[Arkay]

So I won an auction on ebay for a copy of The Last Express. Its actually the first release, with the original Broderbund box art (which I prefer a great deal over the Interplay re-release). Now, I actually had a "yarrrr" version of this game which I had never had the time to sit down and really play from beginning to end, but every time I started it up I remembered how much of a masterpiece it is, in every sense, how immersive the music and voices are, how amazingly effective the art style is.

Anyways, so I ended up paying 25 dollars total for it, and the manual, reference card, jewel case with 3 cds, and original box are all included. Seeing as how I got it more as an adventure game lover/collector, what do you guys think about how much I paid?

I know that the adventure game scene is forever linked with the notion of abandonware seeing as how it really was one of the first graphic genres on the PC, and as such some games are impossible to purchase in one form or another. I'm just curious to see if anyone thinks I overpaid (not that I can do anything about it now) and if any of you have done something similar (had a copy of a game but decided to get a complete boxed version just for collectings sake).

I guess a part of me is wondering why I paid that much for such an old game, and one I could play already, but I tend to feel as though the great games are the ones I should own.

Also, this is my first post. I've browsed this site and forum for quite a while, because adventure gaming will always be my greatest love on the PC, and though it is in very deep stasis right now, I'm sure one day will return as strong a genre as it once was.

[Lacrima]

Personally, I think you're lucky to have found such an offer, since every time I see the Last Express on eBay it's at least without the box and usually only the cds in some jewel case (though I only browse eBay.de and .co.uk and not .com). I always wanted to try that game since it is praised so frequently, but I neither want to pay for just a cheap jewel case, nor do I know if the game is actually to my liking, since it's a first person-adventure (which I make a rule not to play) and said to be quite extraordinary. All in all, I think 25 Dollars is rather a bargain for a rare complete game with a very limited original print. Besides, it's legal, which Abandonware isn't, as far as I know, and much nicer to look at than some .bin/.img/.rar or whatever format downloaded games come in.
I think many here would easily pay 25 Dollars for any classic adventure with box etc., if they wanted the game. Heck, people pay easily 100€/$ for some games. As far as I remember there was a discussion not too long ago about what one's most expensive adventure purchase was. Sorry, can't seem to find it at the moment, but I think some people actually reached the 200$ mark.

And welcome. (For what it's worth. )

(Hm, I just remember how I re-bought two games not out of the wish to replay them after my old copies were in quite a bad condition, but simply to have them.)

[Once A Villain]

Originally Posted by Lacrima

...nor do I know if the game is actually to my liking, since it's a first person-adventure (which I make a rule not to play)...

Make an exception for this one at some point. It's greatness. Absolute greatness. It never quite feels like a first person adventure, for one thing. Most first person games give you that sense of being all alone, and you never see what "you" look like. In The Last Express, the train is teeming with life. Great characters are around every corner. And the character you play, Robert Cath, is on screen so much that it just never seems like a first person game. Normally I'm very conscious of whether I'm playing in third person or first person, but in The Last Express the thought never entered my mind because I was so immersed.

[giga]

I think the game is still worth full price, not as a collector's item but as the great game it still is. Nothing compares

[AFGNCAAP]

Welcome, Arkay.

Don't fret it - you are not alone; a lot of people here acquire the fullest possible releases of their favourite past games. And I think $25 for TLE isn't bad at all (but some resident eBay experts should comment on that, not me) - I paid much more for mine, in any case.

Myself, I normally prefer to spend money on a game I haven't played. However, a couple of months ago I stumbled across nice, cheap and sealed box of Riddle of Master Lu, which had been one of my first adventure gaming loves, and I couldn't resist such a temptation. I believe I would have if it was an online auction, though - it was mainly the fact of unexpectedly finding a "forgotten" physical copy that made me buy it.

Originally Posted by Lacrima

it's a first person-adventure (which I make a rule not to play)

Why?

[No_doubtsy]

25$ is a bargain for a rare, out-of-print game. I played The Last Express about 5 years ago, it was the most unique, wonderful, emotional game I had ever played. The ending is so beautiful. I told myself I was going to play it again someday but sadly I never had the time. Look what I found on Wikipedia...

The Last Express - one of the biggest failures in gaming history

That's tragic and Psychonauts is there too.

[Arkay]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...MEWA%3AIT&rd=1

Thats a link to the actual auction. I have a question for anyone here (and I'm guessing there may only be one or two of you ) who has a copy of the game, particularly this first iteration of it: is the jewel case in this boxed version supposed to come with any sort of insert(s)? I am quite anal when I make a "collector's" purchase

Anyways, I also must agree that the game feels nothing like a first person adventure. I've always despised the myst games, and the many horrible clones that followed (I actually find the myst games to be quite well made, just not my cup of tea in the least...the hundreds of clones that followed however don't even get my respect) for their sterile, lifeless, distant approach to adventure. By giving you the first person perspective, it is immediately assumed that this will add a great deal to one's immersion, but it really ends up depending on the player. Personally, still images fail to suspend my disbelief. I am also more of an aurally stimulated player, so games with excellent sound and music can often completely captivate me without having the best of visuals. Also, due to interface/design limitations, most myst-esque games are limited to puzzle solving of the highly logic based order, and frankly, I'm completely discouraged by those. I'm much more swayed by reasoning puzzles, or more aptly, by situations where you need to make an important decision, have a few options, and then experience the consequences. Turning minute hands and hour hands and the like until a popping noise indicates a door somewhere has opened is something I'll leave for the more patient gamers.

In this manner, The Last Express is almost without peer. The train truly feels absolutely alive. There is almost always someone walking in one car or another, and conversations occurring whether you're there to hear them or not. There are also some very historically accurate details that can further help to immerse someone who requires accuracy and realism in their game worlds, like a newspaper you start out with in your inventory that you can read as the game time passes. Walking into the dining car early in the game and hearing a couple of french ladies change their topic of conversation to your entrance, and hearing them talk about you in french (with subtitles underneath, since your character speaks french) is the kind of experience few other games have really tried to incorporate...a little detail...subtleties...

Anyways, I'm glad I held off REALLY playing the game until now, so I can play it with a legitimate copy. But I guarantee that anyone who is turned off by the screenshots and the notion of the game occuring from the first person perspective...the game is most certainly unlike any other first person adventure game out there. I really wish it had done better, or at least developers would make new games with the same kind of ingenious and incredibly artistic graphic style and presentation.

Oh well. I'll let you all know what condition it arrives in God I hope I don't get screwed.

[Legolas813]

I bought the full original boxed game with manual on Ebay for $18.57 shipped back in July.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=150010453798

I regret that purchase, though, because soon after that Gametap added the game to their library, and it plays a lot smoother than the version I bought on Ebay. As soon as I go back to my parents house over holiday break I'm going to get back the box for the game and put the whole thing on Ebay. I'm not a collector anyways, and if I would have found the game on Ebay with just the CDs, I would have bought that instead. Just like I was perfectly happy with paying for Sam and Max on Ebay with just a CD only (no box, manual, jewel case insert). Just extra nonsense that's not necessary.

[Arkay]

Originally Posted by Legolas813

I bought the full original boxed game with manual on Ebay for $18.57 shipped back in July.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=150010453798

I regret that purchase, though, because soon after that Gametap added the game to their library, and it plays a lot smoother than the version I bought on Ebay.

Owned, I guess.

I didn't get ripped off then, just paid a bit more. Yea, I'm not quite sold on gametap yet...what happens when you decide to end your membership...you'll lose access to all the games?

Anyways, please tell me, did your jewel case have any inserts? I don't think the version I'm getting has the original jewel case, since I could have sworn I'd seen a jewel case of it somewhere online with inserts or at least a front case cover.

[Lacrima]

Originally Posted by AFGNCAAP

Why?

Well, let's call it a matter of taste. I don't mean all first-person games are bad, if that is what you were thinking, but I just don't really feel comfortable playing first-person games (in general), and pretty consistent at that, since I couldn't stand them already at age ten or so when a first-person sequence (i.e. dungeon) appeared in an otherwise 3rd-person (or however one would call Albion for example) RPG.
On the other hand, I could actually play Shannara and Death Gate and enjoy them. They are the only ones though and it has nothing whatsoever to do with a generalization of any genre. But I guess I will try the Last Express sometime. Can't hurt, can it?

And have fun, Arkay.

[Legolas813]

Originally Posted by Arkay

Yea, I'm not quite sold on gametap yet...what happens when you decide to end your membership...you'll lose access to all the games?

Yes, you lose access to all the games when and if you unsubscribe. Of course, right now you can prepay for a year at only $4.95/month (deal ends October 22).

Originally Posted by Arkay

Anyways, please tell me, did your jewel case have any inserts? I don't think the version I'm getting has the original jewel case, since I could have sworn I'd seen a jewel case of it somewhere online with inserts or at least a front case cover.

There were absolutely no inserts. My jewel case, box, and manual look EXACTLY the same as the picture in your auction.

[Arkay]

Originally Posted by Legolas813

Yes, you lose access to all the games when and if you unsubscribe. Of course, right now you can prepay for a year at only $4.95/month (deal ends October 22).



There were absolutely no inserts. My jewel case, box, and insert look EXACTLY the same as the picture in your auction.

Thank you for allaying my fears! I understand the gametap argument of course, and was aware of that deal. Its quite a good price (even if it means having to buy it for a year), but there are some games, only a few mind you, that I would still want to own a real, actual, non-burned physical copy. These games, the Gabriel Knight games, the Wing Commander games, and the aforementioned The Last Express (it is of course a longer list than these...these ones popped into my head), are the kinds of games I want to have working copies of 5 years down the road, or 10 even (god willing there will be a way to make them work), because in my mind they are analogous to an excellent book or movie, and they're worth owning.

The adventure genre was my first love, and as a result I have a lot of classic games in my collection, probably worth good money on ebay, but I wouldn't part with them because of how important they are to me. The Last Express is that kind of game for me. And I'm sure everyone has THAT kind of game.

[Legolas813]

Originally Posted by Arkay

And I'm sure everyone has THAT kind of game.

Oh, of course. I will never get rid of my real copies of Day of the Tentacle and Fate of Atlantis. Especially Day of the Tentacle. That game just means so much to me, don't ask me why.

[Arkay]

Originally Posted by Legolas813

Oh, of course. I will never get rid of my real copies of Day of the Tentacle and Fate of Atlantis. Especially Day of the Tentacle. That game just means so much to me, don't ask me why.

God don't get me started on that game. I was such a fool for not liking it the first time I tried it...and apparently the second and third times too. I already owned Full Throttle, had finished it and totally loved it, and then borrowed the other classic Lucasarts titles from my friend back in Jr. High, and for some reason when I tried Day of the Tentacle the first time I absolutely hated it!

I recently gave it another shot via ScummVM, and I don't know what it was (maybe its the fact that I'm a lot older now), I loved it. Not only do I love it, I think its one of the best adventure games ever made. God, at first I thought it would be so tedious to have to figure puzzles out having to take into account two other time periods, but the puzzles were so funny and ingenious. Anyways, truly a classic. Wish I'd bought it when I bought Full Throttle, but we all make mistakes.

On that note, I have to confess, I STILL haven't been able to get Sam and Max to "click" the same way DOTT eventually did. I just get stuck everytime I start it up and I don't like using walkthroughs, so I just go back and forth between generic gas stations and then the circus and then I just get frustrated and quit. I'm not as patient as I used to be I guess. Sigh...ADD sucks.

[Legolas813]

Yeah, Sam and Max just isn't the same and can't top Day of the Tentacle, IMO. Maybe it's because I first played DOTT well over 10 years ago and I didn't play Sam and Max until just this year. Who knows.

[AFGNCAAP]

Originally Posted by Arkay

Anyways, I also must agree that the game feels nothing like a first person adventure. I've always despised the myst games, and the many horrible clones that followed (I actually find the myst games to be quite well made, just not my cup of tea in the least...the hundreds of clones that followed however don't even get my respect) for their sterile, lifeless, distant approach to adventure. By giving you the first person perspective, it is immediately assumed that this will add a great deal to one's immersion, but it really ends up depending on the player. Personally, still images fail to suspend my disbelief. I am also more of an aurally stimulated player, so games with excellent sound and music can often completely captivate me without having the best of visuals. Also, due to interface/design limitations, most myst-esque games are limited to puzzle solving of the highly logic based order, and frankly, I'm completely discouraged by those. I'm much more swayed by reasoning puzzles, or more aptly, by situations where you need to make an important decision, have a few options, and then experience the consequences. Turning minute hands and hour hands and the like until a popping noise indicates a door somewhere has opened is something I'll leave for the more patient gamers.

For the most part you are describing Myst clones, which, though numerous, probably aren't even the majority of 1st person AGs. See Legend games, or the Tex Murphy series - they could hardly differ more. And while it is true that The Last Express is unlike most first person adventures (Mystlike ones or non-Mystlike ones), this statement is needlessly limiting - it's in many ways unlike most games, period.

Originally Posted by Lacrima

Well, let's call it a matter of taste. I don't mean all first-person games are bad, if that is what you were thinking, but I just don't really feel comfortable playing first-person games (in general), and pretty consistent at that, since I couldn't stand them already at age ten or so when a first-person sequence (i.e. dungeon) appeared in an otherwise 3rd-person (or however one would call Albion for example) RPG.
On the other hand, I could actually play Shannara and Death Gate and enjoy them. They are the only ones though and it has nothing whatsoever to do with a generalization of any genre.

I see. I was afraid you were making the same assumption about all such games resembling Myst, which is a pet peeve of mine (the assumption, not Myst). If you simply can't get into first person perspective, that's fine by me. As the saying goes, there is no accounting for tastes. (But Death Gate and Shannara are two of my favourite games, so your taste is quite obviously excellent, anyway. ).

[Arkay]

Originally Posted by AFGNCAAP

For the most part you are describing Myst clones, which, though numerous, probably aren't even the majority of 1st person AGs. See Legend games, or the Tex Murphy series - they could hardly differ more. And while it is true that The Last Express is unlike most first person adventures (Mystlike ones or non-Mystlike ones), this statement is needlessly limiting - it's in many ways unlike most games, period.



I see. I was afraid you were making the same assumption about all such games resembling Myst, which is a pet peeve of mine (the assumption, not Myst). If you simply can't get into first person perspective, that's fine by me. As the saying goes, there is no accounting for tastes. (But Death Gate and Shannara are two of my favourite games, so your taste is quite obviously excellent, anyway. ).

One of my favorite games of all time is Companions of Xanth. I'm not limited in the variety of first person adventure games I've been exposed to. I just have a strong dislike toward the ones lacking energy/life/personality.