[After a brisk nap]

Great review, Jack! It gave me a much better idea of what the game is actually like than any other I've seen. The game sounds very promising, and I think I can forgive the flaws you described.

I'm eagerly awaiting my copy of Fahrenheit so I can try it out for myself.

[Intrepid Homoludens]

Kudos, Jack!!! I don't give a damn if I'm part of the staff and look like I'm kissing up, but I mean it from the heart. Excellent, honest critique of a game on everyone's lips, and I mean not only adventure fans, but almost everyone who game passionately.

You seem to be part of the consensus thus far - it's not a perfect game by all means, but it's a brave game, one that dares (especially in the adventure category) to puncture arbitrarily set boundaries.

Because graphically it doesn't seem to make much of a difference, I think I'll get this for Xbox instead of PC (the price is the same - $40).

P.S. - heh, Snarky I also started a new thread about this but saw that by the time I hit the Submit button you had already started one. I deleted mine and reinserted my post here.

[Melanie68]

I really liked the review as well (fair and balanced and better than Fox news!). The only thing that worries me is:

The most prevalent of these is a twin version of Simon… That's right, Simon — you know, the electronic game of Simon Says that dates back to the late 1970s. At regular intervals throughout the game, a pair of translucent coloured rings will appear overlaid on the main game screen. As the colours light up, you'll need to match their orientation with your controller of choice. The speed and duration of these 50-plus(!) sequences vary according to the tempo of the events of the game. Again the theory is to have the directional controls coincide with what's physically onscreen, but concentrating on the rings makes that a pointless distinction, as you can't focus on the action to see the correlation. So while the game has Lucas dodge a car in the same direction you pressed your buttons, you'll be far too busy pressing the next set to notice. You're free to try observing both at once, but expect to spend the rest of the day cross-eyed if you do. The long sets that occur during certain dialogues are even more of a nuisance, as they're an actual hindrance to following the story. If asked what I learned from the autopsy on my trip to the morgue, I'd be forced to answer something to the effect of, "The knife was [red-blue-green-red-red]… the arteries, causing [blue-red-yellow-green-yellow]… victims all [green-yellow-blue-blue-yellow]." Everyone catch all that? Right. Me either.

Then there are the button-mashing segments. Though not as frequent as the Simon exercises, what they lack in number they compensate with aggravation. When your character is required to do something extremely strenuous, you'll need to fill up a bar by hitting alternate buttons in rapid succession. The only question besides whether this is harder on your nerves or the controller is: WHY?? Beating the bejeebers out of your keyboard simply does not emulate physical exertion, though it does provide the identical absence of fun. Even worse are the eight or ten dramatic combat or chase sequences that combine the two activities, ramp up the difficulty significantly, and force an abrupt "game over" if you lose all of your accrued "lives". The first of these will probably send many people scrambling to drop the difficulty settings to easy, but even that's no guarantee of success. Veteran action gamers will certainly overcome, but these are NOT forgiving sequences for anyone unaccustomed to dexterity-based challenges, and they occur too often to luck your way through. So be forewarned. If you're already asking yourself right now, "Does he mean me?", then yes, I do.

I may wait to see how others do with these parts of the game. I'm just not sure....

[Intrepid Homoludens]

It shouldn't be a problem with me, I'm an action/adventure veteran.

[Melanie68]

Originally Posted by Intrepid Homoludens

It shouldn't be a problem with me, I'm an action/adventure veteran.

Fine, rub it in

[Legolas813]

You can change the difficulty settings if you can't handle the action sequences.

From IGN: "On easy and medium settings these sequences are no trouble to get through, but on hard it can prove to be frustrating at times."

Besides, I'm looking forward to the action sequences. It's about time we got some action in adventure games.

[fov]

Melanie, that's exactly the part of the review that concerned me, too.

But I do appreciate the honesty!

[samIamsad]

Sh*t happens. Especially if you want to achieve something that those really, really, really limited input devices (such as keyboards, mice and gamepads) simply aren't suited for. I doubt it will be much of a problem (difficulty-wise) for anyone who's even slightly into video games. Heh, I don't really know, but I doubt it. In any case, the warning seems appropriate, though. This is Advenure Gamers, after all. Didn't like the phrases concerning hybrids and (hardcore)adventure gamers, but: Good job!

[gillyruless]

Wonderful review, Jack.

Was just at GB and read your comments there as well. I have a feeling that a lot of GBers will be having a problem with the game. I will be getting the game and I have a feeling that I will like it a lot. Too bad that it sounds like that the action sequences hinder more than aid in telling the story (at least to me, I was never able to finish Dues Ex and Max Payne because they were too action heavy and I got too frustrated).

PS Oh and sam, I did try Mafia but I couldn't handle it. Parts of it were very good but some of the sequences in the game were just too much for me. I need to go to action gaming school and get better at it.

[Jackal]

Thanks guys/gals. I do hope people will find it helpful in ways that maybe a non-adventure gamer perspective might overlook.

The game definitely deserves to be lauded for its vision and pure audacity to be different. I don't know how Quantic managed to convince not one publisher but TWO to support its development, but I'm glad someone's still out there pushing boundaries.

To be honest, though, I'm finding some of the other reviews out there to be overrating the game itself. Not by much, but a little too willing to gloss over some pretty relevant issues. I did try to be a little more balanced without being unduly harsh. This is one game where a review is better off with no score at all, because it's less of a 4-star game than a game with lots of 5-star components and a few 2-star aspects, and when it all comes out in the wash, ended up a 4.

As for the action sequences, as the review says, regular action gamers will certainly get through them, but many adventure-ONLY gamers will not. Plain and simple, end of story. Anyone who disagrees spends too much time on AG's forums and not enough in the larger "ag" community. I can't tell people what side of the line they belong on, but I tried to describe where the line IS as clearly as I could.

Originally Posted by samIamsad

Didn't like the phrases concerning hybrids and (hardcore)adventure gamers

I don't follow. What don't you like about them? Not enough vowels? Too guttural? Honestly, what's the complaint?

[amitavc]

apparently there was a rumor that GoGamer would carry the import version (Farenheit). I am quite interested in it, but I'd really rather get the full version than buy Indigo Prophecy. Anyone know where else to get it? (since it has yet to come up on any searches of their site...)

[Jackal]

It's already at GoGamer. You're just spelling it wrong. It's Fahrenheit, and it's $45.

EDIT: Whoops, welcome to AG, amitavc.

[Melanie68]

Jackal,

Concerning the action sequences - is there a gamepad you can get for the PC to make getting through them easier (I'm too lazy to search on the internet )?

[gillyruless]

Originally Posted by Melanie68

Jackal,

Concerning the action sequences - is there a gamepad you can get for the PC to make getting through them easier (I'm too lazy to search on the internet )?

This thread has some good recommendations. I doubt you need anything fancy Melanie. You should be able to get something decent under 20.

http://forums.adventuregamers.com/showthread.php?t=9597

I'm thinking about getting this one myself.

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/AS...venturegame-20

You might want to stop by at a place like Comp USA where you can actually try holding the controllers and pick one that's most comfortable in your hands.

[fov]

Gilly, that's the gamepad I have, and I really like it.

I suggest going in to CompUSA or some other store that has samples out, rather than buying online, so you can hold the gamepad in your hand. I almost bought another one but liked the feel of this one better. If you see a better price online, you could still go into the store to test them out, but buy online.

[gillyruless]

Originally Posted by fov

Gilly, that's the gamepad I have, and I really like it.

I suggest going in to CompUSA or some other store that has samples out, rather than buying online, so you can hold the gamepad in your hand. I almost bought another one but liked the feel of this one better. If you see a better price online, you could still go into the store to test them out, but buy online.

Damn, we made the comment about comp USA at the same time. We maybe spending too much time at AG, we are starting to think alike.



About that gamepad, one of the reasons for my picking that one out is because you recommended it (and it's cheap).

[Jackal]

Strangely enough, I found the action sequences easier with the keyboard. Navigating around the game normally feels more comfortable with a gamepad, though, and if you have one, you can alway switch on the fly if you're having problems. This is one detail I was on the verge of including in the review, but the freakin' thing was already long enough.

[natalia]

Terrific review! I'm on a game buying moratorium until after my wedding, but this'll be the first game that I buy when it ends.

One question -- the game can be played on easy, easing up the action sequences. How much does this affect the game as a whole -- or how integral to the game are the action sequences?

[Jackal]

I'm not sure I understand your question, natalia, so I'll just randomly say things and hope one of them is the answer you're looking for.

First of all, the difficulty settings affect nothing but the action sequences, so switching to the easy setting won't remove anything, change the plot, or "dumb down" the rest of the game in any way.

The action sequences themselves are "integral" to the game in various ways, but there's definitely no way around them. Some of them (the ones that occur during dialogues, generally) just add small layers to the story. Others are threats to your mental health, but won't kill you if you fail (unless you lose all your points). The bigger, harder sequences are life and death, though. You fail, you lose. Game over, though usually you're returned to a save point very near the sequence that killed you.

[natalia]

Originally Posted by Jackal

I'm not sure I understand your question, natalia, so I'll just randomly say things and hope one of them is the answer you're looking for.

First of all, the difficulty settings affect nothing but the action sequences, so switching to the easy setting won't remove anything, change the plot, or "dumb down" the rest of the game in any way.

The action sequences themselves are "integral" to the game in various ways, but there's definitely no way around them. Some of them (the ones that occur during dialogues, generally) just add small layers to the story. Others are threats to your mental health, but won't kill you if you fail (unless you lose all your points). The bigger, harder sequences are life and death, though. You fail, you lose. Game over, though usually you're returned to a save point very near the sequence that killed you.

Thanks for the thoughtful response, Jackal. I guess I just wanted to know whether or not making the action sequences easier by playing on easy mode would take away from the game playing experience, if that makes any sense. And from your response, it sounds like that won't be the case. (I'm just a wuss about action sequences -- I loved Psychonauts, but had to put it away, because I simply couldn't get past one of the final meat circus sequences).