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Black Dahlia desperately needs a new ending
I still think recommending going to search for an obviously pirated version of the game is somewhat dubious.
I’m not even sure that’s a valid remark since both Jabod and Gatekeeper have stated they have the original BD disks. As do I, BTW.
I think one of the problems that exists, and it exists with a lot of games that are classified as “abandonware” is “Where do you send the check?” I think that both GOG and Steam would be delighted to have BD in their respective catalogs. Except their business model expects to pay a license fee. Well and good, but where do you send the check?
So people are left to their own devices. Jabod has apparently found a way to get the game to run on a Win98SE machine. Me? I don’t have the temperament to set up a VM on either my current HD or on an external HD for the sole purpose of playing a single game. No matter how much I want to play it again.
It is one of the best adventure games of all time tho, imho.
I agree! FWIW if you look in the Walkthrough library you will find a BD WT from back in the days when walkthroughs were actually written rather than produced via screen capture. The walkthrough dates back to the CompuServe TAG/GAMERS forum. A good friend, Olga Karkalas did the main writing. Another friend, Janet Blackburn did the de-coding that gave all the puzzle shortcuts, should you need them. Hercules, a sysop, or what is called an Administrator here, and I did all the editing and I provided direction for whatever graphics could be created using MS Word, which were limited at the time.
For whom the games toll,
they toll for thee.
I still think recommending going to search for an obviously pirated version of the game is somewhat dubious.
It is one of the best adventure games of all time tho, imho.
I can reasonably argue that it isn’t a “pirated” version. The creator has the original discs and has developed a method of creating a “shell”, if you will, that allows you to play the game on modern machines.
Now. I own the discs so if I was as technically as capable I could do the same but, sadly, that level of technical ability is light years above me. However, if I could do it, would it be illegal? Absolutely not as all I was doing was getting something that I paid for and own to work as it was created to do.
So for all the people that own the original discs I see no problem whatsoever, at least here in the UK.
As to non disc owners then we enter into a grey area which is why abandonware projects are a no-go to being pointed to here. If, in this particular instance, the game was being sold then I would say that’s wrong as the original IP owner would be getting nothing regardless of how difficult getting any monies to them (see Tim’s response as well on this) but as it’s being made available for free then I’m of the view that if it allows others to play what is a truly great, if slightly flawed, game then I’m all for it. Who knows, the original IP holder might raise their head over the parapet and an arrangement between themselves, the creator of this project and, say, Steam, Gog, Itch, and it’s available to all and sundry.
Life is what it is.
Jabod has apparently found a way to get the game to run on a Win98SE machine. Me? I don’t have the temperament to set up a VM on either my current HD or on an external HD for the sole purpose of playing a single game. No matter how much I want to play it again.
Sorry Tim, but you’re wrong there 
It’s now running on a 64bit, Windows 10 PC with 32GB RAM, an I7 processor with twin graphics cards running under SLI. It’s not the most modern of PCs granted as it’s around 8 years old but it’s way above a 98SE machine.
So, if you decide to have a go at searching for the download and waiting a couple of hours to get it then you too could be playing Black Dahlia again 
Life is what it is.
I think one of the problems that exists, and it exists with a lot of games that are classified as “abandonware” is “Where do you send the check?” I think that both GOG and Steam would be delighted to have BD in their respective catalogs. Except their business model expects to pay a license fee. Well and good, but where do you send the check?
That’s a good question, but it’s not limited to abandonware copies of the game.
If you buy a used disc copy, then you are legally covered as you have a legit copy of the game then, but the developers and/or current copyright holders won’t make a cent from that.
So often with games that are not in digital distribution the question comes down to three options, all somewhat bad:
1) You download an “abandonware” copy and technically speaking violate copyright laws
2) You buy a pre-owned copy which is legal, but only benefits some guy selling it on eBay or where ever
3) You choose not to play the game at all, and never get to experience whatever the developers wanted you to experience.
One person may choose one way, another will choose another way.
Of course, if you happen to own the disc version originally, and the goal is to find an easy way to get it running, then the question changes a bit, then it’s basically a choice between 1 and 3.
About contacting developers and copyright holders, there are some cases where fans of some games have done that. There are few cases where they helped make connections between whoever owns the game and GOG, and GOG then re-released those games digitally.
I completely forget now which games those were, but it has happened.
Many of GOG re-releases are actually somehow fan-based, including the recently infamous Blade Runner. And GOG has even used some pirate assets in their releases, like DRM cracks and translations from pirate releases.
So there often is interest to bring back games, if someone is willing to do the work for them, like contacting the right people or doing the technical compatibility stuff.
I still think recommending going to search for an obviously pirated version of the game is somewhat dubious.
No one is actively recommending it, but if you are willing to play some older games, that is often the only option.
There is a difference between pirates and “genuine abandonware” though.
Pirates even compete about who can crack the latest games first, whereas abandonware sites simply try to keep older material available. Many of them even try to operate semi-legally, like removing games which come available legally.
If you ever visit a “responsible abandonware site”, if such a term exists, they have games which are not available anywhere legally, but they also have other older games listed, with links to stores that sell them. “This game is now available on this store” and something like that.
In fact, at least one major abandonware site has GOG ads all over.
The obvious problem is to find out which sites are trying to preserve digital culture, and which are simply scams.
And in some cases there are ways to give some money to people who created the games. One of the most famous ones is Al Lowe’s tip jar:
http://allowe.com/more/tipjar.html
Obviously that’s a bit problematic, as he has never owned the games he has created, so tipping him is not actually benefitting those who legally own things, but at least it’s a way to do something.
Of course, all but two Al Lowe games are legally available somewhere, at least on GOG.
I still think recommending going to search for an obviously pirated version of the game is somewhat dubious.
It is one of the best adventure games of all time tho, imho.
I can reasonably argue that it isn’t a “pirated” version. The creator has the original discs and has developed a method of creating a “shell”, if you will, that allows you to play the game on modern machines.
Now. I own the discs so if I was as technically as capable I could do the same but, sadly, that level of technical ability is light years above me. However, if I could do it, would it be illegal? Absolutely not as all I was doing was getting something that I paid for and own to work as it was created to do.
So for all the people that own the original discs I see no problem whatsoever, at least here in the UK.As to non disc owners then we enter into a grey area which is why abandonware projects are a no-go to being pointed to here. If, in this particular instance, the game was being sold then I would say that’s wrong as the original IP owner would be getting nothing regardless of how difficult getting any monies to them (see Tim’s response as well on this) but as it’s being made available for free then I’m of the view that if it allows others to play what is a truly great, if slightly flawed, game then I’m all for it. Who knows, the original IP holder might raise their head over the parapet and an arrangement between themselves, the creator of this project and, say, Steam, Gog, Itch, and it’s available to all and sundry.
The copyright holders are Take-Two Interactive. And they are not exactly known for their generosity. Legally, there is no such thing as abandonware.
You can argue the morality of it all day long, and I might even agree with some of your points, but at the end of the day, it is a legal question, not a moral one. I own two copies of Black Dahlia (and Ripper), and I am legally allowed to make backup copies of those. The problems start when I try to distribute those backups. It is not a grey area. It is piracy. And while I have nothing personal against pirates, it is still piracy.
The VM the distributor has “created” (in reality it is just PCEm, he has not created anything) could easily be distributed without the iso-files containing the actual game. You could then have created backups from your own discs and used those with the preconfigured emulator. Not having the technical knowledge to set up a virtual machine on your own does not really justify anything.
And it is safe to say that most of the people who will download games from that site do not own an original copy, nor does most of the readers of your post on this site. I did not even need to google to know what site you were talking about. I hope Take_two releases these fabulous games again one day, but in the meantime, anything you can download from the internet containing the game files is piracy.
Piracy is a sketchy term. Another term that might be used in its place is profiteering. Both terms assume you are taking something of value from its rightful owner and profiting from the sale of that property.
In this particular case the creator of the “shell” that allows the game to play on current machines hasn’t stolen anything. He/she has used his/her own intellectual prowess to modify a game, a physical copy of which he/she already owns, to run on his/her modern computer. So far, all is legit.
Now this person offers to share the results of his/her expertise with a larger audience. I don’t know what the though process was. Perhaps the person said “I loved this game, and put a lot of effort into getting it to run on my Win10. Shouldn’t others be able to play it again too?”
Is this person charging money for this knowledge? No! So he/she is certainly not stealing revenue from Take2. Which over the course of the last 25 years has had the opportunity to update the game, and sell those updates, but has chosen not to do so.
My only suggestion to the person making this “shell” available for free is to make use of the shell available only to those that can prove ownership of the original disk set. I.e. Insert disc1 into disc drive when starting setup. If that were to happen I think it would remove all legality questions.
For whom the games toll,
they toll for thee.
As long as the game files are distributed in any way or form, it’s still piracy. The VM can be distributed without the game files.
The VM can be distributed without the game files.
Would you be so gracious as to do this please?
Life is what it is.
The VM can be distributed without the game files.
Would you be so gracious as to do this please?
Why? I use VMWare to play BD and Ripper, not PCEm.
The VM can be distributed without the game files.
Would you be so gracious as to do this please?
Why? I use VMWare to play BD and Ripper, not PCEm.
In which case would you be so kind as to post how you’ve got it going within the thread in Hints & tech Support please. I expect a number of people will be rather grateful to be able to share your expertise.
Life is what it is.
.
Heh. I think you would be better off asking the person who distributed the PCEm version in the first place, since PCEm is free, and I really have no interest in distributing game installers on the net.
But sure, here’s the gist of it;
Thank you. I’ve copied into the relevant thread in Hints & Tech Support forum so any follow ups should appear there.
Life is what it is.
Too complex for me. Even with the detailed instructions. It will be either GOG or Steam or I will never play the game again. Shame.
For whom the games toll,
they toll for thee.
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