[mycroft]

Hmm...Razor1911 was the oldest(founded in 1985) and most prolific piracy group. This sure is a big blow to the piracy world.

By the way, in my opinion...for a band to survive solely on the revenue collected through tours and concerts, they must be significantly popular in the first place. The "All music should be free" paradigm can only apply to bands which have a well established fan base. As far as integrity of the band goes...they all have their set of rules and paradigms. Some are more stringent than others.

There are different kinds of bands and different kinds of music. Some of which cannot be played live.

OT: I noticed that East Hastings was not on the 28 Days Later soundtrack. A coincidence ?

[BacardiJim]

To take a line from one of my favorite movies: "Hanging's too good for him! Burning's too good for him! He should be torn into little bitsy pieces and buried alive!"

[mag]

Originally posted by mycroft
By the way, in my opinion...for a band to survive solely on the revenue collected through tours and concerts, they must be significantly popular in the first place.

Well, they probably aren't doing concerts the way that a big name band like Metallica has concerts. But doing live entertainment on any scale, even if it is small gigs at various places, provides a steadier source of revenue than CD sales. A band has to have something to make a publisher want to sell their album in the first place, whether that is popularity, recognition, or just good old fashioned talent. It can be extremely difficult for most smaller bands to get their first CD.

Actually, the whole file sharing thing really helped a lot of smaller bands because people who wouldn't have heard their music before suddenly found out that they liked it and started going to their concerts.

mag

[Erkki]

I've forgotten the exact detail in the beginning of the thread, but as I remember
- he was the head honcho of a big warez group. this is organized crime we're talking about.
- he did it for YEARS

how is 4 years too much?

I do think IP is evil though. So is money. etc.

[remixor]

Originally Posted by mycroft

Hmm...Razor1911 was the oldest(founded in 1985) and most prolific piracy group. This sure is a big blow to the piracy world.

By the way, in my opinion...for a band to survive solely on the revenue collected through tours and concerts, they must be significantly popular in the first place. The "All music should be free" paradigm can only apply to bands which have a well established fan base. As far as integrity of the band goes...they all have their set of rules and paradigms. Some are more stringent than others.

There are different kinds of bands and different kinds of music. Some of which cannot be played live.

I agree with both of your pints, regarding products and regarding feasability of live material. Not all bands are the "singer, guitar, bass, drums" variety. Many bands require sampled material and complex equipment to perform their work. And what about artists who record all their material themselves and thus cannot perform live? Anyway, unweildy ensembles leads to...

OT: I noticed that East Hastings was not on the 28 Days Later soundtrack. A coincidence ?

No coincidence at all. GYBE is simply not the sort of band that wants their music put on a soundtrack album. I can understand where they're coming from in that respect. By the way, I have to ask: Did you ascertain that I was referring to Godspeed in one of my previous posts (which I was) or was your question independant of that?

[tabacco]

Originally Posted by BacardiJim

To take a line from one of my favorite movies: "Hanging's too good for him! Burning's too good for him! He should be torn into little bitsy pieces and buried alive!"

Reminds me of another movie quote...

Citizen: They shove a living snake up your ass!
Centurion: No, but that's very creative.

(History of the World, Part I)

[BacardiJim]

Some other fitting punishments:

Originally Posted by Kentucky Fried Movie

(Klahn beheads captive with one swing of the prosthetic blade attached to his right wrist) Now... take him to be tortured!

Originally Posted by Kentucky Fried Movie

Klahn: Take him.... to Detroit.
Captive: NOOOOOOOOOOO!

Originally Posted by Holy Grail

And after the spanking... the oral sex.

Well, maybe not that last one.

[mycroft]

Originally Posted by remixor

By the way, I have to ask: Did you ascertain that I was referring to Godspeed in one of my previous posts (which I was) or was your question independant of that?

Yeah. I figured it was GYBE! you were talking about. There aren't a lot of 9 member bands around, you know.

By the way, just read your Explosions in the Sky review on Amazon, and I must say that I agree with all you said.

[remixor]

Originally Posted by mycroft

Yeah. I figured it was GYBE! you were talking about. There aren't a lot of 9 member bands around, you know.

By the way, just read your Explosions in the Sky review on Amazon, and I must say that I agree with all you said.

Heh, I don't even remember writing that review. I'll have to go look it up so I know what I was talking about...

Edit: Ah ok, I do remember now. Yeah, they're sort of going through the paces but I don't think they really "get" it...

[Kingzjester]

Trep, it's David's Rape of the Sabine Women.

[Bastich]

Well mag is doing a good job of arguing my point, so I will defer to him. All I would like to add is that my statement about music being "free" was made when I was tired and I didn't explain it as I should have. When I said "free", I meant not demanding payment. That doesn't exclude asking for it, which is how it should be done IMO.

[Intrepid Homoludens]

Originally Posted by Kingzjester

Trep, it's David's Rape of the Sabine Women.

Thanks. We didn't study that particular work of his closely, but ha! I had some inkling based on the pose of that guy with the nice ass . David had this habit of sticking at least one figure in some drama queen pose prominently in every painting. Heh...

[mag]

Originally Posted by Bastich
Well mag is doing a good job of arguing my point, so I will defer to him.

It kind of scares me how well I'm getting along with Bastich in this thread. I may have to reevaluate my whole argument if this keeps up. I'm expecting Rod Serling to come out at any moment.

"You unlock this door with the key of imagination. Beyond it is another dimension - a dimension of sound, a dimension of sight, a dimension of mind. You're moving into a land of both shadow and substance, of things and ideas. You've just crossed over into the Twilight Zone."

Now I don't think the sentence that this guy got was that severe, but I have to say it's a little bit disturbing to see such compassionate quotes as "Hanging's too good for him! Burning's too good for him! He should be torn into little bitsy pieces and buried alive!" Maybe I'm just being way too liberal, though.

mag

[lakerz]

I think the punishment is fair.

[Outasync]

I'd like to chime in here. I'm willing to bet that nearly everyone one here has pirated something. Made a copy of a friends CD? Borrowed a program from work to install at home? Installed your copy of Windows on another machine instead of buying another copy? These are all piracy and most people do not even realize it. The maximum penealty for any one of these is 10 years and $250,000 fine.

What this guy did was wrong, but the punishment simply does not fit the crime. I believe that piracy does not hurt companies they way most claim. For one thing is piracy figures were even remotely accurate, no software company could possibly stay in business. Then think about this. What is the most pirated software in the world....Microsoft Windows and Microsoft Office. What is the most profitable company in the world....Microsoft. Piracy doesn't seem to hurt them very much.

[tabacco]

Originally Posted by Outasync

I'd like to chime in here. I'm willing to bet that nearly everyone one here has pirated something. Made a copy of a friends CD? Borrowed a program from work to install at home? Installed your copy of Windows on another machine instead of buying another copy? These are all piracy and most people do not even realize it. The maximum penealty for any one of these is 10 years and $250,000 fine.

There's a massive difference between an end-user downloading a copy of some game from kazaa or BT and actually running the largest game piracy ring in the world.

[ragnar]

(First I say that the guy deserved his sentence, this is just a general piracy post).

I think there are two important points to raise here.

1. I think there is a very unfortunate trend that consumers gets less and less rights and this is especially noticeable in the games industry. You buy a game and it doesn't work properly on your computer you have to hope that the company that made the game releases a patch or you're screwed. Also, the publishers always put on lot of copyright protection which are only effective against the legitimate consumers, the games are always available to be pirated anyway, but effectively making life more difficult for those who bought the game. I think individual piracy in part is a consumers revenge on bad support and lack of respect for the consumers.

2. Competition. Copyright law and patents are a legal way to make monopolies. I think this is bad, both for creativity and competition when it comes to sales. The companies can take out almost whatever sum they want because of the lack of competition. Also, people have always based their works on some other people's work and copyrights and patents effectively stop the development, since you can't take someone else's work and improve it. Imagine if Conan Doyle had got a patent on writing detective mysteries or Picasso on cubism. In my mind, copyrights should be for establishing who wrote/did the thing in the first place, not to limit the spreadth or making monopolies.