[Mervy]

I'm not sure this topic belongs here, but...

Someone I was talking to tried to merge RPGs and Adventure Games, saying they were basically the same. I've never been thrilled about RPGs, but I love Adventure Games. How would you define the differences between the two genres? What makes an adventure game unique?

I'd be interested to hear what you think.

Mervy

[Hammerite]

I'd say adventures are more about conversations and using item on item, while RPGs are more level up, fight and have conversations and look at a whole lotta menus.

[samIamsad]

And along comes a game like PS:T and puts you in big trouble.

[smashing]

The similarities between RPG and adventure games are telling in that most would probably start you off being totally clueless of the settings and the background; yet as the story unfold itself, either via solving puzzles or beating up boss after boss, it gets you totally absorbed into the story. Differences of course is that adventure games usually don't care much about the psycho-motor coordination of the player, and don't really care much if there's some statistics of the character.

[Filmman]

Adventure Games All the Way Because they are better then RPG Games.

[Intrepid Homoludens]

Not sure if I agree with that. I like both genres, it's true, but depending on the individual game elements of on genre may cross into the other and might even be done better in some cases. For example, The Longest Journey, as beautiful and rich as it seems, was incredibly boring when you weren't solving puzzles or talking to an NPC. It's explorative aspect was pretty much vacant - you would think that a huge, cosmopolitan city like Stark would be filled with large numbers of people and happenings to interact with. It wasn't. There was only one or two NPCs per scene, and you couldn't even talk to them. In contrast, Knights Of The Old Republic features tons of citizens who always have something to say, vehicles flying past, things to look at, things happening all the time. Even if they got repetitive they at least maintained a sense of the city being dynamic and full of life all the time.

You could argue that adventure games focus more on mental gameplay - the challenges are solved in your head, not on the screen or interface - but that shouldn't necessarily mean that richness in exploration and interactivity should suffer.

[Squinky]

I love both genres as well. I've found that it also varies whether you have to use psycho-motor coordination in an RPG or not; sometimes, it takes as much mental power to decide which weapon to use on which character as it is to decide which item to use on which item in an adventure game.

Then again, my RPG's of choice are Chrono Trigger and Chrono Cross. Story and character-wise, they are equally as memorable as many of the Lucasarts classics. However, one thing I've noticed is the multiple forks you can take that lead to different endings. Usually, adventure games have only one path, which means less replayability but more depth to the story; whereas in RPG's, the more endings you have, the more the story suffers. If you compare Trigger to Cross, the former has a much more linear story with fewer character options, but is generally more memorable and has superior character development. The latter has a LOT of characters and endings, but you don't end up caring for any of the characters as much as you do in the prequel.

Interestingly enough, my playing of old RPG's has influenced my adventure game design quite a bit.

[Mad Dog]

Originally Posted by Squinky

Usually, adventure games have only one path, which means less replayability but more depth to the story; whereas in RPG's, the more endings you have, the more the story suffers.

Yeah. That's what playing through Knights of the Old Republic 2 taught me. It's great to have a game be so open-ended, but open-ended plots don't work too well. Through most of Knights 2 I knew what my short-term goals were, but even when I had finished the game I was perplexed as to just what the overall story was about.

The biggest difference between RPGs and Adventures, IMHO, is that generally in adventures, you are given a role to play through a story. RPGs are usually about creating your own character and going through the story in your own way. In a sense character development can be said to be more important in RPGs, but it's in a fairly superficial sense. Generally, due to the nature of the gameplay, RPGs tend to have little variety in plot and themes, unlike adventure games, which seem to be able to adress just about everything.

So, basically what I'm saying is they're VERY different. I like both, though, so long as they're well-done.

[fov]

I'm going to move this topic into the Adventure forum because it addresses commercial games, as well as amateur.

I remember when I played the first Quest for Glory game, I had never heard of an RPG and didn't realize that QfG was one. I just thought "Cool - an adventure game with fighting."

Originally Posted by Mad Dog

The biggest difference between RPGs and Adventures, IMHO, is that generally in adventures, you are given a role to play through a story. RPGs are usually about creating your own character and going through the story in your own way.

I whole-heartedly agree with you here. My favorite kinds of RPGs, mostly those like Fallout, allow the player to create a unique identity and provide a dynamic and flexible setting that he/she can genuinely affect and alter through his/her actions. The most succesful ones, in my opinion, are those that really make the player feel as though their choices have made an indelible mark on the given virtual world at the end of the day, rather than feeling as though they've been lead by a leash to the game's conclusion.

To give an example of this sort of thing done right, Fallout's ending, rather than being your standard "CONGRADULATION! YOU BEAT THE BAD GUY" affair, actually gives a run-down on how your actions (or inactions) changed the different towns and key characters you'd met on your journey.

Generally, due to the nature of the gameplay, RPGs tend to have little variety in plot and themes

Yeah, it's a shame, really. It's always the same: You've got your evil Muahahaha-ing villain who rises to power, your hero with a great destiny (and maybe a dark past) who will have to stop him/her/it, and some magic gem(s), crystal(s), heart(s), star(s), or horseshoe(s) that he/she will have to collect before that can happen. Honestly, I think the genre simply needs more creative developers.

Wasteland, to my knowledge, Fallout, which didn't actually have a "villain" that was evil, and Ultima IV, which had no villain at all, are the only exceptions to the rule that I know of.

[James]

currently i believe that they remain two distinct genres, although the RPG has evolved from its d&d beginnings in a western context, and the eastern rpg has always remained an entirely separate entity. the possible merger of the genres is something of interest, but i think it is important to note that the more likely occurence would be that the RPG adapts and contains adventure elements rather than a complete merger of the genres. the same could not be said of the adventure adapting rpg elements, as character development or statistics would seem quite out of place in a broken sword or monkey island game.

the elements of interest to the rpg which could be borrowed from the adventure are farely standard fare to AGers like us. the use of inventory manangement, expanded into inventory puzzles could see a diversity of quest in the RPG. the same reasoning would apply for the use of more complex dialogue based puzzles in the RPG, this would break up the interrogatory nature of many RPG conversations. depending on the rpg, and im thinking of what ive seen of oblivion, environment based puzzles could also broaden the design scope. these would be similar to the physics puzzles seen in hl2, the likes of which would not be out of place in an adventure game.

[After a brisk nap]

There are some RPGs that are essentially adventure games with fighting and without real puzzles (Betrayal at Krondor, Lands of Lore), in that the game is dominated by making your way through a pre-defined story. (I am led to believe the Zelda games fall into this category.) And then there are other RPGs that have absolutely nothing in common with adventures (Diablo, most MMORPGs) in that the game is dominated by hack-n-slash, leveling up, and rudimentary commerce in equipment and loot. And then there are games that fall somewhere in between (The Elder Scrolls etc.) in that they have a story which is supposedly fairly important, but really it's all about going around killing monsters.

It's difficult to talk about the difference between AGs and RPGs because RPGs vary so much in the balance of their different ingredients. One difference that seems fairly universal is that RPGs are set in huge, sprawling worlds while in AGs, gameplay is restricted to relatively few or small areas. (Which isn't to say that one is better than the other, as some seem to assume. The massive geographies of RPGs is one of the main things that put me off the genre, while many others seem to like it.)

[smashing]

Lots of interesting observations here. Anyway, just to side-track a little, anyone came across any fan-made modules for the neverwinter nights engine, that doesn't involve any hack-and-slah, no levelling, and just plain old adventure?

[samIamsad]

http://nwvault.ign.com/View.php?view...y_select_id=10

[smashing]

Originally Posted by samIamsad

http://nwvault.ign.com/View.php?view...y_select_id=10

Thanks a lot!

[crabapple]

Originally Posted by Snarky

It's difficult to talk about the difference between AGs and RPGs because RPGs vary so much in the balance of their different ingredients.

As do adventures, which makes the problem worse.

[Intrepid Homoludens]

Originally Posted by crabapple

As do adventures, which makes the problem worse.

How do adventures vary so much in the balance of their different ingredients?

[crabapple]

Originally Posted by Intrepid Homoludens

How do adventures vary so much in the balance of their different ingredients?

You've got everything from 7th Guest/Myst/Obsidian, which emphasize puzzles, to Syberia and TLJ, which emphasize story, to LucasArts, which emphasize characters (and often humor).

[Aj_]

The gameplay mechanics for 3rd person adventures that focus on dialogue trees, items, and movement have been implemented into many RPGs. Fallout, hell even the fast paced diablo had inventory puzzles. For the ammount of dialogue in some adventures, Fallout and many RPGs make Adventures look silly in this area, the way the trees are handled, the impact on the game, are usually much better in RPGs.

RPGs have stats systems, even if there is no combat in the RPG, the dialogue, stealth, is all controlled by these stats. This doesn't work in the extremely linear world of adventures, where branches are rare, and random events never happen. These also allow for massive worlds, randomly generated worlds, an almost infinity ammount of content requiring much less developement effort.

[wilco]

Don't forget that the average RPG takes what? At least 40-50 hours to finish it and with only 50% of the game seen). And with that time you could go through 4-5 adventure games (or even more with a walkthrough..).
That said, RPG players have too much free time