[Jackal]

Originally Posted by bigjko

I even suggested a whole new genre, so that games sans quicksaves be considered entirely seperate from games with quicksaves.

I don't think you need whole new genres, just a re-imagining of the current genres. But either way, anyone getting uptight about what you're saying isn't understanding. Removing quicksaves from games made with the current mindset (punishment system) is a colossally bad idea. Re-designing games to make quick saves redundant is out there waiting to be explored.

But Jon, your pessimism is probably throwing people. If we're speaking of hypothetical game design, let's hypothetically assume the developers will stay true to it, without falling back into old patterns.

I just want to discuss this, and am pondering just starting a whole new thread, instead of driving even more people from this thread.

Yeah, you totally posted this idea in the wrong thread. But still, it's pretty obvious you weren't saying you wanted quick saves removed as a general rule for current games.

I now realize that would've made a whole lot more quieter discussion. But back when I opened my mouth in the first place, I hadn't even realized that was what I wanted.

Still time to start one. If you want to, I can even try to splice the relevant posts from this one to that one. Mind you, I suck at merging, so the result would probably look like mutated cabbage. But still.

[insane_cobra]

Here's another feature I'd like to see in all games with some kind of narration: suport for external translations. Of course, the very nature of games could pose some problems (in addition to scripted speech, there are often dynamic taunts, multiple characters speaking at the same time, words as parts of geometry or textures etc.), but I think it would be enough if there was support for translating all writen text (including the menus), dialogue, narration and cutscenes.

[bigjko]

Originally Posted by insane_cobra

Here's another feature I'd like to see in all games with some kind of narration: suport for external translations. Of course, the very nature of games could pose some problems (in addition to scripted speech, there are often dynamic taunts, multiple characters speaking at the same time, words as parts of geometry or textures etc.), but I think it would be enough if there was support for translating all writen text (including the menus), dialogue, narration and cutscenes.

Heck yes. It doesn't sound like such a big deal to implement, either (though, obviously, that depends on what type of game). Open-source games often have a huge number of volunteers working on translating. Heck, Open Transport Tycoon Deluxe (although, without any sort of narration) even has an Icelandic translation.

Originally Posted by Jackal

Still time to start one. If you want to, I can even try to splice the relevant posts from this one to that one. Mind you, I suck at merging, so the result would probably look like mutated cabbage. But still.

Thanks, but no thanks. I think I'd rather just quote some relevant stuff from this thread, and avoid mutated cabbage at all cost.

[stepurhan]

Apologies for coming over all heavy-handed. It just that when you posted this

Originally Posted by bigjko

And that's not being selfish? If the game includes a quicksave option, that means it's designed with that in mind. That everytime someone says to the level designer: "Isn't that a bit too hard?" or "Won't this bit be a little frustrating?" the designer just replies: "Hell no. The player just quicksaves before it, then he'll have no problem with it."

in response to this

Originally Posted by insane_cobra

To each its own, that doesn't mean there shouldn't be a quicksave option cause not all people think like you.

it sort of made it sound like you were accusing insane_cobra of being selfish for wanting a quicksave option included.

Thsi is sometimes the disadvantage of having to type out our point of view and not be able to sit round a table discussing something. It's easy to get uptight and not fully understand what people are saying.

If I now understand you correctly, what you were getting at is you think games are being designed in a way that virtually requires the player to use quicksaves. If that's a correct interpretation then I can see how forcing players who don't want to break up their play with quicksaves to use them could be seen as selfish (on the part of the designers at least).

I ztill stick to my original assertion that it's not in a designer's interest to do this. (See post above) However, I don't play enough of the sort of game likely to be affected (like I said, I suck at platformers) so possibly I'm getting a rose-tinted view of these things.

You do have a good argument and I personally favour some sort of autosave or checkpoint system over the anti-immersive quicksave option. Just for games where you can die or otherwise be forced to start something over that is.

Apologies again for taknig the argument to a level beyond reasonable (albeit fervent and enthusiastic) disagreent.

[Dasilva]

what I'd like to see is...

I'd love it if developers wouldent sqeez out sequels so close to the release of the original game, If they make a sequel I want it to have an improved or new engine. Compare NOLF 1 & 2 compared to KOTOR 1 & 2. Kotor 2 was not a huge success, it got average reviews, but the first Kotor got amazing reviews. IF you make a sequel make it something to remeber.