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The Top 100 - what changes would you make?
Are we doing this thing or what? It got awfully quiet in here.
I’ll get a voting thread up and running later today. It’s nearly 3:00 AM here in New Jersey, and I’ve got to get some sleep first.
“Rainy days should be spent at home with a cup of tea and a good book.” -Bill Watterson
I’ll get a voting thread up and running later today. It’s nearly 3:00 AM here in New Jersey, and I’ve got to get some sleep first.
you rock. 
Who knew our Lady K was such a party animal?
AKA Charo
I wish, Charo! 
“Rainy days should be spent at home with a cup of tea and a good book.” -Bill Watterson
A few of the lists from other users in the voting thread got me thinking.
Some games I enjoyed immensely but I wouldn’t necessarily think of as top 100 material. Is there a difference between the subjective enjoyment of a game and objectively ranking it? Or is “I enjoyed this a lot” an indication that it should automatically be considered in my “best of” list?
AKA Charo
that’s a good one.
I take this approach: I’m not unique, what I enjoy/appreciate (and the reverse) will ring true for someone else.
Even then: I genuinely love elements of the first Kyrandia game, but I also see it as structurally lacking. It’s something I might recommend if you want to experience the atmosphere and world building of Kyrandia. The soundtrack is amazing. But in a way it kind of fakes being an adventure game. Baron Blubba has explained it the best.
There are situations where a recommendation of Kyrandia is appropriate; as an adventure game, though, I don’t think it represents the genre well.
edit: not to suggest the fist Kyrandia game is objectively bad and it shouldn’t be on the list - I get what is there to like and there might be stuff there I didn’t consider or appreciate as much as someone else.
On the other side of that are games that I think are well-designed, but that didn’t strike any particular chord with me. There are a lot and it takes some mental flexing to come up with a system of determination. There are good games I haven’t mentioned and games that someone else wouldn’t even find worth considering for the list.
I don’t think it’s possible to come up with enough objective factors to include this or that game in a top. Does Loom deserve to be included? It’s a game with a unique premise and gameplay, but it’s also very short and easy. Myst? The most popular adventure that changed the gaming landscape, but also hated by many purists for its lack of interaction, gameplay and “bad influence” on the genre. I also noticed many people who listed Monkey Island 1 and 3 skipped No2 which is considered to be one of the best games by others (including Adventuregamers).
Blubba couldn’t stand Kyrandia, and for good reasons which he well documented, yet I can’t help but think how inferior all the King’s Quest games (except for No6) are in comparison - which Blubba loves apparently 
Do they represent the genre well? I don’t know. In fact I grew up playing SCI remakes and other point-n-click adventures and still find it hard to get into AGI games because of the many objective obstacles, for me at least. With all my love for Sierra I’d rather replay Kyrandia which, despite all the wtf moments, is so full of magic and obsession with its unique fantasy world rather than well-known fairy tales or sci-fi parodies that I never think how stupid it is to collect random gems to solve random puzzles or navigate a maze. There’s nothing like Kyrandias.
That said, my top is definitely very subjective, with all games having a special place in my heart for different reasons, not necessarily ideal entertainment for everyone, but enjoyable and replayble by me. I’ve been replaying U.F.O.s, for example, once in 5 years since 1998, but while it’s probably a much inferior cartoon game compared to Toonstruck, with all its scope, tons of quality 2D animation and Christopher Lloyd, nothing will ever make me replay the latter, I just don’t like everything else about it. That’s certainly subjective, but there’s no way around it.
PC means personal computer
A few of the lists from other users in the voting thread got me thinking.
Some games I enjoyed immensely but I wouldn’t necessarily think of as top 100 material. Is there a difference between the subjective enjoyment of a game and objectively ranking it? Or is “I enjoyed this a lot” an indication that it should automatically be considered in my “best of” list?
Most top whatever games are subjective by nature. There are games that garner amazing reviews but that I don’t enjoy for some reason and vice versa, so I feel that it would be pandering to the crowd and not my personal opinion if I include them on the list.
A few of the lists from other users in the voting thread got me thinking.
Some games I enjoyed immensely but I wouldn’t necessarily think of as top 100 material. Is there a difference between the subjective enjoyment of a game and objectively ranking it? Or is “I enjoyed this a lot” an indication that it should automatically be considered in my “best of” list?
Most top whatever games are subjective by nature. There are games that garner amazing reviews but that I don’t enjoy for some reason and vice versa, so I feel that it would be pandering to the crowd and not my personal opinion if I include them on the list.
I don’t think it needs to be pandering. I didn’t enjoy The Last Express all that much (at least compared with others I’ve heard talk about it) but the story was great, graphics were very impressive, the characterization and voice acting were excellent, the time mechanics were wonderfully implemented and it was very innovative for its time and . Thus it scores a place on my top 100.
I also recognize that we play games in certain moods and times in our life when we might be either overevaluating a game or underevaluating it. Being cognizant of such a fact means considering whether a game we hugely enjoyed deserves a high place in our personal ranking, or vice versa.
AKA Charo
A few of the lists from other users in the voting thread got me thinking.
Some games I enjoyed immensely but I wouldn’t necessarily think of as top 100 material. Is there a difference between the subjective enjoyment of a game and objectively ranking it? Or is “I enjoyed this a lot” an indication that it should automatically be considered in my “best of” list?
Most top whatever games are subjective by nature. There are games that garner amazing reviews but that I don’t enjoy for some reason and vice versa, so I feel that it would be pandering to the crowd and not my personal opinion if I include them on the list.
I don’t think it needs to be pandering. I didn’t enjoy The Last Express all that much (at least compared with others I’ve heard talk about it) but the story was great, graphics were very impressive, the characterization and voice acting were excellent, the time mechanics were wonderfully implemented and it was very innovative for its time and . Thus it scores a place on my top 100.
I also recognize that we play games in certain moods and times in our life when we might be either overevaluating a game or underevaluating it. Being cognizant of such a fact means considering whether a game we hugely enjoyed deserves a high place in our personal ranking, or vice versa.
You bring up some really good points that I haven’t thought about. The first aspect is whether the game was innovative when it was first released or not. I guess you have to be upfront in your list of what your criteria for “best” are. Should innovation be considered an aspect in whether the game makes the list? Let’s say a game introduces a new feature(for example a new interface for interaction like SCUMM). For it’s time, that was incredible, but many games have adopted it or even improved on it. Should I consider that as a criteria? Should the first text adventure ever made be considered because it arguably created the genre?
Also the moods thing is very true and I have experienced that first hand. I guess how I look at it, we can’t help but be influenced by our mood when we play a game. But if our mood was bad, I don’t think looking at other people’s opinions should factor in. Maybe another approach would be to retry the game at a later time when we are feeling happier to give the game a fairer assessment.
Gatekeeper, to not be ignorant to what i said before about KQ3, i have watched some speedrun vids (which i haven’t ever before) and i found out that the players have to adjust the speed of the character; up a little, then down slow again, back and forth all the time, so it is possible, and not to how i imagined it being played on high-speed all through
The definition of ‘best’ in contexts like these is so hard to pin down that I try to refer to my lists as ‘my favorite…’ instead of ‘the best’ or ‘the top’.
‘Most influential’ is interesting for academic, conversational, and food for thought purposes, but many games on such a list will not be helpful to folks who are looking for games which are relatively enjoyable today.
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i dont think it is about ‘being helpful’, it is more about the taste of this community for the top 100, that must be enough
The definition of ‘best’ in contexts like these is so hard to pin down that I try to refer to my lists as ‘my favorite…’ instead of ‘the best’ or ‘the top’.
‘Most influential’ is interesting for academic, conversational, and food for thought purposes, but many games on such a list will not be helpful to folks who are looking for games which are relatively enjoyable today.
But who are we to decide what folks want from a game? Maybe it’s not enjoyment. Or more specifically, maybe it’s not enjoyment in the same way we might enjoy a game.
AKA Charo
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