[Stuart]

Whoever it is, I'd love to shake his or her hand!

Just been playing Black Mirror and the pixel hunting has been giving me a headache at times.

So what was the first game that let you press tab or such to see hotspots? They are a godsend as far as I'm concerned, save me much headache even if they do shorten games (but for the right reasons).

[Arial Type]

I think it was AdventureSoft and Simon the Sorcerer 2 (1995). Personally I hate highliters and try to avoid them, but yeah, sometimes they save lots of nerves and mental health)

[rayvio]

Simon2 is the earliest game I remember having it

[Weare6]

Yeah I'm with 'Arial Type' on this. I detest the Hot spot Highlighter.
For me it makes the adventure too easy. (with a few exceptions)
If you can't be bothered looking around an environment for a while and just
want to be told where it is then... I'm sorry your either lazy or impatient.
With the old school adventures they made you work for everything and pixel hunting
was just another part of it. Sure there are people out there that love it ... thats cool.
I know its a button and you can use it when you really need it but its just to tempting
to cheat. I enjoy & appreciate a game more knowing I finished it without any outside or inside
help if you know what I mean. Anyway each to there own I say

[mbday630]

I love highlighters for games. I hate pixel hunting. Especially now that I have my grandsons playing my computer games, the highlighting really makes it easier for them. Kings Quest 7 is the game that started it, I think, (or was it Simon the Sorcerer 2?) and they wouldn't even be able to even play the game without the highlighting at their young age. I just love it.

[millenia]

Yup my first experience was also Simon2 and I have to say I was really impressed. It took a while to become a "standard" though.

[Ascovel]

That "standard", as you call it, creates games where developers are too lazy too make important hotspots easy to differentiate from the environment. I preferred the time when designers were really careful about avoiding pixel-hunting because if not their games would receive worse reviews.

[laffer]

Because of the quite frequent pixel hunting in older adventure games, having highlights when moving the cursor over hotspots could be very convenient.

But I admit I've always enjoyed trying to find everything manually as well, without the game assisting me like that.

But I've always thought it should be one or the other - if there are no hotspots, this should be considered in the design of the game and they should make sure to avoid pixel hunting... small items are fine, but they should be a bit larger than a pixel or three.

But the option some modern adventure games have where you can have every hotspot onscreen highlighted for you just by pressing some key... that I've never been a fan of.
Actually it's a good way of telling whether or not I'm enjoying whatever I'm currently playing as I've found that this option is something I only start using if I'm getting bored with the gameplay and start feeling impatient, just wanting to finish it as quickly as I can.

[Arial Type]

Oh, I just remembered. Shadow of the Comet (1993) had that unique control scheme that when you came close to a pickable object, a dotted line appered, linking characters eyes with the object. It was unusual at first, but after awhile it felt just right in place, and it solved the problem of pixel hunting once and forever. Too bad it hasn't been used in any other game since (not counting Eternam from the same devs).

Shadow of the Comet had some other revolutionary (for its time, of course) ideas, like the very useful diary or the characters that "lived their own lives". Such a wonderful game...

[Fantasysci5]

I can see both sides of why people do and do not like the hotspot finder. I myself like it, and permit me to explain.

Some backgrounds are so gorgeous, but so stylized that it's hard to see a stick on the ground that can be used from just scenery. In those cases, I like the button, just to make sure I'm not missing anything. Unfortunately, I probably abuse the button, and don't look as much as I should before using it. I have to say, though, that I love it when there's stylized backgrounds, or I would never have found anything, especially in the older days where it was just a few pixels that were a slightly different color than the background.

[Panthera]

While the hot spot highlighter has (apparently) been in many games over the years, it seems like Secret Files: Tunguska and SF Puritas Cordis were the games that made the hot spot highlighter a staple in modern AGs.
Before playing Tunguska I hadn't seen the option before (and kept getting stuck not finding a trigger hot spot because I forgot about it) but after Secret Files 2, it's been in nearly every new game I've played.

I like it. It's a nice small hint if I'm stuck and have missed something, without revealing puzzle solutions or parts of the story, which I would have been exposed for when checking a walkthrough.

Originally Posted by Weare6

Yeah I'm with 'Arial Type' on this. I detest the Hot spot Highlighter.
For me it makes the adventure too easy. (with a few exceptions)
If you can't be bothered looking around an environment for a while and just
want to be told where it is then... I'm sorry your either lazy or impatient.
With the old school adventures they made you work for everything and pixel hunting
was just another part of it. Sure there are people out there that love it ... thats cool.
I know its a button and you can use it when you really need it but its just to tempting
to cheat. I enjoy & appreciate a game more knowing I finished it without any outside or inside
help if you know what I mean. Anyway each to there own I say

The highlighter is optional, and it is completely possible to play through the game without using it.
Personally I play AGs for the story, and don't like getting stuck on a small item I can't find that hinders my progress, or not realizing I'm missing a hot spot (this is especially a problem when two hot spots are right next to each other)

I wasn't aware that my way of playing, or what I enjoy in a game makes me "lazy or impatient" and apparently also ruins your gameplay experience because you can't help but cheat if you get the option?
For me, that sounds a bit lazy and impatient. If you enjoy a game more without help, why would you detract from your own enjoyment by using hints just because they're there?

[Weare6]

Originally Posted by Panthera

Personally I play AGs for the story, and don't like getting stuck on a small item I can't find that hinders my progress, or not realizing I'm missing a hot spot (this is especially a problem when two hot spots are right next to each other)

I wasn't aware that my way of playing, or what I enjoy in a game makes me "lazy or impatient" and apparently also ruins your gameplay experience because you can't help but cheat if you get the option?
For me, that sounds a bit lazy and impatient. If you enjoy a game more without help, why would you detract from your own enjoyment by using hints just because they're there?

Sorry I still stand by what I said.
Anyway most games these days do not seem to have this problems of hidden items because the graphics have improved so much you have to be completely blind not to see them. Half of items you see these days just seem to be floating there or so obvious that its a wonder why anyone would need a highlight button to see them. And if you think I use the hotspot button... well I won't lie, yes I do but on very rare occasions... and do I feel good about using it so I can progress, most definitely not.

[ozzie]

Originally Posted by Ascovel

That "standard", as you call it, creates games where developers are too lazy too make important hotspots easy to differentiate from the environment. I preferred the time when designers were really careful about avoiding pixel-hunting because if not their games would receive worse reviews.

I doubt this time ever existed. There was a time without hotspot highlighting while nowadays it's common, that's it. But otherwise I agree: I prefer adventures where interactive objects are easy enough to spot for the player, contrary to those that have a need for hotspot highlighting.
I find it weird that people consider a weakness in design a good challenge. But then, it's the same with arcade games like Spelunker...

[Panthera]

Originally Posted by Weare6

Sorry I still stand by what I said.
Anyway most games these days do not seem to have this problems of hidden items because the graphics have improved so much you have to be completely blind not to see them. Half of items you see these days just seem to be floating there or so obvious that its a wonder why anyone would need a highlight button to see them. And if you think I use the hotspot button... well I won't lie, yes I do but on very rare occasions... and do I feel good about using it so I can progress, most definitely not.

But, If games now are so easy and obvious, how do you even notice and get mad at the hot spot highlighter? If everything is as easy as you claim, nobody would feel tempted to use hints. You don't enter a game location and go "I see within seconds what I need to pick up and interact with here, but I have this really big urge to use the hot spot locator before I click them, and therefore ruin my own enjoyment".

That you don't want to use a hint feature is of course up to you, but I find it perplexing that a feature you claim there is no use for both enrages you and ruins your game play.

Either games now offer some small challenges that make the hot spot locator useful for some, and a temptation for others, or games are so easy the hot spot locator is not needed, and therefore do not pose either a temptation or a big annoyance. (the games being easy might be annoying, but that's not the point here)

[Bastich]

The "scavenger hunt without a list" game mechanic of the graphical adventure genre is the most retarded game mechanic in video game history. It's no wonder that the genre has been delegated to the bargain-bin, casual game dustbin due to it. It's just piss-poor game development in this day and age.

Personally, I applaud any developers who aren't trapped 15 years in the past and have sought ways to make the genre more accessible and enjoyable to play by including hot-spot highlighters. The masochists and nostalgia-blinded fanboys can ignore the feature, so its inclusion is only a positive. For a developer to not include it is just foolish.

[sierramindy]

Hmm, seems to me if someone feels they are *cheating* when using a hotspot in a game, it is because of their own personal beliefs and has nothing to do with the game. The choice belongs to the player and we make those choices each for own own reasons and beliefs. Personally, I never feel like I'm cheating in any game I play because I play each game in the way that suits me best and gives me the most enjoyment, which is why I'm playing the game in the first place! It's a game, not an ethics or philosophy class.

[Weare6]

Originally Posted by Panthera

But, If games now are so easy and obvious, how do you even notice and get mad at the hot spot highlighter? If everything is as easy as you claim, nobody would feel tempted to use hints. You don't enter a game location and go "I see within seconds what I need to pick up and interact with here, but I have this really big urge to use the hot spot locator before I click them, and therefore ruin my own enjoyment".

I don't.... I said I rarely use but there are alway exception. And like I mentioned earlier 'most' games don't really have the hidden object problem.... 'but not all' so there will be a small contingency out there that do. And I don't no where you got the idea that the highlighter ' enrages me ', ' makes me mad ' and 'ruins my gameplay experience' - ha ha yeah right! ... what I did say is that I detest the highlighter as games these days don't really need them but if you ask me this 10-15 years ago years maybe the highlighter option would of come in handy as objects where a lot more difficult to spot (2 hotspots too close together etc.)
O.K I may have been a bit harsh when I said 'lazy or impatient' - I probably should of vented that in different words but these days I just do not like having it there its as simple as that and like I previously stated 'this is my own opinion and each to there own'

Originally Posted by Panthera

Either games now offer some small challenges that make the hot spot locator useful for some, and a temptation for others, or games are so easy the hot spot locator is not needed, and therefore do not pose either a temptation or a big annoyance. (the games being easy might be annoying, but that's not the point here)

True true... good point

[Weare6]

Originally Posted by sierramindy

Hmm, seems to me if someone feels they are *cheating* when using a hotspot in a game, it is because of their own personal beliefs and has nothing to do with the game. The choice belongs to the player and we make those choices each for own own reasons and beliefs. Personally, I never feel like I'm cheating in any game I play because I play each game in the way that suits me best and gives me the most enjoyment, which is why I'm playing the game in the first place! It's a game, not an ethics or philosophy class.

Yes.... your right, point taken. The choice does belong to the player...
Although I still personally do not like the highlighter... this is solely my own opinion.
Also I admit I was harsh in saying 'cheating the experience' and 'lazy and impatient'
not the words I should of expressed.

[Ascovel]

Originally Posted by Bastich

The "scavenger hunt without a list" game mechanic of the graphical adventure genre is the most retarded game mechanic in video game history. It's no wonder that the genre has been delegated to the bargain-bin, casual game dustbin due to it. It's just piss-poor game development in this day and age.

Are you sure of that? Because such game mechanics are used effectively in other genres, including top selling action games. Recently for example in Super Meat Boy and Batman: Arkham Asylum.

[marvio]

Originally Posted by Stuart

Whoever it is, I'd love to shake his or her hand!

Just been playing Black Mirror and the pixel hunting has been giving me a headache at times.

So what was the first game that let you press tab or such to see hotspots? They are a godsend as far as I'm concerned, save me much headache even if they do shorten games (but for the right reasons).

Amen brother!!

Actually we could summrize the "3 things that make you stop playing an AG" thread with> Black Mirror!!

It does pretty much, everything wrong

Pixel hunting - Check
Horrible voice acting - Check
Bad animation/can't skip - Check
Predictible story - check
Bad puzzles - Check
One dimensional characters - Check


Sorry, just finished playing it about a month ago, still gong through my healong period