hey guys,

i was wondering what makes my country more free then yours? I live in the USA "The Home of the Free" and i always wondered what makes my country so special compared to yours. for instance if i moved to england, would i not be able to speak my mind about the government? I'm always hearing "you should be proud to be an American."
The sad part is, that i am not proud, i even wonder why i often reside in the USA. i feel that the United States should be considered the Morons of the World. i know someone going to say "you should feel lucky that you live in the US and not etheopia" but I'm not talking in that sense. I'm referring to places that have a civilized government not a 3rd world country.

[SoccerDude28]

Originally Posted by guybrush_guy

hey guys,

i was wondering what makes my country more free then yours? I live in the USA "The Home of the Free" and i always wondered what makes my country so special compared to yours. for instance if i moved to england, would i not be able to speak my mind about the government? I'm always hearing "you should be proud to be an American."
The sad part is, that i am not proud, i even wonder why i often reside in the USA. i feel that the United States should be considered the Morons of the World. i know someone going to say "you should feel lucky that you live in the US and not etheopia" but I'm not talking in that sense. I'm referring to places that have a civilized government not a 3rd world country.

Hmmm why don't you feel proud?

I for one have a lot of things to be proud about in this country. You have the freedom of speech, the freedom of religoun, the melting pot of the various races and cultures that America accepts. How many countries give you citizenship after living there for 10 years. In some countries, you will live there for all your life and you still are not a citizen.

As far as morons go, there are a lot of them here I agree. But then look at the bright side. There are tons of smart people, working their asses of to produce wonderful things like games They are among the smartest people in my book.

Granted Bush has screwed up a lot of the things that make this country great, but he is just a stain in the history of the US, and hopefully time will clean up his wrong doings.

Now why do you say that you are not proud living here?

[Wormsie]

I am not really proud to be Finnish. Actually, I have noticed don't care...

Bush for one, i despise this man with a passion. it's kinda hard to explain why I'm not proud, maybe proud shouldn't of been my word. some times I'm ashamed, i guess. like i said it's hard for me to explain.

you say that we have freedom of speech but doesn't Canada have that?
you say that we have freedom of religion but doesn't Australia have that?
do you see my point, why is the USA considered the home of the free if some other country is just as free as ours?

[Wormsie]

The HOME meaning something like the BIRTHPLACE, in this case. Though human rights started in England, actually, but the declaration of independence in the USA played an important part, too.

[Erwin_Br]

Originally Posted by SoccerDude28

Hmmm why don't you feel proud?

I for one have a lot of things to be proud about in this country. You have the freedom of speech, the freedom of religoun, the melting pot of the various races and cultures that America accepts. How many countries give you citizenship after living there for 10 years. In some countries, you will live there for all your life and you still are not a citizen.

As far as morons go, there are a lot of them here I agree. But then look at the bright side. There are tons of smart people, working their asses of to produce wonderful things like games They are among the smartest people in my book.

Granted Bush has screwed up a lot of the things that make this country great, but he is just a stain in the history of the US, and hopefully time will clean up his wrong doings.

Now why do you say that you are not proud living here?

All true, though there are of course more countries that fit your description. Here, for instance, you can get citizenship after already 3 years, just to name something. I'm not really 'proud' or anything, just grateful I live in a free country, I guess.

--Erwin

[Zygomaticus]

Originally Posted by guybrush_guy

hey guys,

i was wondering what makes my country more free then yours? I live in the USA "The Home of the Free" and i always wondered what makes my country so special compared to yours. for instance if i moved to england, would i not be able to speak my mind about the government? I'm always hearing "you should be proud to be an American."
The sad part is, that i am not proud, i even wonder why i often reside in the USA. i feel that the United States should be considered the Morons of the World. i know someone going to say "you should feel lucky that you live in the US and not etheopia" but I'm not talking in that sense. I'm referring to places that have a civilized government not a 3rd world country.

Well, there's something to be glad in the fact that you're country isn't a 3rd world country. You can't have your cake and eat it too, as they say.

And the USA has this reputation of a free country because it was one of the first (probably, the first) countries to have such freedom. Back when the phrase, "Land of the free..." was coined (1812ish?) America was probably the only country to have such freedom (at least in words, if not in practice). Hence the reputation. Doesn't mean it still is that way. You're right, today America is hardly the best place in the world. After all, it can't be everything to everybody.

[mag]

Originally Posted by guybrush_guy

i was wondering what makes my country more free then yours? I live in the USA "The Home of the Free" and i always wondered what makes my country so special compared to yours.

It's simple. America owns the rights to the word "freedom." Bush gets a nickel every time you use it. "Freedom" is now defined as "being like America."

Originally Posted by guybrush_guy

for instance if i moved to england, would i not be able to speak my mind about the government?

What, with those pinko commies? Not a chance.

mag

[SoccerDude28]

Originally Posted by guybrush_guy

Bush for one, i despise this man with a passion. it's kinda hard to explain why I'm not proud, maybe proud shouldn't of been my word. some times I'm ashamed, i guess. like i said it's hard for me to explain.

you say that we have freedom of speech but doesn't Canada have that?
you say that we have freedom of religion but doesn't Australia have that?
do you see my point, why is the USA considered the home of the free if some other country is just as free as ours?

Remember Bush is only one person. I hate bush more than anyone in existance, but Bush doesn't in anyway represent what America is about. He is a fluke and hopefully people will realize that.

It's true that Canada has freedom of speech, and is a wonderful melting pot too, but it is freezing over there, and the economy is half as good as the US economy.

Australia is run over by Kangaroos hehe just kidding. No Australia is also a fine place, EXCEPT FOR THE FACT that they banned lsl magna cum laude. Now who wants to live in a place like that

So To make it simple, governments change, and every country has its ups and downs.

[remixor]

Originally Posted by deadworm222

human rights started in England, actually

[Wormsie]

Magna Charta. Or something like that.

Truth to be told, I slept during my history lessons...

[Ninja Dodo]

Hmm yes, the US allows you the freedom to get screwed up the ass by huge corporations. Criticism of the government is frowned upon and if you're a foreigner or a muslim you pretty much have no rights.

Democracy is a Greek invention by the way - not that the USA has any considering the manner in which the last election was conducted - and if I'm not mistaken much of the declaration of independence was inspired by the French revolution.

[mag]

Originally Posted by SoccerDude28

Australia is run over by Kangaroos hehe just kidding. No Australia is also a fine place, EXCEPT FOR THE FACT that they banned lsl magna cum laude. Now who wants to live in a place like that

Yeah, but to be fair, what are you legally allowed to say in Australia?

Originally Posted by Ninja Dodo

Democracy is a Greek invention by the way - not that the USA has any considering the manner in which the last election was conducted - and if I'm not mistaken much of the declaration of independence was inspired by the French revolution.

No, it wasn't. The Declaration of Independence was written in 1776, 13 years before the French Revolution. However, both the American Revolution and the French Revolution were inspired by the ideas of the Enlightenment, which were developed largely in France. But America was the first place to establish a government based on those ideas. It was actually the French who looked to the Americans for inspiration in their revolution. The Declaration of the Rights of Man and of the Citizen was based largely on the model set by the Declaration of Independence. I understand (and this may just be a story) that even the colors of the French flag--red, white, and blue--are based on the colors of the American flag because America at the time was a symbol of freedom. Of course, we got our colors from England, so so much for that idea.

mag

[Ninja Dodo]

I stand corrected. I never pay much attention to dates. I'm more interested in the actual events.

The rest holds up though.

[Mattsius]

Originally Posted by mag

I understand (and this may just be a story) that even the colors of the French flag--red, white, and blue--are based on the colors of the American flag because America at the time was a symbol of freedom. Of course, we got our colors from England, so so much for that idea.

You are right about the French looking up to the Americans at that time, but the quote above is indeed just a story.

The original French flag was created in 1790, but with the colours the reverse of what they are today (i.e. red-white-blue and not blue-white-red). The change took place in 1794.
The blue and red colours are basically those of Paris as used on the day of the storming of the Bastille, mixed with the Royal white (the flag that was used when France was a monarchy).

EDIT: I did not sleep during my history lessons.

[DustCropper]

Originally Posted by deadworm222

Magna Charta. Or something like that.

Truth to be told, I slept during my history lessons...

Well, also, the Declaration of Independence is heavily inspired by the writings of British philosopher John Locke. Locke wrote that people have inalienable rights to "life, liberty, and property," and that it was the government's duty to uphold these rights; if it fails to do this, then the people must rebel. Jefferson wrote pretty much the exact same thing in the Declaration (some would argue he plagarizes Locke), except, interestingly, he changed man's inalienable rights to "life, liberty, and the pursuit of hapiness."

So I do agree with you that many of America's themes of human rights came from England. But I think that it was first formalized in a government with the American Constitution, and all that.

[Starflux]

America is one of the free countries in the world, but if you look at it anally, The Netherlands offer far more basic freedoms, such as the freedom to marry a member of the same sex, the right to abortion and other things that we take for granted here but are still not legit or normal in America. And then to think that a lot of the people here want to be more like America. I say we need to become more like the Netherlands and nourish our own culture

[Jazhara7]

Originally Posted by Ninja Dodo

Democracy is a Greek invention by the way

This is true, but it still had a long way to go. Let's see if I can still get this together:

"Everyone can vote. Except for women. And slaves. And underage people (I don't remember from which age it was said that a person is of age. probably 24). And except for poor people. And except for people that are not free (If you were a farmer, but the land was owned by some rich guy, you were not free). Ane except for mentally ill people. And except for non-greeks. Etc, etc, etc."

(Something like that. Ancient Greece)

But luckily it has gone a long way to this day.


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[Jazhara7]

Originally Posted by SoccerDude28

There are tons of smart people, working their asses of to produce wonderful things like games They are among the smartest people in my book.

I know this was kind of a joke, but some spiffy things were invented somewhere else. The Internet for example! It was invented in Austria. At the CERN Institute.
Sorry, just had to mention that.


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[Intrepid Homoludens]

Originally Posted by Smiling Cat Avatar

So I do agree with you that many of America's themes of human rights came from England. But I think that it was first formalized in a government with the American Constitution, and all that.

America's the first country to actually put the damn idea to practical use.

Originally Posted by Flux

America is one of the free countries in the world, but if you look at it anally, The Netherlands offer far more basic freedoms, such as the freedom to marry a member of the same sex, the right to abortion and other things that we take for granted here but are still not legit or normal in America. And then to think that a lot of the people here want to be more like America. I say we need to become more like the Netherlands and nourish our own culture

Blame it on the Puritanical tight-assed nature of Americans. For some reason everything has to be tied to 'what God would want' or something. Self-righteous pricks.