[valliant]

Hello everyone.
I have completed TBM yester-night (wasn't very difficult, once one got past the *dreadful@#%* crash on Chapter 2 -read about it in the Hints etc. forum) and I am not sure I understood the finale
... and it's not like I'm stupid or smt, but it just cannot be justified after all the trouble the main character went through to get there!
---spoiler!!!---
I mean, he's been searching the whole game for the 5 keys in order to find out why his grandfather, William, died -and who or what killed him. Since he read about the BM portal in the diary and still decided to pursue its discovery, why in the name of Whoever does he kill himself in the end? It's not like he's unleashed 'the Horror' in the world -the portal seems to CLOSE after he reads the verses, not open! And if it was remorse or guilt for all the people he's killed, wouldn't it make better sense to kill himself as soon as he'd found out? (end of Chapter V)
I really cannot make sense of the finale. My best bet is that the story is somewhat similar to the classic movie "Angel Heart" (DeNiro, Rourke).
---spoiler!!!---

In any case, the game is truly grand, a worth-playing/living experience!

[Hammerite]

i agree, the ending was bloody terrible. still, good game though.

[Jazhara7]

The way I understood it was that...

Spoiler:

...he killed himself because every male member of the Gordon Family has been cursed to be a demonic killer, without their own knowing. Remember: All are dead. William dies right at the beginning. Robert has been killed. (by Samuel). James (who was William's son), killed himself. Apart from Samuel himself, no other male Gordon remains to carry the curse in another generation, in the danger that the events repeat themselves.

The problem with evil is, that you can never completely get rid of it. It might always come back somehow.

Spoiler:

But in this case, it was at least possible to get rid of the people that are influenced by the evil.

-

[Manhunter71]

Strangely, my opinion is pretty much opposite to the rest of you - whilst I found the game reasonably interesting, it didnt grab my attention compared to others of a similar genre.

Yes, the storyline was mildly intetresting, the gameplay was ok, the puzzles were pretty logical, the english voice-acting was awful and the atmosphere was pretty non-existent.

I must admit though, that I did have the urge to play it through to the end, and for me the ending was the best part of the whole game.

It was satisfying to see Samuel redeem himself and his family by ending his own life - it gave the story closure - Samuel was the last of his line so therefore the curse was at an end and ther would be no more killings

In my opinion, if you are considering buying this game, try and get it 2nd hand on ebay or from some store selling 2nd hand games

[MisterGo]

I loved this game, specially the ending. I mean it. He kills himself (the topic's title says "spoiler", so...) because all the harm he has done, and to finish the curse.
The ending is PERFECT, although it leaves some questions unanswered: who or what killed william, and who killed the little boy whose name i cannot remember.

[Lucifiel]

It was a decent game, although it was interesting, it became somewhat predictable by the middle of the game.

Spoiler:

When Samuel was at the church and the woman was telling the pastor/priest(can't remember which) about who the killer was, I'd already known who the killer was. Actually, that was when 1 of the patients in the mental hospital was killed. I already kinda like suspected it. After all, given the signs, combined with only a handful of characters in the game, you could pretty much guess at everything.

[Antoinetta]

I thought most of the game was great, EXCEPT for the ending, which I found completely illogical. Robert, abetted by Dr. Hermann was clearly involved in some perverted and bloody research and experimentation, as was Richard, the mad scientist in Wales, but how their researches tie into the curse or storyline is left unaddressed. Logically, it seems that they would be far more likely than Samuel to account for several of the murders. And as far as that goes, who killed the old man, Sir William? It seems unlikely he was killed by any human agency, as without the athletic ability or hi-tech equipment of a James Bond, nobody could climb that tower. And alas, I fear our Samuel is no James Bond.

What I think happened is that somewhere during the process of the game's writing and construction, someone decided to do an ending based on Agatha Christie's 1926 "Murder of Roger Ackroyd."

Spoiler:

As in Black Mirror, the narrator/protagonist the reader/gameplayer has followed from the outset of the story is finally revealed to be the guilty varmint. However, Agatha pulls the stunt off well, there is a dramatic revelation by Poirot at the end, and no major unexplained facts; Poirot swiftly ties all the relevant points together, the guilt of the culprit is clear and there is no shaking of the head and pointing out vast holes in the logic of the explanation.

A totally mouse or book dropping ending needs to be clearly and quickly wrapped up or the suspension of disbelief vital for involving oneself in the story/game will abruptly vanish. This is a literary trick that must be accomplished spectacularly, anything less and it will end up an absolute dud. Poirot did this in "Ackroyd", but there were too many loose ends and too many implausabilities at the end for the game to replicate Christie's feat.

It would have been more logical to have had Robert, Richard (the mad scientist in Wales) and Dr. Herrmann the agents of the curse, preying upon others and eventually each other. Samuel's performance of the ritual would have broken the curse, and far from killing himself, he would have been the hero of the whole affair, breaking the curse, redeeming the family name, and all that bit. Whatever faults this ending might have, it would have at least explained all the murders in a plausable fashion. Except for the murder of the old man, but it would be easy enough to have written in a bit about an extremely horrific, hallucinatory drug, concocted by Richard being switched with Sir William's sedatives or whatever, causing him to imagine the whole thing and fling himself from the tower in sheer terror.

Antoinetta

[MDMaster]

I don't remember if Samuel actually discussed what happened when the Gordons were possessed by a demon, but given what we saw in films and read in books, I'd say a demonic human can climb a tower (reminds me of a certain episode of X-files, first season ) and definitely kill a boy, although Samuel being so many kilometers away is sure puzzling.
Anyway it doesn't leave that MANY questions unanswered that, like somebody said, it's useless to play it since you don't understand what the heck is going on. I'd say it acts a bit like Donnie Darko, leaving some questions unanswered so you can discuss whether they wanted that way or the script really sucked.

[Ninth]

As far as I'm concerned, the ending of BM was just fine.
It didn't leave any questions unanswered but one : who killed Sir William.
But franckly, it didn't bother me, and one could always build some hypothesis.
Like Samuel was already here, and not kilometeres away, he killed Sir William, and then fooled himself to think that he arrived after the murder.
Or Sir William was killed by the demon, in a demonic form. Or he killed himself, which is more likely.

[LauraMac]

what will be interesting is what the prequel/sequel (still not entirely sure where the proposed new game applies itself) will throw into the story line or clarify.

I thought the ending fit the campy brit horror/suspense motif and as the developer said -

Spoiler:

We didn't exactly SEE Samuel die now did we *wink*

So I am definitely looking forward to the aluded to continuation of Black Mirror.

[Jazhara7]

The murderer is always the Gardener.


...uh, wait. I think he's dead too.

Crit! Now my whole theory has to be revised. Of course, this is only a _minor_ inconvenience.


"Colonel Mustard, in the Study, with the Grappling Hook."


Well, that's a possibility too.


-

[Ninth]

Originally Posted by Jazhara7

The murderer is always the Gardener.

Did you play Shannara?
"I AM THE GARDENER..."

Ah, memories...

[valliant]

Originally Posted by Ninth

As far as I'm concerned, the ending of BM was just fine.
It didn't leave any questions unanswered but one : who killed Sir William...Or Sir William was killed by the demon, in a demonic form. Or he killed himself, which is more likely.

After watching the opening and closing cutscenes again, I decided that the best hypothesis is this: the demon/curse unleashed by Marcus's brother (Mordred was it?) approached William in order to possess him and make him 'convert the souls of five mortals' and all that. William wrote "I sense my end is near" -he was nearing the truth and feared that he would be too weak to confront it. So, when the truth about his family became clear to him, he jumped. Yes, I believe that William took his own life before he became victim to his family's curse/demon. There was no James Bond climbing that tower. It was the truth he feared he'd find. It found him, instead.
Now, Samuel, the last man standing, the only one left who could carry on the curse. Of course there were also Robert, Richard and James, but none of them apparently had the mental potential nor curiosity to fall into the demon's clutches. Samuel on the other hand was young, clever, and passioned -possessed one would say, to find the truth about his dear grandfather's death and the truth about his family. Just like William.
In the end, if you watch the two cutscenes and compare them, you'll find a 'circlular' pattern: it ends as it begun. Samuel throws himself over the same tower as his grandfather did, only the spectator's angle is different now. Because now we know why William had to die, or kill himself. And we understand it now: it had to be that way. But Samuel accomplished one more thing, the one that William failed to: he closed the portal, he once and for all abolished the curse and purified his family's carma.

Anyone?
~valliant~

[Ninth]

Originally Posted by valliant

After watching the opening and closing cutscenes again, I decided that the best hypothesis is this: the demon/curse unleashed by Marcus's brother (Mordred was it?) approached William in order to possess him and make him 'convert the souls of five mortals' and all that. William wrote "I sense my end is near" -he was nearing the truth and feared that he would be too weak to confront it. So, when the truth about his family became clear to him, he jumped. Yes, I believe that William took his own life before he became victim to his family's curse/demon. There was no James Bond climbing that tower. It was the truth he feared he'd find. It found him, instead.
Now, Samuel, the last man standing, the only one left who could carry on the curse. Of course there were also Robert, Richard and James, but none of them apparently had the mental potential nor curiosity to fall into the demon's clutches. Samuel on the other hand was young, clever, and passioned -possessed one would say, to find the truth about his dear grandfather's death and the truth about his family. Just like William.
In the end, if you watch the two cutscenes and compare them, you'll find a 'circlular' pattern: it ends as it begun. Samuel throws himself over the same tower as his grandfather did, only the spectator's angle is different now. Because now we know why William had to die, or kill himself. And we understand it now: it had to be that way. But Samuel accomplished one more thing, the one that William failed to: he closed the portal, he once and for all abolished the curse and purified his family's carma.

Anyone?
~valliant~

Yep, makes sense.

[Leo]

But it looks like he was pushed out the window. He did not look as if he jumped on his own free will like Samuel. However your theory does make sense.

[LeisureSuitedLooney]

Originally Posted by Antoinetta

A totally mouse or book dropping ending

Yup, clearly the ending was akin to mouse droppings....


j/k

[Jazhara7]

That theory sounds very logical, however there is something I noticed.

I don't know what the American boxart was like, but the European ones were pretty similar, I think.

In red, there is a pentagram (a pythagorean pentagram, to be exact), which has the symbols from the game round it. Also, there are syllables inscribed in it. The two bottom syllables form word "Lilith", which was an Mesoptoamian Night Demon. The three top syllables from the word "Samael"

This "Samael", caught my attention, and I thought that they put it there, to show that our dear Samuel Gordon was the one destined to be the monster.

So I kept on researching, and found this:

Samael is an important figure in Talmudic and post-Talmudic lore, a figure who is accuser, seducer, and destroyer. Legends referring to Satan refer equally to him, such that Samael is often taken to be the true or angelic name of the Devil, as opposed to the epithet Lucifer or the job title Satan (Adversary).

Samael is etymologized as "the venom of God," since he is sometimes identified with the Angel of death. But the name could also be derived from that of the Syrian god Shemal. Samael is also identified with the Choronzon entity of the Elizabethan ceremonial magician John Dee, and of Aleister Crowley.

And this is partly what I expected. I was wrong in assuming that the developers put those syllables there on purpose. The truth is, that they must have chosen Samuels name on purpose.

About the demon "Lilith", I would like to add that it was a night demon. This might be why Samuel only murdered during the night, but it might also just be coincidence.

Also, the symbols are hebrew, and form the name of the Leviathan.

And the goat-like face in the middle of the pentagram is that of Baphomet (yes, the very same).


All together (including the double rings around the whole thing), it is a satanic symbol.

Did I mention that I love it if developers or authors put hidden meanings into the characters names, or select them for specific reasons, instead of choosing a random name?

Originally Posted by Ninth

Did you play Shannara?
"I AM THE GARDENER..."

Ah, memories...

No, sorry. It is just one of those universal rules: The murder is always the gardener, Don't trust the grand-vizier (especially not those that resemble Snapper turtles), you get the idea.



-

[Hammerite]

Originally Posted by Leo

But it looks like he was pushed out the window. He did not look as if he jumped on his own free will like Samuel. However your theory does make sense.

no, he definetely jumped

[Ninth]

Originally Posted by Jazhara7

No, sorry.

Well, go get it and play it, then!

[Antoinetta]

But in the opening cut-scene, you could see, through the eyes of whatever invaded William's space, the stones of the tower falling below, as the demon or whatever ascended. SOMETHING climbed up the tower and got at William, it also seemed to me he was hurled through the window with considerable force.

Antoinetta