[Gonzosports]

What gamers of any ilk are guilty of is realizing game design is a business and people's livelihoods are at stake.

Thanks somewhat to piracy, and the fact that in some ways the medium of video entertainment is still in its infancy, and still, unfortunately, mostly marketed to an adolescent audience, the profit point has never been able to be as stable (and that's a relative term) as the motion picture market.

What I'm saying is, game companies are going to produce for the market who buys, and desigers are going to design for the customer who buys.

I am still pissed at Bioware for throwing in the creative towel by saying they follow the same basic narrative formula because it works and they are first and foremost a business, but I understand.

Until it's a big enough business to afford experiments or suddenly the cost of making games suddenly irrevocably reverted to the late 80s/early 90s when all you needed to make a game was three people, a CostCo box of Cheetos and an Apple //c, this is the gaming world we have. And if consoles are where it's at, that's where the production/design dollar/time are going.

BTW, I have a PS3 I didn't buy it to play games, but I am happy (Heavy Rain, Fallout 3) that I did.

[noknowncure]

Originally Posted by Mikane Zaprick

Hell, while you are at it "let's" change some of the very traditional and fundamental core things.

...terrified of change...

[Intrepid Homoludens]

Originally Posted by Mikane Zaprick

Hell, while you are at it "let's" change some of the very traditional and fundamental core things.

Could you please explain what the "very traditional and fundamental core things" are in this case? Thanks.

Let's not release the game on PC! That'll be great, screw them there fans that have not decided to buy into the biggest of the biggest rip-off console market.

I understand your concern over the threat of no more adventure games being released for PC. But aren't you being overly dramatic? After all, there still are many, many adventure games being released for the PC. How is it that you seem so upset?

According to the latest statistics (compiled from various sources including the NPD Group, Famitsu/Enterbrain, and GfK Chart-Track), thus far 18 million Nintendo Wiis, 11.6 million Xbox 360s, and 5.7 million PS3s have sold in the U.S. alone.

Worldwide a combined total of over 76.4 million current gen game consoles have been sold. And that's before portable platforms like the PSP, DS, iPhone, and others are taken into consideration.

Does that look like the "biggest of the biggest rip-off" market to you? Especially in terms of possible expanded market for adventure games to a much wider audience that could love this story driven genre (given realistic considerations for re-designing games to suit both veteran adventure gamers and newbies)?

Heavy Rain, according to David Cage, is being created for many of us who want a new kind of experience in our games, specifically a very involving and filmic take on interactive storytelling. By 'us' I mean any of us at least 17 or older (it looks to be an 'M' rated game) who want a different way of experiencing games. The intellectual challenges are decidedly not your typical puzzle sliders, poke-stick-through-keyhole-to-push-key-out, and similar overdone and tired challenges. And yet, that is only one game out of the whole lot! So then, how is it that you seem upset about this?

We've got 11 year olds to market our "motionally involving games for MATURE ADULTS" to.

I don't understand this statement. Could you please expound on this? Are you referring to how adventure games are being marketed?

[Mikane Zaprick]

I understand your concern over the threat of no more adventure games being released for PC. But aren't you being overly dramatic? After all, there still are many, many adventure games being released for the PC. How is it that you seem so upset?

It has to do with this:

Heavy Rain, according to David Cage, is being created for many of us who want a new kind of experience in our games, specifically a very involving and filmic take on interactive storytelling.

That's what I'm upset about. You say that there are many games still available for the PC. Well, I've not seen too many that haven't absolutely sucked lately.

The much anticipated (according to this very site's list of) ...

• 3CM. Wasn't an adventure game, firstly, it was an HO "game" (yes, it was) and a terrible implementation of that miserable trend at that. Blurry? Ugly? Scenes? FFS! At least make the hunting scenes nice. There are thousands of these HO time-wasters. Thousands! The only good thing about any of them is the artwork!
  
• This new Holmes game is yet another a hand-holding non-game. "Let's go to the moge, omes!" So I've been told, here in these forums. ...And apparently chock-full of tedious tasks as well. Again, according to the people here on these forums.
  
• Still Life 2 is getting paned even by those who enjoyed the monotony of Still Life 1 (I know this list of gripes is getting boring, too... Maybe I can I get you a cup of coffee? You know, to make things more interesting...)

...

So when a game that promises to actually be a game is sabotaged by exclusivity profiteers... it sucks.

IOW, your last paragraph answers the questions you posed about why I'm expressing such a distaste for the turncoats who have allowed the dictates of Capital to screw those of us who aren't buying into a big rip-off.

Rip-off, I say? You tell me one good reason why I should buy a console when I have a PC that can do everything those consoles do -- and more by a mile. You'll realise when you try that this console BS is indeed a huge rip-off. And then consider that this mess doesn't stop there, at buying 1 console... how about 3 of them?

It's a rip-off. It's chaotic. It oughta piss everyone off. And it's a shame that I'm having to explain this while (not you) pathetic, thoughtless trolls run around yip-yapping and building straw-men for their masters, the console purveyors, to prop themselves up with.

[Intrepid Homoludens]

Originally Posted by Mikane Zaprick

It has to do with this:

That's what I'm upset about. You say that there are many games still available for the PC. Well, I've not seen too many that haven't absolutely sucked lately.

I see. Yes, I did state that adventure games are still being made for PC, but I didn't say that most of them are very good and worth your money. I don't know, really, because I abandoned PC gaming several years ago and switched to consoles. But that's not because I was dissatisfied with the lack of adventure games I was personally interested in, at least that's not the main reason. It was primarily because I was poor and couldn't afford to constantly upgrade my aging desktop, and because I hate having to worry whether a new game can run on it. Mind you, I have never played adventure games exclusively, I also love FPSs, some racing games, RPGs, action/adventures, and other kinds.

But it seems like you're blaming David Cage for something. Are you sore because he's doing Heavy Rain only for a console? Or are you sore because you, like I, haven't found any adventure games lately that you deem good quality and value? If so are you blaming consoles? Because it seems that adventure game developers largely avoid consoles and mostly stick to PC.

The much anticipated (according to this very site's list of) ...

Aren't the perceived poor quality of these games (if that's what you imply) a result of poor development? If so, there are a lot of bad console games out there, too. If anything, shouldn't you be disappointed at the developers of Still Life 2, 3CM, and the new Holmes games, no matter what platform they developed the games for?

So when a game that promises to actually be a game is sabotaged by exclusivity profiteers... it sucks.

If this is the case, David Cage (as an example) should be the one hearing your complaint. After all, he is the one who signed on to Sony to develop Heavy Rain just for PS3. I think the reasons he went there were to make the game on a particularly powerful system, to make the game available to as large an install base as possible, and to introduce a new kind of game experience to a new audience. Sony, of course, hopes the game will do very well commercially.

After all, Mikane Zaprick, at the end of the day, it IS a business, and the money must be made. David Cage has a family to feed, a mortgage to pay, a life to live. He needs the money. And Sony need to make money, too, in part so that they further help develop progressive games like Heavy Rain and Project trICO.

IOW, your last paragraph answers the questions you posed about why I'm expressing such a distaste for the turncoats who have allowed the dictates of Capital to screw those of us who aren't buying into a big rip-off.

Rip-off, I say? You tell me one good reason why I should buy a console when I have a PC that can do everything those consoles do -- and more by a mile. You'll realise when you try that this console BS is indeed a huge rip-off. And then consider that this mess doesn't stop there, at buying 1 console... how about 3 of them?

It's a rip-off. It's chaotic. It oughta piss everyone off. And it's a shame that I'm having to explain this while (not you) pathetic, thoughtless trolls run around yip-yapping and building straw-men for their masters, the console purveyors, to prop themselves up with.

Okay, I am NOT touching this, LOL! It's a rant, an understandable one. I'm sorry that you are so disappointed with the current state of the games industry.

As for me I'm very perfectly happy with how I game these days. I own an Xbox 360, a Wii, a PSP, and do a bit of gaming on my iPhone. Sometime in the future I plan to get a PS3, too, but I'm waiting for Sony to knock at least another $100 off the price. I look forward to playing Heavy Rain and Project trICO. I'm sad that they're exclusive to the PS3, but that's life, I guess.

[Intrepid Homoludens]

Originally Posted by nomadsoul

Update mindblowing 30 minute demo

http://www.viddler.com/explore/Lirion/videos/2/

Thanks, nomadsoul, for this link! I remember watching it a while back but I didn't watch it all the way through.

To those of you who haven't yet watched it, skip to 11:32 in the video. The suspense you feel as the player in control of Madison can only intensify, I think, the deeper you go. It's just like the last scenes in Silence Of The Lambs, but you play the heroine. David Cage narrates the demo in French, but the point is clear - different narrative outcomes happen depending on your decisions and actions in the moment. He actually shows one scenario, then another to compare.

When I watched it I thought, I don't even give a damn anymore if this is an adventure game or not, I have to experience it! Can you imagine how fast your heart will beat when you're trying to keep her alive in that sequence? Especially if you have others watching you play it?

Also: NEW TRAILER showing another scene with Madison, The Blue Lagoon nightclub. My guess is that she may be trying to get in as a dancer to further her investigation?

[Mikane Zaprick]

If this is the case, David Cage (as an example) should be the one hearing your complaint.

My complaint was in response to a quote from David Cage. I phrased it as a direct response to his statements (even though I don't truly and solely blame him as much as the system that brings these wonderful circumstances to life... as you might have gleaned by now ) .

Anyway, I voiced my complaint here - as the quote was brought over here... to be discussed {disgust} I supposed.

Anyway II, thanks for understanding rather than inexplicably defending what is clearly a messed-up situation. Used to be most people could see the mess; now, it seems, resignation and bovine pacifism has won the day!

Anyway III, these are only games. I'm really not that/this passionate about the loss of the opportunity to play "Heavy Rain". Just thought I'd say something aloud seeing as how this is a forum.

[Intrepid Homoludens]

Originally Posted by Mikane Zaprick

Anyway II, thanks for understanding rather than inexplicably defending what is clearly a messed-up situation. Used to be most people could see the mess; now, it seems, resignation and bovine pacifism has won the day!

If I wasn't in the position to eventually own a PS3 I'd be just as mad. Aside from the ridiculously high price, I haven't yet bought one because there aren't enough exclusive games for it that I'm interested in, and most of the games it offers can also be got for the X360, which I do own.

Where you are, is it possible to rent a PS3 for, say, a week or so, when Heavy Rain comes out so you can play it, too?

[Mikane Zaprick]

Where you are, is it possible to rent a PS3 for, say, a week or so, when Heavy Rain comes out so you can play it, too?

I could probably rent one or borrow one or something.

I guess if the game is really that great I could do that.

It would be a first though. A game that good.

And if it turned out that the game really was that good? confined to the PS3? It would probably only send me 'round the bend again...

I haven't yet bought one because there aren't enough exclusive games for it...

Please don't encourage the "Profiteering Purveyors of Exclusivity"!

[Intrepid Homoludens]

NEW TRAILER

Features playable characters, two of which we're already familiar with. I'm beginning to think each character may have had some kind of relationship with each victim of the Origami Killer and that each of them are investigating their related death.

[sTyLnK]

Game looks great, I want it, I don't have a PS3. That's about it.

[Intrepid Homoludens]

"TIME TO PLAY THE SEXY GIRL..." | Heavy Rain demo (narrated by David Cage)

Make sure to click the HQ button for the high def version.

Photojournalist Madison is at the club as part of her invesigation on the Origami Killer, but needs to feign another kind of woman to further crack the story. No major spoilers, just a crash course in vamping up to gain access to perhaps a certain someone.

[Intrepid Homoludens]

So has anyone else watched the above gameplay footage? I think it'll be funny watching some of us trying to virtually apply lipstick and eyeliner.

[TiAgUh]

Well, she's definitely not sexy..
Do we get a trophy for this?

[nomadsoul]

Originally Posted by Intrepid Homoludens

So has anyone else watched the above gameplay footage? I think it'll be funny watching some of us trying to virtually apply lipstick and eyeliner.

I didn't update it on day of E3 thinking fans would already know, but this video is must

sexy/erotic, embarrassing or whatever but this is more than just using lipstick or resetting breasts



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3nEkbs7vVQk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DOgzBWQnAjY

full presentation with spycam FTW!

[Intrepid Homoludens]

Originally Posted by TiAgUh

Well, she's definitely not sexy..
Do we get a trophy for this?

What's that old saying? Ah, yes: Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

Originally Posted by nomadsoul

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3nEkbs7vVQk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DOgzBWQnAjY

Thanks!

[Intrepid Homoludens]

Originally Posted by nomadsoul

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3nEkbs7vVQk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DOgzBWQnAjY

full presentation with spycam FTW!

I had to stop watching the first clip halfway. Not because it was too risque, on the contrary this is definitely a very mature game, with very mature subject matter. You know, for us grown-ups who understand, yes?

I stopped watching it because I didn't want to spoil the plot for me any further than it already has.

I love that it just b&tch slaps the whole misconception that video games are solely for kiddies or immature hormonal teenage boys or socially inept types, that David Cage has the maturity and audacity to explore depths that I and tons of other adult gamers want to explore. This is definitely one necessary direction games must go to be taken as seriously as literature or film.

I am absolutely getting a PS3 the moment I hear this game has gone gold, if not before.

[stepurhan]

Yes, I can see that.

Female characters in cleavage revealing tops and incredibly short skirts have never appealed to hormonal teenage boys. Even if they got past that bit they'd all hate her going on to do a striptease.

Maybe I'm missing something but both of these actually seem to reinforce the hormonal teenager stereotype, not dispel it. Can anyone fill me in on what makes this "mature" instead?

[TiAgUh]

Originally Posted by stepurhan

(...) Can anyone fill me in on what makes this "mature" instead?

Good Question. Enlighten us, Intrepid.

[youfightlikeadairyfarmer]

Originally Posted by stepurhan

Can anyone fill me in on what makes this "mature" instead?

The ESRB