[ysbreker]

Just as it did in in the 17th century with Newton and the royal society, in the 19th century with the invention of the steam engine and around 1945 with the invention of the digital computer it is about to change again.

This time it's scary: digital rights managment

read this article here and I think you'll agree with me that we are on the brink of a mayor change on how we handle our rights and freedoms

There are some gotchas too. For example, TC can support remote censorship. In its simplest form, applications may be designed to delete pirated music under remote control. For example, if a protected song is extracted from a hacked TC platform and made available on the web as an MP3 file, then TC-compliant media player software may detect it using a watermark, report it, and be instructed remotely to delete it (as well as all other material that came through that platform). This business model, called traitor tracing, has been researched extensively by Microsoft (and others). In general, digital objects created using TC systems remain under the control of their creators, rather than under the control of the person who owns the machine on which they happen to be stored (as at present). So someone who writes a paper that a court decides is defamatory can be compelled to censor it - and the software company that wrote the word processor could be ordered to do the deletion if she refuses. Given such possibilities, we can expect TC to be used to suppress everything from pornography to writings that criticise political leaders.

[ragnar]

Another reason to use open source software. If you don't like such code, you can always delete the evil code.

[twifkak]

This won't affect your MP3's, but yes, it's evil. I wouldn't say the world's gonna change because of it, but who knows -- the RIAA could start suing shedloads of civilians.

[Erkki]

I'm not very familiar with the law and it's history, but I think legislation has never changed the world radically. As I see it (maybe wrongly) changes happen for other reasons and legislation follows behind.
Or is this changing too?

[twifkak]

Erkki - this is a new technology, not a new law.

[Erkki]

Oops. I didn't pay attention.

[Phil25]

I agree with Erkki! It's a stupid law!

[Zanthia]

Word always changes. But I doubt that thingie gonna change it THAT much if at all. I mean its not that u must buy it or something.

[ysbreker]

Originally Posted by Zanthia

Word always changes. But I doubt that thingie gonna change it THAT much if at all. I mean its not that u must buy it or something.

The thing is that you do have to buy it. Else you're not 'trusted' and you won't be able to listen to any music, read any book, run any program if the big captains of industry (who are all greedy bastards*, right?) get their way.


* a company does anything to increase shareholder profit, if increasing shareholder profit means murdering little kitten: murder little kittens. If increasing shareholder profit means donating lots of money to the poor little kitty fund, then donate money to the poor little kitty fund...

[remixor]

Originally Posted by ysbreker

The thing is that you do have to buy it. Else you're not 'trusted' and you won't be able to listen to any music,

Well, unless you actually OWN it, anyway.

read any book

Er...what? How can they stop you from reading books?

run any program

Again, unless they're legitimate.

[Tanukitsune]

So this is a program that rats on you? Its a stool pidgeon? But if you own illegal stuff then why who would buy a program that does that? Or maybe I didn't get it?

[remixor]

This is almost exactly like my post in the BS3 piracy thread. I didn't originally intend to put it in both places, but when I was done I remembered there was another thread in which it would probably be more relevant, so I decided to put it here. I added some stuff at the beginning so it makes more sense in the context of this particular thread.


Oh yeah, and Reader Beware! There is a disclaimer at the bottom of this post. Scroll down to the bottom and read it, then come back, read the post, and read the disclaimer again when you're done.


As much as I feel like things like this are an invasion of privacy, it's hard for me to have the attitude that we have brought it upon ourselves. Regardless of what your attitude about big companies is, it seems extraodinarily naive to assume that they're not going to try to protect their financial assets. Many (not all) people have gotten to the point where they don't ever buy entertainment media anymore except in the rarest of cases, simply because it's available freely and more easily online. Certainly it's impossible to own everything you want, but this is not a new thing! We have no inherent rights to have all the media we desire, and we never have! The attitude that we SHOULD be able to own all the music and all the movies and all the games we want (for free, at that) is something I very much worry about. I understand that people think CDs and concerts and movies and everything are too expensive, but it's dangerous nonetheless. I mean, it seems to me that most people are far beyond the point these days of pirating for morally righteous reasons. No, it's because it's easy and free; I'm sure there are many people who are ethical in their practices, and buy things they really like and don't keep the rest, but I sure don't run into very many of them. I mean, I hate saying these things because it makes me come off as some arrogant asshole, but are all the people in this thread who are complaining about BS3 piracy innocent of piracy themselves? It just seems unlikely to me. I mean, I'm not a huge fan of the Adventure Company here. I think they've done a piss-poor job of marketing BS3 and I think they've published a lot of crap and I generally don't like the way they run their company, and I don't think they have a particular standard of quality they strive to uphold, and I think Revolution deserves a better publisher. BUT I am going to buy the game from them anyway. I don't think grievances against the distributing company are justifiable reasons for stealing; for me, this applies to music as well. Why is it limited to games? I could say the same thing about, I don't know, The Flaming Lips, who are signed to Warner Brothers. I don't think music (or movies, or whatever) should be any more "stealable" than games. The worst is when I see people brag about how much pirated material they have. I mean, I'm not going to come burn anyone's computer or something, but to be proud of having X number of gigabytes of illegal mp3s? It didn't take any actual effort besides typing a bunch of stuff into a program that does everything else for you anyway, and it's certainly not an accomplishment.

I don't want to point fingers or sound like I'm being judgmental. I know posts like these (and I know I've posted threads about this subject before on these forums) sound sanctimonious. But when it comes down to it, they're my opinions.


Yeah, I'm sure that was terribly organized. It's 5:50am, I have not slept, and I'm certainly in no position to proofread.

[twifkak]

Originally Posted by remixor

We have no inherent rights to have all the media we desire, and we never have!

Likewise, we have no inherent rights to keep people from having all the media they desire, except (sp?) where laws of 1)theft, and 2)copyright apply. But copyright's not in the U.S. constitution, so for us, it's not an inaliable right.

(Yeah, the "inaliable right" bit comes from the Declaration. Whatever. I'm not a history major.)

[twifkak]

Originally Posted by remixor

The worst is when I see people brag about how much pirated material they have. I mean, I'm not going to come burn anyone's computer or something, but to be proud of having X number of gigabytes of illegal mp3s? It didn't take any actual effort besides typing a bunch of stuff into a program that does everything else for you anyway, and it's certainly not an accomplishment.

But we can feel free to brag about how much we own? How beautifully materialistic! Kill all poor people!

(Yes, I'm doing sufficiently fine, financially.)

Muaha. That's what you get for posting at 5am.

[remixor]

Originally Posted by twifkak

But we can feel free to brag about how much we own? How beautifully materialistic! Kill all poor people!

Well, I wouldn't argue you should take THAT attitude I mean, if one has worked very hard for years and as a result has accumulated a good life for oneself due to diligence and good choices, I think that's worthy of pride. I don't think people should BRAG about anything, but there's a difference between saying "Look how many illegally obtained files I collected on my computer through no real effort of my own!" and "Look how I have excelled in my field and created a decent living." It doesn't mean you need to run around announcing it () but I think it's something one can more reasonably be proud of.

But honestly, it's not like it really matters. I mean, go brag about how many piles of lint you've collected from the dryer filter, for all I care.

[syntheticgerbil]

Well the way I see it, is I pay enough money for other crap, so I should be allowed to steal every now and then. You know, like when you take food out of a grocery store by "accident."

But then I don't really pirate music or games and the only MP3s I have are B-sides to every dumb band I like which I could probably get sued for anyways even though these songs aren't readily available on CDs and such, and neither do I steal from grocery stores anymore. But I think stealing is funny and good for the thief. The thief is usually a funny common man like everyone's favorite Disney character Aladdin. If you love Aladdin, you should love stealing.

[remixor]

Can't argue with that!

[Crunchy in milk]

Originally Posted by syntheticgerbil

The thief is usually a funny common man like everyone's favorite Disney character Aladdin. If you love Aladdin, you should love stealing.

Exactly, I think if you just wear a funny costume while you download the mp3's you're morally and legally covered.

[twifkak]

Originally Posted by syntheticgerbil

Well the way I see it, is I pay enough money for other crap, so I should be allowed to steal every now and then. You know, like when you take food out of a grocery store by "accident."

That I don't do. Not only does it cause a loss of a potential sale, as piracy (yarr!) does, but it also increases the store's cost, by forcing 'em to restock whatever I took.

But I'll take the rest of the comment to mean you were half serious at best, so, uh, Tally Ho! (What'd you call me?)