Adventure Gamers - Forums

chrissie - 12 April 2022 03:59 PM

But to get back to Sam - who or what is he? Who is Agent X? Any suggestions?

Well, I played with the idea that Sam is a traveler. The tarot readers might be wrong with their theories about them inhabiting the bodies, maybe there is no possession, only imitating? Or at least Sam could be another kind of traveler, traveler here being a general word for anything entering the “normal world” from some other dimension/time/whatever.

Have you played the final briefing a lot? It seems to be a test to pass for a human. I have completed it twice, first by saying I was human, then saying I was not but answering very humanely. This would definitely suggest that Sam is not a human. And the whole idea of passing as one is very close to the concept of travelers.

In several places the tarot readers imply that things might go different “now that Sam is here”. Either they just recognize him as an oddity, or maybe they were actually drawn towards this case because Sam was going to come and solve it. They already theorized about time travel and time flowing differently in other dimensions, why not throw in a kind of determinist time loop also: Sam was going to investigate, so Mercury led them there. Whatever was going to happen differently had Mercury not brought the tarot readers there, we will never now, because the causality loop has thrown that “initial setting” out.

So I do actually have this theory, that the traveler is Sam, and he was always going to go to August to ivestigate the other kind of invasive traveler fiddlings, no matter what the tarot readers do. Though when the killer is Rayne, the tarot readers are more tied to it and no longer just a sidenote. Still haven’t played the Rayne route.

One thing that contradicts this theory is Bronwyn’s ability to see auras or something like this while high on mescaline. She tells Lexie how travelers are missing the humane aura. I wonder what Sam’s aura looks like, it’s probably different as the tarot readers seem to consider him unlike “normal people”. Maybe those auraless travelers are just shapeshifters or other supernaturals that don’t pass the human test anymore. Or maybe Bronwyn was just stoned.

There’s material for all kinds of wild theories, and while not everything is coherent or fit together, it’s a fun package.

Really digging these theory discussions.

I want to respond to them after I finished the game for a second time.

I’m glad everyone enjoyed the game, I’ve really enjoyed reading your comments on the game.

Anyway, mods feel free to unhook this game. As usual, please continue to play and post your thoughts, good or bad.

I’ve played the game a second time. I correctly guessed the killer again - it was Zak this time around - but deliberately had someone else locked up.

Getting it right and going to the epilogue immediately felt rushed during my first run. While the additional sequence now was a good touch, it didn’t really feel any less like a rushed ending.
In fact, while I got some extra info during this playthrough and saw a bunch of different scenes, they didn’t really alleviate my issues with the game. Nor did they fill in all the remaining gaps in the story.

As the comments and theories above clearly show: a bit too much of this game has been left open to interpretation. Maybe fleshing a few things out more would’ve improved things. Are Sam and Agent X travelers themselves? Maybe travelers who try to stop the evil murdering travelers?
A bit more exposition wouldn’t have hurt, I feel…


So I’ve now also gone on to check all the different endings on YouTube but sadly none of them really made things more clear for me.
In fact, they just raise more questions.

For the first murder, it seems that whoever did it has no real recollection of the deed itself - they simply can’t remember. That seems to suggest that the traveler “takes over completely”. Yet when we lock up the wrong person and are confronted by the traveler, we get a very personal motive and reasoning, suggesting that the travelers “manipulate” the vessels but don’t possess them entirely. This contradicts the earlier killings...

All in all, this lessens the experience a little for me…

chrissie - 13 April 2022 12:29 PM

Vegetable Party - 13 April 2022 07:41 AM

Really digging these theory discussions. I want to respond to them after I finished the game for a second time.

I look forward to your thoughts VP!

I finally sat down for a second time speedrun. It was revelatory; this game is obviously based on 21st century international politics. The Tarot players are neo-con foreign policy wonks. Monroe is named after the doctrine. Zak is a rogue state. Sam (or S.A.M.) is a Secret Agent Model, which is not just a reference to the hero’s irresistible charm - it’s also a hint that we are, in fact, a unit produced by an intelligence agency to gather information on forces that might disrupt the balance of western hegemony.

...just kidding.

It’s a weird game though!

It looked good and interesting. I don’t think it was bad or distasteful, but the editing and gazy imagery were too heavy for me.

Did not catch the killer or vessel? the first time around.  A couple of lives ruined Didn’t die, was not let go or even demoted. A couple of people praised me for my hard work. makes me want to go back to my joke theory, for some reason.

I liked Violet. I don’t really know why, I thought she was cool. The Tarot group didn’t appeal to me. Zak was an over the top predatory type. There are at least two weird stereotypes going on but it was also a bit hard to watch for the sheer one-track character, just being creepy all the time.* I thought Poe was appropriately vain and ineffectual. Chief Dupont: really enjoyed the acting and the way the character fits the role. He was too lenient with my multitude of theories the first time around. That always spells trouble.

Monroe.. at some point I hoped she was the killer. Like some Hyde coming out at night, walking the streets, listening to Rippin Kittin and doing some straight up murder. In the end, Monroe asked SAM to please continue saving lives. Pretty dark! wait..

I’m not playing this game for a third time, because the more I think about it, the more I’ll fall into some rabbit hole of my own making

Maybe that is the lesson of the game. Be careful with what and who you give access to your mental space.

because some thingpeople are Travelers and you will end up in prison with a permanent record, for murder.

*I think the game suggested Zak was the type to read “The 48 Laws of Power” and “The Art of Seduction” and take the lessons to heart. Someone who’s not quite smart or emotionally developed enough to see the limitations of hedonistic “fulfillment” and playing zero-sum games, but clever enough to create a consistent world view and act on it. Not sure if it worked: it probably needed something to make him interesting, vulnerable or fun. If he’s read as just a symbol, things get problematic very fast.

I’d really like to discuss the SAM as a Traveler theory. Not sure if anyone’s still interested, but the first time I reached the ending, the game immediately became more interesting. Which is a bold move to pull of at the end of a game.

Is it possible that we, meaning the player and SAM are, in fact, the culprit? I think Chief Dupont is not in the loop. It struck me as odd that nearly all characters were eager to trust SAM, even though h/s/t/i was both a complete stranger and the most unethical character in the game, by design. I’m sure Zak would’ve loved our kind of power, maybe even Pope, so he could lead two lives of entitlement.

Another possibility would be SAM is part of an operation working against his particular Traveler. Maybe hunting humans for trophies is frowned upon in some alternative realm, occupied by people like us. We’re seeking out an antisocial operator that needs to be dealt with. I think this fits the particular questions at the end of the game.

Vegetable Party - 17 April 2022 05:19 AM

Another possibility would be SAM is part of an operation working against his particular Traveler. Maybe hunting humans for trophies is frowned upon in some alternative realm, occupied by people like us. We’re seeking out an antisocial operator that needs to be dealt with. I think this fits the particular questions at the end of the game.

This is actually what I think is going on.

The scene we get when we lock up the wrong person suggests that we are NOT the culprit.
But we (or at least Agent X) have some foreknowledge of travelers. At some point in the game we get the line by Agent X: “don’t confirm the existence of travelers just yet!” (or something similar at least - I’m paraphrasing from memory).

Which makes the above theory the most plausible one.

Especially since our secret debriefing - where we get something of a Voight-Kampff test to see if we can pass as human - is called “Debriefing 3204 *Birmingham*”. That seems to imply that Sam was involved somehow in the previous rite in Birmingham, which can further enhance the above theory. It’s even quite possible that whatever legal trouble Sam’s in - which Chief Dupont helps bury - is also related to Birmingham.

But this all could’ve used a bit more exposition. I feel like the screenwriters needed to pick an actual path to follow instead of leaving it all open to interpretation, imo…

Vegetable Party - 16 April 2022 07:33 PM

I finally sat down for a second time speedrun. It was revelatory; this game is obviously based on 21st century international politics. The Tarot players are neo-con foreign policy wonks. Monroe is named after the doctrine. Zak is a rogue state. Sam (or S.A.M.) is a Secret Agent Model, which is not just a reference to the hero’s irresistible charm - it’s also a hint that we are, in fact, a unit produced by an intelligence agency to gather information on forces that might disrupt the balance of western hegemony.

...just kidding.

Phew… Though in all honesty, why couldn’t one draw these kinds of conclusions with something as vague as this game?

TimovieMan - 17 April 2022 08:07 AM

Especially since our secret debriefing - where we get something of a Voight-Kampff test to see if we can pass as human - is called “Debriefing 3204 *Birmingham*”. That seems to imply that Sam was involved somehow in the previous rite in Birmingham, which can further enhance the above theory. It’s even quite possible that whatever legal trouble Sam’s in - which Chief Dupont helps bury - is also related to Birmingham.

I definitely think Sam is very possibly involved in several/all of these incidents, but I doubt Chief would have buried anything directly linked to Birmingham, because he would certainly lose trust in Sam if he was also involved in the same case the tarot readers were previously involved in. Most likely it would be a case even before that. It never really became clear who does Chief think Sam is. He knows it’s not the actual Sam but he doesn’t seem to be aware of the shapeshifting. So what does he actually think? Does the thing he’s burying relate to earlier persona of Sam, in which case it’s actually kind of dangerous to let anyone know the link between two cases. And who even was Sam? Is he completely made up? Someone who died?

Our Sam could very well be “a good guy” still, hunting these “bad travelers”. If he fails, there’s going to be bodies and tracks to covers. And there also might be bodies if he’s exposed. But of course Sam could also be something much more sinister.

TimovieMan - 17 April 2022 08:07 AM

But this all could’ve used a bit more exposition. I feel like the screenwriters needed to pick an actual path to follow instead of leaving it all open to interpretation, imo…

Yeah, as fun as all this speculation is, I think I would have preferred a tad more explaining. I don’t require everything to be revealed or explained, but there is a certain amount of revelations needed to be able to feel satisfied with the ending. So currently the ending is not very good, which even Adv_Lvr admitted.

If this was first half of the game, and we’d get chapter 2 with another case and more revelations…

millenia - 18 April 2022 11:26 AM

If this was first half of the game, and we’d get chapter 2 with another case and more revelations…

Then I’d be playing that second chapter now.

I’ve not been overly impressed and been rather critical in my comments, but I do recognize that there’s something present that works.

Hi!

I am really sorry for replying so late, but it seems I can’t find time for anything lately

To make it short, we didn’t choose the right killer (it was Rayne, but we were sure it was Violet because she seemed more likely to be a traveller) but at least we saved Ellis . We didn’t replay it, as my wife thought (and I can’t really blame her) the mechanics of the game were quite repetitive (talk to people, shapeshift into people, talk to people again…) Sure, she liked Contradiction more because it had “real” puzzles…

Summarizing, acting was great, the story was interesting and gives cause for a sequel, but seemed quite repetive.

P.S Anyone in for a Dark Nights With Poe and Munro’s CPT?

walas74 - 01 May 2022 06:07 PM

P.S Anyone in for a Dark Nights With Poe and Munro’s CPT?

I’ve had so much fun with Who Pressed Mute on Uncle Marcus that I’d be in for another IM.

Karlok - 02 May 2022 06:18 AM

walas74 - 01 May 2022 06:07 PM

P.S Anyone in for a Dark Nights With Poe and Munro’s CPT?

I’ve had so much fun with Who Pressed Mute on Uncle Marcus that I’d be in for another IM.

I don’t suppose you’d be up for an Uncle Marcus replay in a CPT? It would get my vote, after your glowing review.

If not, Dark Nights With Poe And Munro is pretty good. Just not one I’d be willing to replay at this time.

Charophycean - 02 May 2022 07:25 AM

I don’t suppose you’d be up for an Uncle Marcus replay in a CPT? It would get my vote, after your glowing review.

I would participate in a CP and I’m sure Adv-Lvr would be willing to lead it (where is he? haven’t seen him around recently), but it’s not the type of game lots of people would enjoy.  Just saying…