[Aurebesh]

Here's a short list that I made of stuff that was in the Bone comics but was omitted from the game adaptation. I made this list from memory, so if I missed anything, please add it.

1. The winter scenes in the forest.

2. The big council of the rat creatures with the Hooded One - since this scene is missing, the Hooded One only appears briefly in the end of the game, and it's a little unclear who he is exactly to those who didn't read the comics.

3. All the bar scenes with Smiley and Phoney (the omitting of these scenes may cause a little problem in the beginning of the next game).

4. When Bone first meets the rat creatures, one of them is angry at the other for calling him fat, but the sentence in which he actually called him fat (i.e. "Comrade! We are about to feast! Quick! Get your fat carcass behind this bush and get ready!") is missing from the game, so it's a little confusing why this argument started. In fact, at first I thought perhaps my computer skipped this part when it loaded it (like a music CD can skip a part of a song if it's scratched or something), but after replaying the scene twice I realized it's just not there.

[Orange Brat]

In some random interview it was mentioned that the winter scenes were intentionally changed so that the game download would be smaller.

[fov]

Originally Posted by Orange Brat

In some random interview it was mentioned that the winter scenes were intentionally changed so that the game download would be smaller.

Random interview?!

*walks away grumbling*

[Erwin_Br]

Omitting the winter scenes I can understand, but everything else... The game is already too short, and now I read that they've excluded some important details relating to the story. Why? --Afraid of making the game run too long?

--Erwin

[Aurebesh]

Originally Posted by Orange Brat

In some random interview it was mentioned that the winter scenes were intentionally changed so that the game download would be smaller.

Another good example to why this horrible business model must become extinct, at least when it comes to important adventure titles.
I remember this interview, it's where I first learned of the idiotic episodial PC games idea.

Originally Posted by Erwin_Br

Omitting the winter scenes I can understand, but everything else... The game is already too short, and now I read that they've excluded some important details relating to the story. Why? --Afraid of making the game run too long?

Yes, you're right, the winter scenes are not that important to the story. However, omissions #2 and #3 from my list are important to the story. As for omission #4, it's not really important, but the absence of this sentence is very weird because the rest of the scene is there. I think they omitted this sentence by accident (at first I thought my computer was too fast for this game so it "skips" parts)

[Orange Brat]

What's so horrible about an episodic format? Nothing. If the game is better suited for it, then it should be used. My own little endeavor will be making full use of both it and digital distribution.

[insane_cobra]

Syberias were episodic games too, when you think about it.

I don't think any of those omissions are unforgivable, they'll just have to make appropriate changes to the sequels to tell the story in a slightly different way. No big deal. Personally, I miss snow the most.

[Lucien21]

I don't understand people reluctance to episodic gaming.

After all TV series are inherintly episodic. Most Fantasy novels are episodic.

There is always the chance of cancellation part way through as has happened with many TV series. And yes it might be annoying if you were enjoying that series, but so what. You still had the enjoyment of the episodes that did exist even if you have no ending.

I see it as a perfectly acceptable way to tell a story.

Adaptions are another area. You are never going to get a scene for scene adaption when moving an ip to another medium therefore complains about changes or ommissions are a moot point. As long as they are sticking to the overall aim and spirit of the story changes are a necessity from a non interactive to interactive medium.

[Erwin_Br]

I don't think anyone's really against an episodic format, but against the downloadable format that forces developers to leave out certain stuff to keep the file size down.

We're already complaining about the very little things you can do in big games like Syberia. Now we're playing a small game with very little things to do. That's not helping.

--Erwin

[AFGNCAAP]

Originally Posted by Lucien21

I don't understand people reluctance to episodic gaming.

After all TV series are inherintly episodic. Most Fantasy novels are episodic.

There is always the chance of cancellation part way through as has happened with many TV series. And yes it might be annoying if you were enjoying that series, but so what. You still had the enjoyment of the episodes that did exist even if you have no ending.

I see it as a perfectly acceptable way to tell a story.

Well, yes, but Bone is aiming to tell one big story over the course of several games. Unlike, say, Delaware St. John, where every episode is set to feature a separate case. Now, correct me if I am wrong, but Out from Boneville has no real closure, the next game won't have a proper beginning etc. So if Telltale fell into financial difficulties (hopefully they won't) and didn't finish their endeavour, the situation would be akin to cancelling LOTR movies before Return of the King was released, rather than to cancelling a TV series. Add to that the first episode is generally considered to be disappointingly short, and I can understand the frustration.

Adaptions are another area. You are never going to get a scene for scene adaption when moving an ip to another medium therefore complains about changes or ommissions are a moot point. As long as they are sticking to the overall aim and spirit of the story changes are a necessity from a non interactive to interactive medium.

From Aurebesh's post I gather that they did go almost scene-by-scene route rather than re-imagine the source material, though. So removing single scenes or lines of dialogue does seem odd, especially since it apparently hacks the story. Note: I am unfamiliar with both the comic book and the game; just basing on others' impressions here.

[Udvarnoky]

Originally Posted by AFGNCAAP

Well, yes, but Bone is aiming to tell one big story over the course of several games. Unlike, say, Delaware St. John, where every episode is set to feature a separate case.

That's actually more what Telltale is aiming for. From the first AG interview:

The Telltale folks believe that long, epic games are not the most effective way to tell a story, and would rather tell their tales in small doses—though they caution that their planned projects should not be labeled as episodic. Episodic, which describes games such as AGON and television shows such as Alias and 24, implies one long story told in small chunks, with each successive piece effectively requiring you to be caught up on what's going on. While often compelling, it usually does more harm than good as potential fans are leery of jumping on in the middle of a story. It's not a model that has worked well before in gaming, and it's not the goal for Telltale.

The goal, rather, is to create something in the vein of a popular television sitcom such as Friends or Frasier. Over their respective ten- and eleven-year lives, these shows chronicled an enormous amount of change in their principal characters' lives—yet they never functioned as serials, each week ending with a cliffhanger and characters always left in precarious situations; rather they consistently served as pleasant half-hour diversions that could easily be missed or skipped or watched out of order with minimal disruption to the viewer's understanding of the situations.

Now, correct me if I am wrong, but Out from Boneville has no real closure, the next game won't have a proper beginning etc.

Of course it will have a proper beginning. Now as for the ending to Out from Boneville, it depends what you mean by "closure." The game definitely ends with there obviously being more story to tell, but a game can be satisfying without having a complete wrap-up (Not saying everyone found Bone 1 satisfying, but I think it was the intention at least ).

Really though, I agree with you about Bone. I believe it's an exception to Telltale's general rule and that we can expect other licenses to have games that are much more self-contained. Bone's sort of unique in that it tells one big story, and I think Telltale picked it more because of the general awesomeness of the license more than whether or not it was appropriately episodic.

Also, play the game.

[AFGNCAAP]

Originally Posted by Udvarnoky

That's actually more what Telltale is aiming for. From the first AG interview:

Ah, OK. (With one nitpick to the interview, though: AGON episodes seem rather self-contained, moreso than Bone's. But maybe someone who actually played both should comment on that. )

Also, play the game.

Sorry, I won't. Unfortunately, the demo didn't impress me and more thorough reviews confirm my doubts. I might reconsider if after three-four episodes released the word of mouth is positive and Telltale proves to pay attention to players' feedback.

[Kolorabi]

Originally Posted by AFGNCAAP

Sorry, I won't. Unfortunately, the demo didn't impress me and more thorough reviews confirm my doubts. I might reconsider if after three-four episodes released the word of mouth is positive and Telltale proves to pay attention to players' feedback.

But ofcourse, then you've got the problem that you'd be jumping into the story without knowing what happened in the earlier episodes... sure, Telltale will be sure to say that you can play each game without having seen the earlier games, but if they're going to follow the comics, I kind of doubt that'll be possible.

[Jackal]

Originally Posted by Erwin_Br

I don't think anyone's really against an episodic format, but against the downloadable format that forces developers to leave out certain stuff to keep the file size down.

Of course, keeping the file size down for dial-up users is a choice, not a requirement. AGON downloads are way bigger than Bone's (let alone the 1GB downloads for demos like Dungeon Siege 2).

And yes, AGON's episodes are self-contained, where Bone's are not.

[AFGNCAAP]

Originally Posted by Kolorabi

But ofcourse, then you've got the problem that you'd be jumping into the story without knowing what happened in the earlier episodes... sure, Telltale will be sure to say that you can play each game without having seen the earlier games, but if they're going to follow the comics, I kind of doubt that'll be possible.

I forgot to make clear that if that happens (ie. I change my mind about Bone in a few months' time), I'll most probably start playing from the beginning.

[Kolorabi]

Originally Posted by AFGNCAAP

I forgot to make clear that if that happens (ie. I change my mind about Bone in a few months' time), I'll most probably start playing from the beginning.

Out of curiosity, how much would you be interested in paying for that?

I.e. if you decided you wanted "in" at episode four, would you spend $60 on episodes 1-3 (and then an extra $20 on episode four)? Ofcourse I'm assuming that we'll get some kind of discount for the earlier episodes, but there's probably a limit to how low they'll go.

I wonder how they'll deal with this. Like you, I certainly don't want to jump in at episode three or four without having played the episodes before it. But at the same time, there's a limit to how much I'm willing to pay for that (especially if future episodes are as short as ep. 1).

[AFGNCAAP]

Originally Posted by Kolorabi

Out of curiosity, how much would you be interested in paying for that?

That's not something I can answer easily. Where I live, videogames market behaves crazily: some premiere boxed releases are sold for as little as $5, so I admit I may be hard to please in that regard. Purely hypothetically, I can see myself paying even the nominal $20 for episode - but only if gameplay time was increased to an acceptable standard. But honestly, I'd be more comfortable with a one-digit price (it also depends on how many games are there going to be in total, which I expect Telltale should know for sure by the release of 4th episode). However, as I've already said, there are other things that would need to be fixed as well.

I guess that's just a trap of episodic games. I've been known to impulse-buy a game I knew was far from perfection. I really can't see myself doing that with something that only works as a part of a bigger whole.

[Terramax]

Originally Posted by Orange Brat

In some random interview it was mentioned that the winter scenes were intentionally changed so that the game download would be smaller.

It shouldn't really matter. When you pay $20 you expect the story told in full, right?

[Lucien21]

Originally Posted by Terramax

It shouldn't really matter. When you pay $20 you expect the story told in full, right?

Why?

When you bought Star Wars: Episode 1 was it complete.

Was Fellowship of the Ring complete.

It's perfectly acceptable to tell a story in a serialised format.

[insane_cobra]

Originally Posted by Terramax

It shouldn't really matter. When you pay $20 you expect the story told in full, right?

No, you expect what you've been promised, and Telltale said there won't be any snow long before the game's release. And that thing about the smaller download, while probably true to some extent, was mostly an excuse. They'd have to make a completely new set of geometry and textures if they decided to go with the winter scenes and that would delay Bone's release for at least another month, possibly more.