The Beginning of New Adventures

Dylan_Dog · 11-11-2005, 01:48 AM

I just finished playing Fahrenheit. I bought it yesterday. But I am far from disappointed. Let me explain.

It's been a while since I played any decent adventure games (since Melbourne simply doesn't get them). Moment Of Silence was buggy as anything and dialogue simply wasn't very good. Nothing new there. Mysterious Island was just like all 1st person still-life adventures, with a bit of creativity here and there. Nothing new there either. Conspiracies I thought was a waste of 50 bucks - amateurish and boring. Runaway never really had me enthused, I came half-way through, and decided that I was wasting too much time on some kind of other-worldly logic (by that i mean puzzles). Then I played demo of Fahrenheit and said "Wholly CRAP!!!!". I bought it eventually (yesterday) and couldn't keep myself away from it - it had me in its clutches until an hour ago when I finished it. The only reason why I'm not playing it right now is because I am allowing it all to sink in.

Why do I think Fahrenheit is the beginning of something new here? Well, firstly, it's dynamic - it allows player freedom; you can do certain things in different ways, and the personality of player's character and the flow of game are affected by those actions.
Secondly, the game provides enthrolling story. It simply won't let you go - it's like reading a Dan Brown novel; you just can't put it down.
Thirdly, the technical aspects of the game (graphics, sound quality, lack of programming error) are on par with most mainstream games on the market (by that I mean action and shoot-em-ups).
My fourth point is that the sound and ambience perfectly matches the mood of every single scenario, just like a really well-made movie.
And last point is the realistic interface. You don't have an infinitely large inventory. You don't have all the time in the world to think before responding when talking to people. You are confronted with action and timing sequences just like you would be if things like that were really happening.

My verdict is that the game is by today's gaming standards perfect and by adventure-gaming standards almost perfect. The only missing element is puzzle challange, but I guess the replay value of the game makes that a very small issue.

pandanaz · 11-11-2005, 01:55 AM

i agree with what you have said. many people have said that they were dissapointed with fahrenheit -- especially concerning the storyline -at the end, but i think it was an excellent game -- it got you hooked on even though the storyline was a bit strange towards the end, -- i still could'nt stop playing it -- so i think it most certainly achieved its goal.

Intrepid Homoludens · 11-11-2005, 02:06 AM

Hmmm, I don't consider it perfect at all. It had numerous design flaws and graphically it was subpar (probably because they used the PS2 as the damn common denominator

). However, what I felt it did effectively was prove that an adventure game can be experienced in ways other than the tired old point-&-click 2D take-your-sweet-time approach. Not every adventure game has to be that way.

There's absolutely room for a few or more that suck you in and dynamically grip you moment to moment. Not every adventure gamer necessarily wants to pixel hunt all the time and be a passive participant, especially in a kind of story that demands such an emotional involvement of the player. I think this is the main reason why Fahrenheit garnered intense acclaim from ALL kinds of gamers - not just hardcore adventure gamers, but many hardcore gamers, period.

vivasawadee · 11-11-2005, 02:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Intrepid Homoludens

Hmmm, I don't consider it perfect at all. It had numerous design flaws and graphically it was subpar (probably because they used the PS2 as the damn common denominator

).

Ahem. PS2 fanboy here. I think the graphics had a bit to do with the game being in development for a while now and weren't they aiming for a gritty kinda look? The PS2 can churn out some nice graphics (see God of War).

I agree with Intrepid that the game sucked you in and thats why I felt a bit let down, it was over too soon! I wanted to know more about the Mayans, Chroma, AI and Indigo Child. The gameplay mechanics could've used a bit more variety and there were too few scenes where your actions affected the outcome of the storyline. It was linear with the illusion of choices via dialogue selection.

Fahrenheit will still be my pick for game of the year.

Junkface · 11-11-2005, 02:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dylan_Dog

it's like reading a Dan Brown novel

Thankyou. I don't think I've ever seen Fahrenheit's flaws more elegantly or succintly described.

Gknight · 11-11-2005, 04:50 AM

I have played a somewhat similar game called Fable The Lost Chapters. There is a intriging storyline that comes with a few surprising twists. The graphics and sound quality are amazing. The game interface switches between a 1st person and 3rd person view. You are given choices along the way that change the final outcome of the game. All in all I find this to be one of the best games I have played in a long time.

MoriartyL · 11-12-2005, 11:50 PM

Dylan_Dog, you bring up two common reactions to the game which couldn't be farther apart: Your verdict that the game is perfect, and your initial reaction that the demo was "wholly crap".

(Just kidding, please don't yell at me.) My assessment is in the middle. Like you, I love Fahrenheit's vision for the future of adventures, and for that reason I recommend it highly to all. But let's not kid ourselves here- as far as execution goes, it's a mess.

Let's start with the story, which is the driving force behind the game (as it should be!). The pacing is... bad. It starts out moving along nicely, but then it makes lots of unnecessary stops which completely break up the narrative. Boxing? Showering? A basketball game?! These don't contribute to the story- they distract from it. David Cage wanted the game to be an ongoing series, and in that context they might have worked. In this context, they serve no good purpose and should have been edited out.

The ending is bad storytelling for too many reasons to mention. Some key problems: It switches too abruptly from slow-paced personal horror story to fast-paced sci-fi epic. The love story is out of the blue and doesn't take into account what may have happened with Tiffany. The back-from-the-dead twist made it impossible to relate to Lucas.

And then there was the subplot involving evil artificial intelligence- does science fiction get any more clichéd than that? And why was science fiction there in the first place- it was supposed to be a supernatural thriller! Anyone who's met me knows I love sci-fi, but there's a time and a place for everything and a supernatural thriller is no place for evil robots. Structurally, it makes no sense to throw in such an important subplot so close to the end, when the existing plot should be tied up- this is a subplot having very little relevance to anything the player had gone through since the beginning of the game!

Then there are the flaws in the game's design. The control via right stick doesn't really make sense. A dynamic verb-based system would have worked better. The best solution would be to make this game on the DS and use the touchscreen for all commands (to allow for very complex commands to pop up all the time, be instantly readable, and very intuitive), but since the DS isn't powerful enough for this game we can let this pass.

The Dragon's Lair-evolved action scenes are a very good idea which is completely ruined by relying too much on motion capture. The problem is not that the double stick control is bad- in fact, it's brilliant. The problem is that the animations don't react to the player's timing, so the player doesn't immediately understand the connection between his button presses and the action on-screen. If the animations were just a little more flexible, these sequences would have been outstanding. Instead, they feel gimmicky and gratuitous.

The stealth sections stink. A good rule is, if you can't pull off a certain type of gameplay successfully, then don't shove it into your game. Just common sense, really. But the stealth is nowhere near as unbearable as the first-person minigames. It's clunky, contrived crap.

It is also far from perfect as the beginning of a genre. If the format you've picked isn't good enough to portray certain concepts (like claustrophobia), then you need to flesh it out more so that it is. But Fahrenheit doesn't do that- anytime it gets to anything complicated at all, it switches gameplay! By doing so, it is refusing to lay out all-purpose rules which future game designers can use!

It also cheats when it comes to pacing. The constant time limits work here, but they get David Cage out of the responsibility of finding a workable method of pacing for the future. This work-around only works with thrillers! If a future game designer wants to make anything else, Fahrenheit has no answers for him.

The story is really linear, so it doesn't show future storytellers how to construct a branching storyline and make it work. Fahrenheit tries to convince the player that there's more than one possible direction the story can go in, but there really isn't. Only the ending can really be determined by the player. So while Fahrenheit may seem impressive, it's not giving future game designers anything to work with.

Fahrenheit is a very good game. But in no way is it "almost perfect".

Dylan_Dog · 11-13-2005, 05:01 PM

MoriartyL, I agree with many points you mentioned (apart from the points on joystic/gamepad controls coz I only used keyboard and mouse). "PERFECT" is a relative term and varies from gamer to gamer. I for example thought that graphics were awesome, that music was awesome and that interface was superb and that the immersiveness of the story worked 100% therefore it was perfect. But dissecting and analysing all the aspects of any game or movie or song or piece of art yields criticism and somewhat-unseen flaws usually creep into existence. There is no such thing as "purely perfect".

Now, I am 21 years old, athletic, with excellent reaction time and lots of patience; relaxed person and open minded. My previous favourite games were Half-life (1 and 2), Broken Sword series, The Longest Journey, Blade Runner, and EA Fifa series and Evolution Soccer series. From this description you would gather that I am a fan of good story; i have no problems with bit of action or intense timely-reaction sequences; i love a touch of appropriate violence here and there; i am a great fan of 3rd person adventures; i like simple and elegant interface in the game; and i appreciate graphical and musical (technical) aspects of the game. So for me, this game did the trick.

As to the flaws and inconsistencies in the story, there are heaps, just like in any hollywood movie (apart from maybe Oscar-nominated films), but the story as whole did manage to immerse the player really well and keep him/her playing right through the end. So far I haven't met anyone who played the game and hasn't finished it, which ultimately for the developer is a big success.

Intrepid Homoludens · 11-13-2005, 05:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dylan_Dog

Now, I am 21 years old, athletic, with excellent reaction time and lots of patience; relaxed person and open minded. My previous favourite games were Half-life (1 and 2), Broken Sword series, The Longest Journey, Blade Runner, and EA Fifa series and Evolution Soccer series. From this description you would gather that I am a fan of good story; i have no problems with bit of action or intense timely-reaction sequences; i love a touch of appropriate violence here and there; i am a great fan of 3rd person adventures; i like simple and elegant interface in the game; and i appreciate graphical and musical (technical) aspects of the game. So for me, this game did the trick.

I'll go out on a limb and say that a lot of hardcore gamers and game critics are probably more or less like you and me, and we found something in Indigo Prophecy they weren't able to find in adventure games in a very long time (post LucasArts/Sierra). I think we also found things in it we don't usually get in action games.

What d'you think those things are?

Momcat · 11-14-2005, 12:31 AM

Well, I really wanted to get into this game and eventually buy it, but the demo just killed it for me. The second time I had to start over and go through the entire intro again I said "That's it" Hey, I'm a working lady - I only have so much time to spend on a game (or a demo) before I have to shut it down and get back to making this computer pay for itself.

Ninth · 11-14-2005, 01:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Momcat

Well, I really wanted to get into this game and eventually buy it, but the demo just killed it for me. The second time I had to start over and go through the entire intro again I said "That's it" Hey, I'm a working lady - I only have so much time to spend on a game (or a demo) before I have to shut it down and get back to making this computer pay for itself.

Why did you have to start over?

Ninth · 11-14-2005, 01:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dylan_Dog

Well, firstly, it's dynamic - it allows player freedom; you can do certain things in different ways, and the personality of player's character and the flow of game are affected by those actions.

The game isn't really dynamic; you can't change the flow of the story, no matter what decisions you make.

SKIPPER · 11-14-2005, 05:34 AM

From what I've gathered this game will take some serious thought before I make any decision to get it.

11-11-2005, 01:48 AM	#1
Dylan_Dog Physicist Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 122	The Beginning of New Adventures I just finished playing Fahrenheit. I bought it yesterday. But I am far from disappointed. Let me explain. It's been a while since I played any decent adventure games (since Melbourne simply doesn't get them). Moment Of Silence was buggy as anything and dialogue simply wasn't very good. Nothing new there. Mysterious Island was just like all 1st person still-life adventures, with a bit of creativity here and there. Nothing new there either. Conspiracies I thought was a waste of 50 bucks - amateurish and boring. Runaway never really had me enthused, I came half-way through, and decided that I was wasting too much time on some kind of other-worldly logic (by that i mean puzzles). Then I played demo of Fahrenheit and said "Wholly CRAP!!!!". I bought it eventually (yesterday) and couldn't keep myself away from it - it had me in its clutches until an hour ago when I finished it. The only reason why I'm not playing it right now is because I am allowing it all to sink in. Why do I think Fahrenheit is the beginning of something new here? Well, firstly, it's dynamic - it allows player freedom; you can do certain things in different ways, and the personality of player's character and the flow of game are affected by those actions. Secondly, the game provides enthrolling story. It simply won't let you go - it's like reading a Dan Brown novel; you just can't put it down. Thirdly, the technical aspects of the game (graphics, sound quality, lack of programming error) are on par with most mainstream games on the market (by that I mean action and shoot-em-ups). My fourth point is that the sound and ambience perfectly matches the mood of every single scenario, just like a really well-made movie. And last point is the realistic interface. You don't have an infinitely large inventory. You don't have all the time in the world to think before responding when talking to people. You are confronted with action and timing sequences just like you would be if things like that were really happening. My verdict is that the game is by today's gaming standards perfect and by adventure-gaming standards almost perfect. The only missing element is puzzle challange, but I guess the replay value of the game makes that a very small issue. Share Share this post on Twitter

11-11-2005, 01:55 AM	#2
pandanaz Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 20	i agree with what you have said. many people have said that they were dissapointed with fahrenheit -- especially concerning the storyline -at the end, but i think it was an excellent game -- it got you hooked on even though the storyline was a bit strange towards the end, -- i still could'nt stop playing it -- so i think it most certainly achieved its goal. Share Share this post on Twitter

11-11-2005, 02:06 AM	#3
Intrepid Homoludens merely human Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Chicago Posts: 22,309	Hmmm, I don't consider it perfect at all. It had numerous design flaws and graphically it was subpar (probably because they used the PS2 as the damn common denominator ). However, what I felt it did effectively was prove that an adventure game can be experienced in ways other than the tired old point-&-click 2D take-your-sweet-time approach. Not every adventure game has to be that way. There's absolutely room for a few or more that suck you in and dynamically grip you moment to moment. Not every adventure gamer necessarily wants to pixel hunt all the time and be a passive participant, especially in a kind of story that demands such an emotional involvement of the player. I think this is the main reason why Fahrenheit garnered intense acclaim from ALL kinds of gamers - not just hardcore adventure gamers, but many hardcore gamers, period. Share Share this post on Twitter __________________ platform: laptop, iPhone 3Gs \| gaming: x360, PS3, psp, iPhone, wii \| blog: a space alien \| book: the moral landscape: how science can determine human values by sam harris \| games: l.a.noire, portal 2, brink, dragon age 2, heavy rain \| sites: NPR, skeptoid, gaygamer \| music: ray lamontagne, adele, washed out, james blake \| twitter: a_space_alien

11-11-2005, 04:50 AM	#6
Gknight Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Here and now Posts: 192	I have played a somewhat similar game called Fable The Lost Chapters. There is a intriging storyline that comes with a few surprising twists. The graphics and sound quality are amazing. The game interface switches between a 1st person and 3rd person view. You are given choices along the way that change the final outcome of the game. All in all I find this to be one of the best games I have played in a long time. Share Share this post on Twitter

11-12-2005, 11:50 PM	#7
MoriartyL Not like them! Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Israel Posts: 2,570	Dylan_Dog, you bring up two common reactions to the game which couldn't be farther apart: Your verdict that the game is perfect, and your initial reaction that the demo was "wholly crap". (Just kidding, please don't yell at me.) My assessment is in the middle. Like you, I love Fahrenheit's vision for the future of adventures, and for that reason I recommend it highly to all. But let's not kid ourselves here- as far as execution goes, it's a mess. Let's start with the story, which is the driving force behind the game (as it should be!). The pacing is... bad. It starts out moving along nicely, but then it makes lots of unnecessary stops which completely break up the narrative. Boxing? Showering? A basketball game?! These don't contribute to the story- they distract from it. David Cage wanted the game to be an ongoing series, and in that context they might have worked. In this context, they serve no good purpose and should have been edited out. The ending is bad storytelling for too many reasons to mention. Some key problems: It switches too abruptly from slow-paced personal horror story to fast-paced sci-fi epic. The love story is out of the blue and doesn't take into account what may have happened with Tiffany. The back-from-the-dead twist made it impossible to relate to Lucas. And then there was the subplot involving evil artificial intelligence- does science fiction get any more clichéd than that? And why was science fiction there in the first place- it was supposed to be a supernatural thriller! Anyone who's met me knows I love sci-fi, but there's a time and a place for everything and a supernatural thriller is no place for evil robots. Structurally, it makes no sense to throw in such an important subplot so close to the end, when the existing plot should be tied up- this is a subplot having very little relevance to anything the player had gone through since the beginning of the game! Then there are the flaws in the game's design. The control via right stick doesn't really make sense. A dynamic verb-based system would have worked better. The best solution would be to make this game on the DS and use the touchscreen for all commands (to allow for very complex commands to pop up all the time, be instantly readable, and very intuitive), but since the DS isn't powerful enough for this game we can let this pass. The Dragon's Lair-evolved action scenes are a very good idea which is completely ruined by relying too much on motion capture. The problem is not that the double stick control is bad- in fact, it's brilliant. The problem is that the animations don't react to the player's timing, so the player doesn't immediately understand the connection between his button presses and the action on-screen. If the animations were just a little more flexible, these sequences would have been outstanding. Instead, they feel gimmicky and gratuitous. The stealth sections stink. A good rule is, if you can't pull off a certain type of gameplay successfully, then don't shove it into your game. Just common sense, really. But the stealth is nowhere near as unbearable as the first-person minigames. It's clunky, contrived crap. It is also far from perfect as the beginning of a genre. If the format you've picked isn't good enough to portray certain concepts (like claustrophobia), then you need to flesh it out more so that it is. But Fahrenheit doesn't do that- anytime it gets to anything complicated at all, it switches gameplay! By doing so, it is refusing to lay out all-purpose rules which future game designers can use! It also cheats when it comes to pacing. The constant time limits work here, but they get David Cage out of the responsibility of finding a workable method of pacing for the future. This work-around only works with thrillers! If a future game designer wants to make anything else, Fahrenheit has no answers for him. The story is really linear, so it doesn't show future storytellers how to construct a branching storyline and make it work. Fahrenheit tries to convince the player that there's more than one possible direction the story can go in, but there really isn't. Only the ending can really be determined by the player. So while Fahrenheit may seem impressive, it's not giving future game designers anything to work with. Fahrenheit is a very good game. But in no way is it "almost perfect". Share Share this post on Twitter

11-13-2005, 05:01 PM	#8
Dylan_Dog Physicist Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 122	MoriartyL, I agree with many points you mentioned (apart from the points on joystic/gamepad controls coz I only used keyboard and mouse). "PERFECT" is a relative term and varies from gamer to gamer. I for example thought that graphics were awesome, that music was awesome and that interface was superb and that the immersiveness of the story worked 100% therefore it was perfect. But dissecting and analysing all the aspects of any game or movie or song or piece of art yields criticism and somewhat-unseen flaws usually creep into existence. There is no such thing as "purely perfect". Now, I am 21 years old, athletic, with excellent reaction time and lots of patience; relaxed person and open minded. My previous favourite games were Half-life (1 and 2), Broken Sword series, The Longest Journey, Blade Runner, and EA Fifa series and Evolution Soccer series. From this description you would gather that I am a fan of good story; i have no problems with bit of action or intense timely-reaction sequences; i love a touch of appropriate violence here and there; i am a great fan of 3rd person adventures; i like simple and elegant interface in the game; and i appreciate graphical and musical (technical) aspects of the game. So for me, this game did the trick. As to the flaws and inconsistencies in the story, there are heaps, just like in any hollywood movie (apart from maybe Oscar-nominated films), but the story as whole did manage to immerse the player really well and keep him/her playing right through the end. So far I haven't met anyone who played the game and hasn't finished it, which ultimately for the developer is a big success. Share Share this post on Twitter

11-14-2005, 12:31 AM	#10
Momcat Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Oregon Posts: 22	Well, I really wanted to get into this game and eventually buy it, but the demo just killed it for me. The second time I had to start over and go through the entire intro again I said "That's it" Hey, I'm a working lady - I only have so much time to spend on a game (or a demo) before I have to shut it down and get back to making this computer pay for itself. Share Share this post on Twitter

11-14-2005, 05:34 AM	#13
SKIPPER SEARCHING ON Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Natick Ma. U.S.A Posts: 61	From what I've gathered this game will take some serious thought before I make any decision to get it. Share Share this post on Twitter __________________ IF I HAVE NO CONTROL OVER IT, THEN I WILL NOT WORRY ABOUT IT.

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