[dippdogg2002]

Hi all I'm new to adventure games and am looking for recommendations of games. I was first introduced to adventure games a long time ago when I had a next door neighbor who was a connosieur so to speak. I remember playing The Dig and although I didn't get very far I absolutely loved it.... So now I basically thanks to steam am starting to play it again and so happy they re-released it. I love to play rpg's so obviously I love games with a good story and atmosphere I'm sure there are a million of these threads lol but I think it would be so much easier to find games based off my preferences. I don't really care too much for graphics or age so to speak as long as it's just a great game... I hope that you guys can help me find some wonderful adventure games because it has been a genre i have neglected over the years due to being afraid of wasting money on something I would not enjoy..... I bought the very first myst game and just could not get into it so I think that is what broke me from trying out other games..... Thanks for the help and I am looking forward to some wonderful discussions

[HitBattousai]

Since you didn't like Myst, I eliminated most first-person style adventure games from these lists. There's plenty more beyond this naturally, but here's a decent number to get you started, I'd look into the reviews available here to see if they sound like games you'll like beforehand anyway though.

1990s
Day of the Tentacle
Indiana Jones and the Fate of Atlantis
Beneath a Steel Sky
Sam And Max Hit The Road
Full Throttle
Grim Fandango
The Secret of Monkey Island(has a remastered edition out now)
Monkey Island II: Lechuck's Revenge
The Curse of Monkey Island(Monkey Island III)
Broken Sword: Shadow of the Templars
Broken Sword II: The Smoking Mirror
Gabriel Knight I: Sins of the Fathers
Gabriel Knight II: The Beast Within
Gabriel Knight III: Blood of the Sacred, Blood of the Damned
I Have No Mouth and I Must Scream
The Lost Files of Sherlock Holmes: Case of the Rose Tattoo
The Last Express
The Neverhood
Blade Runner
The Longest Journey
Police Quest I, II, III, IV
King's Quest V, VI, VII
Tex Murphy: Under a Killing Moon
Tex Murphy: Pandora Directive

2000s-now
Syberia
Syberia II
Shadow of Destiny
Tales of Monkey Island
Sam and Max: Seasons One and Two
Dreamfall(Sequel to the Longest Journey)
The Moment of Silence
Overclocked: A History of Violence
The Shivah
The Blackwell Legacy
Blackwell Unbound
The Blackwell Convergence
Culpa Innata
The Lost Crown: A Ghost Hunting Adventure
Still Life
Indigo Prophecy
Emerald City Confidental
Immortals of Terra: A Perry Rhodan Adventure
Runaway: A Road Adventure
So Blonde
A Vampyre Story
Sherlock Holmes Frogwares Series
The Witcher
Machinarium
Yoomurjak's Ring
Hotel Dusk: Room 215(Nintendo DS game)
Trace Memory(Nintendo DS game as well)
Phoenix Wright Series(Nintendo DS as well)
Heavy Rain(coming out February 23rd in the US for the PS3)

[dippdogg2002]

Well It wasn't really the first person view that necessarily turned me off to the game I just couldn't get into the story and it just seemed really really boring to me.... I say this because I remember a game called phantasmagoria? and i enjoyed it way back when and if i'm not mistaken it was first person view.

[HitBattousai]

I'll throw a few more games in then. Not a big fan of Phantasmagoria myself, but there are two games in that series for reference, Phantasmagoria and Phantasmagoria: A Puzzle of Flesh.

Shadow of the Comet
Dark Side of the Moon
Scratches: Director's Cut
The Dark Fall Series
Barrow Hill
Silent Hill: Shattered Memories(Wii or PS2, the Wii version being superior)
Amber: Journey's Beyond
Shivers
Amerzone
Samorost I and II
Shenmue I(Dreamcast)
Shenmue II(Dreamcast or original Xbox)
Time Hollow(Nintendo DS)
Fatal Frame Series(Playstation 2)
Delaware St John Series
The Journeyman Project Series
Nostradamus: The Last Prophecy

From what you've written, I think the Gabriel Knight series on my earlier list should probably be your first choice if you want a starting point.

[Caliburn]

Adventure gamers often use "first person" and "third person" as a way to distinguish between what are, broadly speaking, two subgenres within the adventure genre.

One subgenre, which usually uses a third-person perspective, focuses on story, interaction with other characters, and inventory-based puzzles (i.e., using a key on a lock, putting a crushed sleeping pill in a bowl of food, giving a blackmail letter to a blackmailer to confront him). The pioneers of this genre were text adventures like Zork, and later graphic adventures like King's Quest. Most of the Sierra and LucasArts games fit in this category.

The other subgenre, which usually uses a first-person perspective, focuses on backstory*, exploration (often with little or no interaction with other characters), and manipulation-based puzzles (i.e. sliding tile puzzles, figuring out how a mysterious machine with no instruction manual works, reassembling a torn photo). The pioneers of this genre were Myst and The 7th Guest. Many of the games that The Adventure Company published in the early 2000s fit in this category.

Obviously, the real difference has little to do with the perspective (first or third), and a game of one subgenre can and has been made with the perspective of the other. But there is perhaps a logical reason why the games that emphasize character interaction use third person more often--namely, because then you can see the main character on the screen, helping to make him or her a distinct personality from the player--and the games that emphasize exploration use first person more often--namely, because then you can see your environment in a more life-like way.

Like any set of genre distinctions, these boundaries are fuzzy, even beyond the question of perspective. A game like Syberia, for example, looks exactly like a third-person game, has character interaction, and uses inventory-based puzzles, but it feels like it was heavily influenced by the first-person games. I would argue that that's because you spend an awful lot of time walking from one place to another (emphasis on exploration) and because even the inventory-based puzzles often have to do with getting a machine to work, which makes them more like manipulation-based puzzles. Benoit Sokal, the designer of Syberia, had previously made the game Amerzone, which was unambiguously in the so-called first person subgenre.

The game you liked, The Dig, has a focus on story, some (but infrequent) interaction with other characters, exploration, and a combination of both inventory-based puzzles and manipulation-based puzzles. The Dig still came from the tradition of third person games (being a product of LucasArts and with a lead designer who had previously made unambiguous entries in the third person subgenre), so depending on what you liked about it, it is quite possible that you will find the so-called third person subgenre more to your tastes.

Phantasmagoria is third person, actually, both in the literal sense of perspective, and in terms of the qualities that the so-called third person subgenre usually posesses.

At any rate, this is the distinction HitBattousai had in mind, I imagine. HitBattousai's list does include some fuzzy games like the Tex Murphy and the later Frogwares Sherlock Holmes games, which use first-person perspective for moving around, and yet show the character on screen during conversations and cutscenes, so that they are also technically third person to some extent. But they feel much more like part of the so-called third person subgenre overall, despite the mixed perspective

I hope this explanation was more helpful than dull.

As for suggestions, I like HitBattousai's list from the 1990s (though these games can be harder to get hold of), since this is when the genre was at its peak, in my opinion. I would add that the previous entry in The Lost Files of Sherlock Holmes series by Mythos Software (published by EA), called The Case of the Serrated Scalpel is also excellent. These are not to be confused with a recent casual games series called The Lost Cases of Sherlock Holmes.

I also agree that, based on what you said about story and atmosphere, the first Gabriel Knight game (now available to download for $5.99 from GOG.com, or you could buy a boxed copy off eBay) might be right up your alley, if you want to take a look at the review or the demo of that. However, it would also help if you described what you liked most about The Dig: the characters, the humor, the plot, the puzzles, etc. For example, one thing that stands out to me about The Dig is the sense of wonder at encountering something mysterious and alien.

-Luke

* By backstory, I mean learning about things that happened in the past. For example, people sometimes claim that Myst has no story, but this is not exactly true. It has backstory: namely, by exploring the rooms formerly occupied by certain characters, you learn about their personalities; by reading books, you learn about past events, etc. Many of the clones of Myst that were made in reponse to that game's popularity took a similar tactic. Of course, there are also Myst clones that shifted toward story rather than backstory (to some extent, Myst 3 made the same shift), but since I'm trying to help make the two subgenres clear, I oversimplify a little.

[Collector]

Originally Posted by dippdogg2002

Well It wasn't really the first person view that necessarily turned me off to the game I just couldn't get into the story and it just seemed really really boring to me.... I say this because I remember a game called phantasmagoria? and i enjoyed it way back when and if i'm not mistaken it was first person view.

Phantasmagoria is a third person view game. It was also a full motion video game.

[dippdogg2002]

Actually Caliburn that is very helpful. Based off what I have been told so far I have went and and just browsed some of the games on here that has been reviewed and perhaps I should make the Gabriel Knight series my next quest. Although I do wonder if I tried a first person game like dark fall if I would like it? With Myst I just thought it was rather bland being named the stranger and all that nonsense I just want a little something in the game that I can grasp on too instead of being confused at start up I think the whole thing for me about the dig was the atmosphere. It had mystery in there like where were you and all that good stuff. Plus it's really really pretty It's hard for me to describe other than I just thought Myst was way too slow and bland for me to get anywhere. Perhaps it was too mysterious?

[Caliburn]

Well, if you want to see if the first Gabriel Knight game interests you, then there is a demo here, so that you can try it in advance. The demo doesn't have voice acting, by the way, but the game does.

You will probably need DosBox to run the demo, if you don't have it already (it's free, and very useful for older PC games). If you buy the game from GOG, it will also include DosBox, as far as I know (that's how they usually run their DOS games), but in that case the GOG installer will set it up for you. In this case, since you would be downloading the demo from elsewhere first, you can look here or ask us for help here at the AG forums and we'll help you get it set up.

Your complaints about Myst make sense, and are shared by many other gamers, though of course Myst has many fans as well. I haven't played Dark Fall, so I can't answer your question for sure, but in general, I would say yes, it's quite possible you will like some games from the first person subgenre even if you didn't like Myst itself. My guess is that Dark Fall would have more atmosphere, more of a mystery/spooky feel, and a stronger sense of who you are in the game than Myst had. However, my impression is that it will also still have relatively little character interaction, more learning about characters' backstories than anything currently happening, and manipulation-based puzzles, so it depends on whether those are pros, cons, or neutrals for you. Looks like there is a demo here (among many other places on the web) if you want to investigate it further.

In fact, those two games could be an excellent test of which subgenre you like more. (You are, of course, allowed to like or dislike both. )

Lastly, here's a couple questions that might help us give you suggestions:

Forgetting games for a moment, what kind of stories do you like? Mystery, horror, science fiction, drama, comedy, etc.? Or the names of a few favorite stories (books, film, whatever) could be even more helpful.

Would you rather play a game that had a memorable story with not-so-great puzzles or a game with a forgettable story but excellent puzzles? (Obviously, we'll try to find you a game that has great both, but which is more important to you if forced to choose?)

-Luke

[dippdogg2002]

@Caliburn I really love the first three genres you mentioned (Mystery,Horror,Sci-Fi) but i could definitely play a comedy adventure game (Discworld played it but never got to finish loved it) and something I remember from playstation one where you played as a dragon or something like that it was pretty fun and didn't take itself too seriously.... I also remember playing a game where you was a goblin or something like that and it crazy stuff like hitting somebody with a frying pan and stuff. Never finished it because I got stuck at a giant sleeping and i couldn't get past him..... Keep in mind i played these games before I knew anything about walkthroughs and stuff lol.... To answer your second question I would rather have a really good story and atmosphere over the needlessly complex puzzles although it does keep me occupied for awhile

[Little Writer]

Originally Posted by dippdogg2002

I also remember playing a game where you was a goblin or something like that and it crazy stuff like hitting somebody with a frying pan and stuff. Never finished it because I got stuck at a giant sleeping and i couldn't get past him.....

That's "Gobliins 2" from Coktel Vision! Man, I was stuck at the exact same point. Those games never did appeal to me so I sold them.

Caliburn, excellent posts here! Totally agree with you.

And dippdogg, totally hear where you're coming from. It's a genre I've been neglecting as well, but more due to being afraid of wasting money on something my computer's hardware wouldn't be able to handle. I've kinda re-entered the genre with "The Longest Journey" and its sequel "Dreamfall", and I'm looking forward to acquiring games like "Secret Files", "Chronicles of Mystery" and "Overclocked".

When it comes to the "classics" mentioned above, I'd definitely check out the other LucasArts titles besides "The Dig", and the "Gabriel Knight" series, since those are all personal favorites. Those should keep you busy for a while

[Linque]

dippdogg, I rate atmosphere very important too. If I'd have yo guess, you'd enjoy these games a lot:

• Indiana Jones & the Fate of the Atlantis (captures the indy spirit really well)
• Full Throttle (this game is very short and quite easy compared to other Lucasarts games, so you don't have to spend ages trying to finish it, bu it's really, really cool in terms of atmosphere)
• Machinarium ( www.machinarium.net ) (please, try this out ... indie game and deserves all the support it can get - fantastic atmosphere too)