[Fien]

I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure Hardacre is who ever did Nigel's voice. It's pitched up, but they phrase words similarly. No oops. I'm thinking about Haden not Hardacre. Am I wrong on Haden?

It's Hadden who is listed as unknown in the credits, not Hardacre. Matt Clark = Hardacre. But the booklet says that Jonathan Boakes = Hadden, so he is not THAT unknown.

Is Jonathan really reading all those long pages filled with our wild ramblings? We should each have made a succinct list of questions. I pity him... let's hope he gets at least a good laugh out of it.

[therabidfrog]

Who voices Nigel?

[Fien]

Originally Posted by therabidfrog

Who voices Nigel?

Guess, Mr. Lazybones!
Or look at the credits...
Or open the manual...

It is...

WARNING! MAJOR SPOILER AHEAD!!










JONATHAN BOAKES


Yes, the same one who voices Mr. Hadden. And Mr. Russet. And...

[Fantasysci5]

Oops. lol I knew it was Hadden. Long day. Hmm...I'm going to go back and comment on the previous pages last few posts, but right now, I'm just too tried. Tomorrow!

[therabidfrog]

Originally Posted by Fienepien

JONATHAN BOAKES

I don't own the manual. I got it at Direct2Drive. And no I didn't read the credits. I rushed here to log my thoughts so... wah!

I just wanted to know that my finally tuned ear was correct, and it was!

[Fien]

No manual?? I would feel ripped off if I paid the full price of 29.95 for a download. Has never happened to me before, all my downloads came with a manual. Even inexpensive indie game The Path comes with a manual in pdf format.

[Fien]

Jonathan, I hope you will answer a couple of really burning questions (please forget about the minor ones, I can live with those ).

What part plays Hadden in all of this? Intro and ending... helmet, wheelchair, mysterious phone call to Lucy, etcetera
What's up with the dates? Crate, age Nigel, date recruitment.
What's up with the photos? Future, past, alternate reality... who took them, what's their purpose?

Thanks a lot! Looking forward to Needles and Pins, and of course Dark Fall 3.

[seagul]

I hope nobody posted this before:
exploring the world of the lost crown:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Mxqm...eature=related

[Jadefalcon]

I still wonder if centuries back with the histories given that the Agers were originally a good family that were corrupted. If you want a comparison, anyone who has read Lord of the Rings will know of the Numenoreans and how they were basically a 'good guy' race, but some of them became corrupted and evil.

Perhaps the Agers started out with the best of intentions but eventually got to the 'protect the crown' route but would do so by any means possible no matter how distasteful. There also seems to have been heavy hints of inbreeding which won't exactly help yet it's strange there seems to be no mention of female Agers anytime.

[DarklingRoom]

Hi all,

Wow! Thanks for such an intense playthrough. It was a pleasure to read your comments and observations.

The Lost Crown is a very long game, and took me an age to write and create. Perhaps I should have split the story into three neat chapters, but I like the epic, old fashioned quality it has. The story is a play/homage to the classic ghost story...well, several of them in fact. Most are new, some are borrowed (A Warning to the Curious) and some are referenced (Man-sized in Marble). It has lots of ghosts of the dead, most of which you've spotted, and some ghosts of the living. I've read strange accounts, in fiction and non fiction, about people appearing to warn family members of some imminent disaster, or death in the family. The ghostly visitors seem perfectly normal, look normal, but it is impossible for them to be there. The best known cases involve the appearance of people currently residing at the other side of the world; like the Captain who visits the wife of a fallen soldier, killed in battle only moments before. It's not the dead husband who shows up, as a ghost, instead it's a stranger, someone who was there when it happened, moments before. Very strange.

You could say that Saxton, shrouded in fog on a near forgotten coast, is a 'ghost of the living'. The town exists, and those who arrive there rarely leave, through choice rather than supernature. Many have lived there for years, unaware that they should have moved on. It's a fantastical idea, but it does have a foundation in reality. Saxton is based upon where I live, in Cornwall. There are folks here who have never left the town (ever!), and know it far better than I ever could. Actually, it's impossible for me to know it like they do. It's a completely different place. They still visualise the Old Bakery, on the High Street, where a Tapas Bar now exists. There is no sign of the old Bakery, and no photos. But the elders of Polperro STILL refer to it when giving directions. The Bakery doesn't exist, yet that older generation can still see what it looked like, smelt like, and have stories about when they stood buying cakes, pasties and bread, one Summer, many decades ago. It's a ghost. A ghost of what was once there. In many ways The Lost Crown was created to explore those places...places which don't necessarily exist. They are more metaphorical than physical. Sure, Saxton exists, but each individual would see it differently...and have a different memory of the place. In the Lost crown we are 'reading' Nigel's report for Hadden; his own, personal, account of his adventure in Saxton. It functions, and malfunctions, according to Nigel's memory and personality. Personal accounts of an event, especially a traumatic one, are painfully unreliable. It would be interesting to read Lucy's version of the tale, and see what she made of the events taking place.

As Nigel explores the town, and surrounding areas, he is stepping into other peoples 'zones', whose memories and impressions of the place are stronger than his own, at that point. Nigel is almost a tourist in his own world, and his reactions to it (his relationship with the world) is stunted and half-formed. The Karswell House is a good example. Katherine and Robert exist in that house, in their own time, aware of visitors and the passing days...but are not aware that they are dead, and have been dead for some time. It's rather sad, come to think of it. But, that was one of my aims, with this game...to create a melancholy pastoral lament, and tell sad stories of those that haven't moved on, or don't know they should have done.

The Lost Crown is also an exploration of folklore, myth and the ancient ways of the English Landscape. I like to think Nigel returns the Crown, to Ganwulf, knowing full well that the world around that ancient Saxon-Kingdom would fade away, and become just another seaside town. Too many archaeological treasures are dug up, from the landscape, and placed on the glorified shelves of county (or even National) museums...miles away from their spiritual home. If the artefact was placed in the ground, or hidden from view, it must have been for a good reason. The reason or purpose for such an act does not have to be clear to prevent the disturbance. Wouldn't it be better to leave things be? Sometimes? To leave the treasure alone, and allow it to protect and feed our small pockets of the world, as it has done for several centuries. A token item that gives the landscape meaning, purpose and texture. Our ancestors knew what they were doing, regardless of how primitive we think they were. I don't think Ganwulf would have picked the Agers as his official guardians, but he doesn't get to pick and choose.

The burden of protection drove that freaky bunch of farming brothers to kill, plot and protect far beyond their limited lifespan, as they do in A Warning to the Curious (one of the main influences on the main story). The fact that they all exist, together, in the family portrait is alarming. They cross time periods, to do their bidding, a little like Nigel can step from one persons time to another. That is why, he too, appears in the portrait, towards the end. He has, whether he likes it or not, become an official guardian of the Crown. Poor Hardacre stole the crown from Nigel, but he could not keep it forever. There's a chilling hint, on May Day Night, that Nigel and Lucy actually summon the ghost of the Agers. Their chant of 'show me, show me, show me...' allows them to locate Hardacre, as he flees with the treasure...but, it is an Ager scythe that strikes him down.

Gruel is also in touch with the dead brothers...attempting to continue their work, in their physical absence. The burden of the task, yet again, drives someone totally potty. He is convinced Jemima talks to him (then again, who are we to judge!), and that the Saxton cats are spying on him, and wish to reveal the location of the crown to others! Ha ha. I feel quite sorry for Gruel. He's horrible, and mad, but poor Jemima really goes up like Roman Candle on that fire. Even the pub cat, Spivey, looks pleased with the outcome. Perhaps there's a sinister side to those cats as well. 'Nocturnal spies for the dark lords', the Rector might say, should he decide to pop up again. I think the Saxton pets will have re-populated by the time we return...Lucy and Nigel have new assignments, from the mysterious Mr.Hadden. But, I've got to get Dark Fall: Lost Souls finished first...if you thought TLC had some creepy scenes, like the plague ghost, you haven't seen anything yet!

Thanks for playing!

Jonathan

P.s. Sorry about the lack of dialogue skipping. My fault. Also, 8 save slots is NOT enough. That'll be fixed next time round.

[therabidfrog]

Thank you for taking your time to comment. It's really nice that a game developer would take time out of their schedule to read comment on a forum like this. I really appreciate it... especially now that my theories are more or less validated!

But thank you so much, and I really enjoyed your game. I'm glad you kept it as long as it is. It was a wonderful ride.

[Fantasysci5]

Thank you so much for commenting, Jonathan! I really appreciate it!

[Fantasysci5]

Originally Posted by HandsFree

I've been toying with the idea that Hadden is the dark lord. He has a servant called Crow, he opened up a chasm to another... world/dimension/universe/place.

But I always get stuck at the same point: why didn't Hadden (or whoever wanted that crown to be found) not interfere when the crown was placed back.

The white light or portal above Ganwulfs grave looks like the chasm on the stolen pictures (not exactly, but still).

The Agers who by their name are the black servants, and by their actions the bad guys anyhow, protected the crown from being found. That was supposed to be a good thing.
The townspeople are mostly nice and they help the crown to be found. But that was supposed to be a bad thing according to the legend.
I'm still in the dark here.

Wow, never thought about the "Dark Lord" being Hadden. You could have a point. But I believe Bidfrog said, which I'm leaning towards, Saxton and the Crown was all a test to see how Nigel would work as an assitant for Hadden on paranormal investigations.

You're right about the white energy above Ganwulf's grave looking like the chasm...so maybe a way out of this experiment, by putting the crown back?

With the whole Agers=good thing, Townspeople=bad thing...I think it's more like "the devil in sheep's skin". The Agers are trying to do teh good thing a long time ago, but the way they are doing it is bad. The townspeople are inherintly good, and they want to use the crown for a good reason, but it isn't a good idea, of course.

Originally Posted by seagul

people thought that by taking a photograph of them they would lose their soul. Perhaps thats what happend here. Mr. Hadden recreated Saxton with the aid of old photograps, photographs of different times and places of Saxton. The people are somehow real but in a kind of computer reality.
Just an idea. I have to play the fifth day and think about it.

I somewhat agree, Seagul. I believe Hadden made a computer simulation of old pictures to make Saxton, and put Nigel in, to interact with the ghosts; Tawny, Verity, etc.

Originally Posted by therabidfrog

My assumption all along was that Hadden wasn't after the crown, but was after certain qualities in Nigel. Haden's corp seems to be into some pretty weird stuff, and I think he was testing to see if Nigel had the character to do this kind of work in the future. If you think about it Nigel doesn't spook easily. In fact he's more excited about the science aspect than bothered by ghosts. He's smart and brave enough to solve a complex mystery, and easily manipulated. What more could you ask for?

I think Hardacre was killed because he attempted to leave Saxton with the crown. Nigel did want the crown for himself, but up to that point he hadn't actually attempted to skip town.

Couldn't agree more, on both points. I really like your idea of Hardacre trying to *leave* town.

Originally Posted by Jadefalcon

I still wonder if centuries back with the histories given that the Agers were originally a good family that were corrupted. If you want a comparison, anyone who has read Lord of the Rings will know of the Numenoreans and how they were basically a 'good guy' race, but some of them became corrupted and evil.

Perhaps the Agers started out with the best of intentions but eventually got to the 'protect the crown' route but would do so by any means possible no matter how distasteful. There also seems to have been heavy hints of inbreeding which won't exactly help yet it's strange there seems to be no mention of female Agers anytime.

I totally agree. That's what I've been saying. I think they started off good, but the way they took to it turned bad, but they still think they're doing that "honorable quest". My question is how Gruel learned about it. Did the ghosts tell him?

Originally Posted by DarklingRoom

Many have lived there for years, unaware that they should have moved on.

In the Lost crown we are 'reading' Nigel's report for Hadden; his own, personal, account of his adventure in Saxton. It functions, and malfunctions, according to Nigel's memory and personality. Personal accounts of an event, especially a traumatic one, are painfully unreliable.

As Nigel explores the town, and surrounding areas, he is stepping into other peoples 'zones', whose memories and impressions of the place are stronger than his own, at that point. Nigel is almost a tourist in his own world, and his reactions to it (his relationship with the world) is stunted and half-formed...to create a melancholy pastoral lament, and tell sad stories of those that haven't moved on, or don't know they should have done.

I don't think Ganwulf would have picked the Agers as his official guardians, but he doesn't get to pick and choose.

That is why, he too, appears in the portrait, towards the end. He has, whether he likes it or not, become an official guardian of the Crown.

He's horrible, and mad, but poor Jemima really goes up like Roman Candle on that fire. Even the pub cat, Spivey, looks pleased with the outcome. Perhaps there's a sinister side to those cats as well.

Hi Jonathan!!! Again, thanks so much for posting. We appreciate you taking the time. I had never thought about them not wanting to leave, or knowing they can. That's awesome, and I love that idea!!

I didn't know this was from Nigel's point of view looking back on it, that does make sense why some of it is muddled. An interesting way to do it. But some of us fans like to tie up all loose plot holes.

I love the "zone" ideas, and a lot of the ghosts' stories were very sad. Ah, my theory of the Agers passing the duty down is shot, but oh well. Thanks for clearing up why Nigel was in the picture of the Agers.

As my avvie and signature suggest, I love Gruel. He's my favorite character, adn that ending scene broke my heart. That cat did look way too smug, that's why I liked Mr. Tibbs. I don't think Gruel was always this bad, a bit yes, but I think his wife died, and he projected her onto the doll, which is why it hurt him so muchto see her burn. Am I close? ...I love Gruel.

[HandsFree]

Thanks, Mr. Boakes for reading everything and clearing things up (somewhat ).
I agree that the whole thing being a test is the most logical explanation, only I don't like to think that's it. That's only one step away from it was all a dream, so I'll just go on rethinking this. That's more than most games achieve anyway.

I don't think I've ever spent 6 weeks on a game before.
Thanks Fantasy for hosting this, and all the analyzing. That and all the comments made me replay several parts of the game to see what I missed first time.
And now I still don't know what that house on the gamebox is.

[Fien]

Fantasy, about the saved game.... I'm sorry, but I can't bring myself to keep on playing the last bit of the Lost Crown, I tried for a couple of minutes but I'm really truly done with it. My last save is dated 19 March, which is the one I sent to bidfrog. (in Net Hut, in front of the pics). If you want it, he can send it to you, I have problems attaching files to my posts.

[Fantasysci5]

That's alright, Fien, but why are you done playing it?

[Fien]

I guess I played it to it's natural death. Happens sometimes. I won't play it again.

[Fien]

Fantasy, I discovered a later saved game, at Celtic Corner. The 4 symbols are there, but you would have to do the entire mine section before the winner of the competition is announced. If you want it, just send me a PM.

[Fantasysci5]

Well, if no one else has any closing thoughts, I think our playthrough is officially over. Thanks for playing, guys, and for Jonathan Boakes with his perfect timing to help us with a few of our theories.

[therabidfrog]

So say we all!!!