[Dasilva]

Originally Posted by pinkgothic

As a bi woman, let me tell you - women are weird.

I've been told Bi people are just greedy. lol.

[LeisureSuitedLooney]

Okay, okay, we need to get back to the REAL issue here...


Leis needs a date! Ladies, any takers?

(sound of crickets chirping)

(taps microphone) Hello? Is this thing on?

[Squinky]

Originally Posted by Wormsie

Well, at least it makes me glad that in my relationships I can think of my partner (who is male) as a person, rather than see him as a representative of a gender stereotype. But rest assured, I've ahd my share of problems as well...

Pardon me for asking, but wouldn't you say that implying that all people in heterosexual relationships see their partners as representative of a gender stereotype is a bit of a... stereotype? Just wondering.

[Jelena]

Originally Posted by pinkgothic

As a bi woman, let me tell you - women are weird.

I blame the hormones. I do get weird once a month.




At full moon.

[Jeysie]

Originally Posted by Jat316sob

As a man, I can relate to other men, which provides a lot of common ground for building a relationship on.

Maybe straight people enjoy the gender differences, but it does seem to make things more difficult for them.

Actually, the reason why I love men so much is because I can relate to them much better than women. I've always generally felt more at ease around my male friends than my female ones. *shrugs*

So, even though I might well have better luck trying to date women, I just find myself uninterested. (Yeah, I know, there's something kind of bizarre about a woman that can't understand her own gender...)

Even if I can't figure out why I can't find a guy who's both attracted to me and enjoys being around me (I can find men who are one or the other...) Then again, I don't always understand why many of my female friends are attracted to the men they are, either. Romance in general is something a logical mind can't ever hope to understand.

Peace & Luv, Liz

[Jelena]

Originally Posted by Jeysie

Romance in general is something a logical mind can't ever hope to understand.

I believe it's the chemistry that dictates parts of the romace. It sure isn't logic.

[RLacey]

What consistently amazes me is that, in a world of billions of people, a large percentage of people find and end up in successful relationships. Yes, a lot of that can probably be attributed to scientific reasons and such, but it's still rather impressive when you think about it.

[Jelena]

Originally Posted by RLacey

What consistently amazes me is that, in a world of billions of people, a large percentage of people find and end up in successful relationships. Yes, a lot of that can probably be attributed to scientific reasons and such, but it's still rather impressive when you think about it.

I think it has to be emphasized that a successfull long-term relationship is not only a dance on roses. Those that give up the minute the passion and infatuation is gone never understood the for better, for worse-thing.
I'm not saying that you should stay in a bad relationship if it really is bad for you, but no relationship/marriage is all easy. It's give and take all the way.
I've heard that about 50% of all marriages in the US end up in divorce. (Not sure at all if it's true) I know that's the case in parts of Sweden anyway.

[Jeysie]

Originally Posted by Jelena

I believe it's the chemistry that dictates parts of the romace. It sure isn't logic.

Ah, but, for me it is. Or at least, I can place a logical reason for my own romantic tendencies. I'm attracted to people who are similar to me in personality and interests, and are, generally, the type of person I'd also want to be friends with. I also recognize that certain personality traits are, no matter how "sexy", not condusive to a healthy relationship (and that trying to "change" a guy is, generally, a futile prospect).

Furthermore, I find the "mind games" types of flirting bizarre and stupid. I mean, if somebody's busy playing hard-to-get, teasing me, or playing "maybe I will, maybe I won't", I'm not going to be more attracted to them, I'm going to either get fed up or assume they're not interested, and give up. It puzzles me that this is a successful gambit to other people.

I prefer to be straightforward and practical. (After all, the fun part is the relationship itself, not the waste of time tiptoeing around when you both like each other anyway...)

Peace & Luv, Liz

[LeisureSuitedLooney]

Originally Posted by Jeysie

(After all, the fun part is the relationship itself, not the waste of time tiptoeing around when you both like each other anyway...)

Agreed! Life is too short for hemming 'n hawing, too many opportunities are lost that way.

[pinkgothic]

Originally Posted by Dasilva

I've been told Bi people are just greedy. lol.

Well - I am. I always take what I want. Matter of factly, that's not very much, though, so I seem normal enough.

[pinkgothic]

Originally Posted by Jelena

I think it has to be emphasized that a successfull long-term relationship is not only a dance on roses. [...]

Very well said. My mother likes to say, "The nature of arguments had spells success or demise for a relationship".

Of course, if we went by that, BoyToy and I would've probably split up long ago, given we're the worst arguers ever (we're both very insistant and passionate about our beliefs and easily get pissy when we're not gently told we're being stupid about something), but then, we're also both incapable of holding grudges. I know, trust me, I've tried.

...hm, what was my point again?

[pinkgothic]

Originally Posted by Jeysie

(After all, the fun part is the relationship itself, not the waste of time tiptoeing around when you both like each other anyway...)

... I strongly disagree.

For one, a relationship doesn't start when you "get together" - you're in a relationship with everyone you communicate with, and it's in your power to change that relationship for better or worse. Flirting is part of the relationship you have with a person - which includes "mind games". Don't you and your friends play games occasionally? There's a reason it's called "mind games" - it's a form of playing with each other. Like playful jokes make you smile, what's there to say about playful actions not elicting a smile?

I gather you don't like it - that's your preference - but please don't claim that what happens before dating is generally a waste of time. It's as enriching as you allow it to be.

[Melanie68]

It's always amazing to hear how people meet and finally end up together. The stories are always so different. One couple I knew were lab partners in a college science course and she hated from the get go but as they kept working together.... now they're married and have a kid.

[Jeysie]

Originally Posted by pinkgothic

For one, a relationship doesn't start when you "get together" - you're in a relationship with everyone you communicate with, and it's in your power to change that relationship for better or worse.

There's different levels of a relationship, however. Acquaintances, friends, close friends, girl/boyfriend, spouse, etc.

If I like someone, and they like me, and we both think it could work, I'd rather just move on to the girl/boyfriend part than waste time dancing around each other awkwardly because it's "moving too fast" or "ruins the excitement" or any similar excuse.

Originally Posted by pinkgothic

Flirting is part of the relationship you have with a person - which includes "mind games". Don't you and your friends play games occasionally? There's a reason it's called "mind games" - it's a form of playing with each other. Like playful jokes make you smile, what's there to say about playful actions not elicting a smile?

There's a big difference between two people who already know how each *really* feels about the other joking around, and two people flirting to get to know each other who are messing with each other's minds and not letting on how they really feel. The former I find fun, yes. The latter I find frustrating and don't understand why people seem to like it.

You always hear all this advice about "playing hard-to-get" and the power of being "mysterious", when to me someone who's mysterious, misleading, and/or hard to get a read on is usually a big turn off for me. Then again, that's probably part of why I'm hopelessly single (which kind of fuels my annoyance).

To me, the "fact-finding" part of any aspect of life I usually find a necessary evil at best and I'd rather just get it overwith expediently. It's finding the best way to put those facts and information to use that I enjoy.

Peace & Luv, Liz

[bulldog]

Originally Posted by RLacey

What consistently amazes me is that, in a world of billions of people, a large percentage of people find and end up in successful relationships. Yes, a lot of that can probably be attributed to scientific reasons and such, but it's still rather impressive when you think about it.

I read something one time that said people are attracted to each other by their body smell... I know that kind’ a gross but a study done a few years ago says other wise. It all pheromones. I also agree with Jeysie, in the part of she gets along with guys better. I have always felt more comfortable around guys then girls and when I am around girls there seems like a lot tension in the air, even if we are good friends.

[Jelena]

Originally Posted by pinkgothic

Of course, if we went by that, BoyToy and I would've probably split up long ago, given we're the worst arguers ever (we're both very insistant and passionate about our beliefs and easily get pissy when we're not gently told we're being stupid about something), but then, we're also both incapable of holding grudges. I know, trust me, I've tried.

I believe that it's far worse to never argue passionatley. I actually wouldn't be in my marriage if we never argued, it would scare me. That would make me feel like the relationship isn't solid enough for a heated debate. I don't like personal insults and name calling though. It serves no purpose other than hurting someone and if I'm subjected to it I get terribly upset.

[LeisureSuitedLooney]

Originally Posted by Jeysie

someone who's mysterious, misleading, and/or hard to get a read on is usually a big turn off

That's the hardest part for me: trying to "read"people. I'm terrible at it. I often take on friendships and relationships that turn out to be situations where I find out I'm being made fun of or used in some way. I even had a best friend who, every autumn, like clockwork, would play "mind games" with his circle of friends, purely to manipulate their emotions and be entertained by the attention it got him. After about the 3rd time, seeing it happen at the same time each year, I refused to have anything more to do with him, and others followed suit. But that was a 3 year friendship, so, yeah, I'm VERY bad at reading people, until the damage has been done.

Or, in the other example that comes to mind, the woman I was engaged to who was with me to just "get married" by a certain age, with no real intention of ever having more than a superficial relationship. She was married less than a month after we parted ways...and she was miserable. So, yeah...I'm NOT good at reading people, lol. I'd make a lousy FBI profiler!

[pinkgothic]

Originally Posted by Jeysie

If I like someone, and they like me, and we both think it could work, I'd rather just move on to the girl/boyfriend part than waste time dancing around each other awkwardly because it's "moving too fast" or "ruins the excitement" or any similar excuse.

'Ruins the excitement' isn't an "excuse". It shouldn't stop anyone, of course, but I'd sure be disappointed if someone told me my flirting/playing is just an excuse not to get a relationship started. Actually, I'd probably not pick up a relationship with them at all, heh.

Originally Posted by Jeysie

You always hear all this advice about "playing hard-to-get" and the power of being "mysterious", when to me someone who's mysterious, misleading, and/or hard to get a read on is usually a big turn off for me.

Bold by me. That has nothing to do with mind games, IMO - there's nothing game-y about it if you're keeping your real feelings impossible to read. The rest is great fun.

I had a discussion with someone on IRC about this yesterday after posting - I figured that, in the end, it boils down to being one of those things a part of wanting to give your best for someone else. Confronted with a bit of a challenge, you get that oppurtunity handed to you in a gratis fashion.

[pinkgothic]

Originally Posted by Jelena

I believe that it's far worse to never argue passionatley. I actually wouldn't be in my marriage if we never argued, it would scare me. That would make me feel like the relationship isn't solid enough for a heated debate.

Agreed.

Originally Posted by Jelena

I don't like personal insults and name calling though.

That's where we fail. Occasionally, at any rate. You'd think by now we'd know we're mirror images of one another, but no, we have to (1) accuse the other person of being the problem, (2) offer a mirror if the recipient of such accusations. *chuckles*

I get terribly upset, too - but it passes very quickly. Usually, whenever I touch BoyToy (hands, shoulder, whatever), or vice versa, any irritation just falls away. Since I've noticed this, I've tried to avoid body-contact when I want to be pissy at him... but, well, even then, grudges are hard to hold (which is what I meant with trying).

Crazy, crazy stuff.