BOUT was not made by one person, rather by a small- to mid-sized development team—
List games with those AI based puzzles or npcs, i want to play those AGs.
Text adventures is your new favourite genre. 
NP: A Link Between Worlds, Beneath a Steel Sky and Vampyr
List games with those AI based puzzles or npcs, i want to play those AGs.
Text adventures is your new favourite genre.
Yes, and 7th Guest and any game like it where you go up against an opponent in a puzzle.
Didn’t Lure of the Tempress have quite a bit of AI based gameplay? The people wandered all around the city and you could Ask them to do stuff as well.
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