minimalist art - a viable style?
 

I posted this over on indiegamers. Sorry about the cross post, but I while they have a good grasp of general business and marketing issues, they don't know adventure games. :)

Is it realistic to make a story driven game with an ultra-minimalist art style? Something like the style used in the Good New Bible? http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/magazine/3501430.stm

For reasons that I won't bore you with, I'm considering replacing all my game art with this style. I can see a number of major advantages for my game in particular:

1. My game is very large, and is based on stories. This art style is easy to create. It's extremely practical for my needs.
2. My game is based on writing, and deals with abstract concepts and ambiguity. This style suits it.
3. My game at present has inconsistent art styles. I am guessing that even if "minimalist" isn't popular, it's much better than "Inconsistent"?
4. This style will make my game instantly recognizable, memorable, and will be a talking point.

Could it work? The nearest thing I can think of is ASCII Star Wars. http://www.asciimation.co.nz/ though my game would have smoother flowing lines.
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I think it has the potential to work and have a powerful impact if done right. I take it that this minimalist art is going to be fully animated. Is that right?

There are some people who I think will be put off by this alone. In the same way that there are people spurn text interfaces because they think point-and-click is an improvement, some will spurn a game because they think pretty graphics are better. Not a reason not to do it. Just something to be aware of.

It is important that the style fits the game itself but you seem to be confident that is the case. A different visual style can definitely make people feel differently. As I mentioned in another thread recently, the film La Haine is entirely black and white despite being filmed in colour. This makes the whole thing feel darker which perfectlly suits the tone of the action.

If minimalist art will do the same for your game then I think you should go for it.

I myself am getting a bit tired of all those 'stunning graphics' that look so much alike. But maybe that's just my taste in games :) Anyway, a new style like you propose certainly is refreshing. The only thing that I miss is colour, and that is hard to implement in the style you propose. I know the style well BTW; I practically grew up with the Good News Bible.

It's funny you mention that. Text adventures are a great temptation to me, because I'm loking for the most efficient possible way to tell a story. Saying "you are in a cave" is quicker than drawing or rendering a cave, and it conjures up more powerful images in the mind. However, text has some disadvantages, because sometimes a simple thing takes a long time to describe, and (for the user) typing is slower than clicking. I'm slowly coming round to the idea that minimalist art may be the sweet spot, the optimal compromise for efficient story telling. For certain kinds of story at least.
Yes, that's one of the (secondary) reasons for doing it. At present I'm using a style that's based on photos, and animating this takes FOREVER, yet the results look nothing special. It's really frustrating to take a whole week on something simple like "he climbs up, walks over, bends down, picks up, turns round..." I wish I could just think "it would be nice if a whole crowd ran toward the camera" then animate it in five minutes. Well with minimalist art maybe I can!

That's something I'm still thinking about. Very occasional color could be very effective (as in the Wizard of Oz). But the big question is how to handle outer space and underwater scenes. For most scenes, black lines on white space make the most sense. But the opposite is true in outer space. Maybe it would be too much of a jolt to change styles. Or maybe it will be entirely appropriate. But that's a minor issue that I can worry about later.

Just to put all this in perspective, I have spent literally years (developing part time) on the graphics of my game so far, and a minimalist approach would mean dumping all that work. It would be a major, major step. But the benefits are potentially enormous, both from a development viewpoint and a marketing viewpoint. So I very much appreciate everyone's opinions.

To me, as a fairly new adventure gamer I've become less dependant on pretty graphics than I was in the beginning of my gaming career. A few years ago I wouldn't have considered a game in minimalistic art style, but today I'd look into it if other aspects as the story and price were to my liking.

Smooth, flowing lines and occasional colour sounds interesting.
What about using different colours of the background for different locations?

Yes, that's the risk, that new users would be put off. But I think the game would look better than the current, inconsistent and rough look.
That's a possibility. Deep colors would cause problems with antialiasing, but if the color was very pale then that would work. I'll have to experiment!

Maybe you can show us some of the drawings you made yourself?

Existing screenshots (the ones I'm thinking of dumping) are here and here. Those pages focus on the Les Misereables scenes, but the wider game has a broad range of styles. I tried to make the inconsistent, sketchy art into part of the story (where the main character can slip between real and imaginery worlds), but I don't think it's working.

As for the possible new look, I haven't experimented yet with minimalism, but I'm fairly sure that using Xara it should be possible to do something interesting. I'll be aiming for something like an animated Good News Bible style. Less is more.

I thought the great variety of graphical styles you were going for earlier (mathematically drawn images, child's drawings, photographs, etc.) had terrific potential. That variety would have reflected the landscape of the imagination, which is, after all, a messy place. And all the more interesting for that.

I just worry that if you lock yourself into a single art style now, you may eventually come to see it as more of a restraint on than an aid for creativity. What has most excited me about Les miserables is that it seemed willing to really break free of all the shackles of convention that set such limits to creativity in mainstream adventure games.

From that viewpoint, staying with a single art style strikes me as a big step backward. Though I certainly appreciate your reasons, and certainly both approaches have their good and bad points. But darn it, those screenshots in multiple styles look so good together! Still, whichever you choose, I very much look forward to the game.

Simo Sakari Aaltonen
(simo:)adventurecompanion.com)

www.adventurecompanion.com

I agree! That's exactly how I feel. The whole point of the game is to explore alternative ideas, variations on ideas, worlds within worlds, different points of view. But until this moment I thought I was the only one who saw it that way. Everyone who sees the game (so far) says they want consistency and polish. I don't want to scare away nine tenths of potential players.

I look forward to others' opinions.

Judging from the screenshots you made public: I wouldn't dump your current, 'inconsistent' art style neither for a minimalistic art nor for a consistent, 'polished' one. In fact, your current work looks very interesting, if you indeed manage to bring this seemingly endless variety of locations, worlds and art styles in your game to life.

Minimalistic art, however, doesn't seem like a good idea to stick with (to me at least). Pretty pictures do back a good story, after all, and I imagine it'd be much harder to make a game stay interesting if it looked like my miserable attempts to paint. Then, one could say text adventures look like text on paper (a point hard to argue) and still can tell an amazing story, but how popular are those games now? If you are afraid you would scare off a good percentage of potential target audience - how many do you think will play a text adventure (or one with graphics similar to prehistoric paintings on walls) as long as you plan Les Misérables to be?

I do not agree. Each and every style I've seen on the links you provided look appealing.

Agrees!

Still, it would be a lot easier to give an opinion on which art style I prefer if I had some sceenshot examples in minimalistic style as well.

As much as I think a game using a minimalistic style would be very intriguing to play, I think the current "inconsistent" style is quite awesome as it is, and that you should stick with it, particularly since it seems to fit better with the theme of the game as you've described it.

I agree with Squinky.

--Erwin

I didn't realise you'd put a lot of effort into art already. An inconsistent style can work in a game if the setting is suitable for it. (i.e. lots of disparate locations) Any game set in a particular locale (say a city) needs to maintain a regular look for that locale (even in comparing rough locales to the areas of high society the art needs to look similar)

For a game that uses a wide variety of art styles and gets away with it you should check out The Museum of Broken Memories This exhibits a high details style for the central area but a variety of different approaches for each of the room's puzzle areas. Might make you reconsider chucking a load of work if the same basic approach would work for your idea.

Yes, that's the kind of thing! But could it have worked as a commercial game?

This link is the first of 23 pages of Annie Vallotton art, so you'll soon get the general idea. :)
http://www.biblical-art.com/artist_a...lt=2&pagenum=1
Please note that if I did move over to that style, then the number of scenes in the game would greatly increase. What you lost in detail you would gain in freedom to explore. Or that's the theory.

So far the majority of people who have seen the screenshots say "stick with them," and the majority of the (very few) people who have seen early builds of the game say "change them." Maybe the solution is to show more people an early build of the game.


Edit: I was going to give a URL for you to download the game as-it-is but I'm going to upload a video of the game instead. Watch this space!

You could make a short video of the game (maybe even with your own commentary? I'd love that) instead of giving an early build away. In fact, I'd actually prefer a trailer of some sort. Or am I blind and you are already offering one?

Done! I think. It's my first time on YouTube, so I've no idea if this will work, but it should eventually appear here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o0hTnFF97po

I ae no idea how long these things take to process. I can't see it yet.

Wow. It looks very good! It would be such a pity if you threw all of that away. Or even part of it. I like the different styles very much.

I'm very impressed.

I really appreciate the support guys. Saying such nice things about my humble efforts!

Five minutes ago I just received some news that may change everything. The first samples of music arrived from the main composer for the game. It's powerful stuff. I am blown away. You guys can't hear it yet (sorry! Spoilers and all that) but it's... wow... I've got it on loop as I type. It's really deep, powerful, eternal, layered, memorable stuff.

The new music would fit a minimalist art style. Or put another way, anything that is less than perfectly polished would sound wrong next to this music. I'm thinking in particular of the "death of Eponine" animation that took me over a week to complete. It's frankly embarassing next to the sublime music that I'm listening to right now. I am strongly favoring the minimalist approach at this point. The new music is REALLY good.

There's another thread on adventuregamers about innovation in adventure games. Brothers and sisters, if I can pull this one off (a big "if", and it will be a LOT of work) then you ain't seen nothin yet.

I absolutely love what was in the video! It is fresh, invigorating, and offers endless possibilities.

My take on the consistency issue is that people who want consistency, in order not to be jarred out of the flow of the game, want to be lulled, calmed, and mesmerised. Nothing wrong with that, but my impression is that you are looking to stimulate. I definitely feel that the multiple styles achieve the latter better.

I really feel you should not try to compete with software houses who have a dozen graphic artists working round the clock on nothing but the graphics. Your totally unique strength involves variety, individuality, flexibility, and freedom. There is enormous appeal in never knowing what the next screen will hold, in terms of not only content but style as well.

Maybe the single factor on which you should base the decision whether to keep the multiple graphic styles or go for a single one is: which will you be able to have more fun with? Given that you will be giving years of your life to this endeavour, please make sure you do not turn the project into a burden.

Chances are that if you have fun with it, the kind of audience you wish to reach will also enjoy it. But bottom line, whatever you choose, I will be happy to pay good money to play Les miserables.

Simo Sakari Aaltonen
(simo:)adventurecompanion.com)

www.adventurecompanion.com

So am I, and I'm not convinced that a minimalistic style can be any better than what you showed us. Great video (and thanks for the commentary), the variety of stuff blew me away. A pity we didn't get much about how all of this is to fit into the storyline (an idea for the next trailer maybe?).

Anyway, I favor your current style. But maybe samples/sketches of your new idea could convince me/us otherwise.

Taking on your comment that people playing the game found the changes in style jarring (which seems to be the main concern) Is this something that could be made clear upfront in the setup/story for the game?

The reason I say this is that I suspect most people found it jarring because they are used to a consistent style and so will expect it unless told beforehand. If you knew that different worlds and looks were involved (if the very lack of consistency could be promoted as a feature of the game) then I suspect it would probably come across much better.

I loved the stuff as well by the way. I wasn't sure about the boat when you approached it but when you said it was part of "kid's world" then it fit in (see, it really is less jarring when there's an explanation for it. :D )

Good accent as well. I think I almost recognised the town where you live. I have at least known towns very like it. :P

A very good question! I love being able to just throw in anything that looks cool. And I love the color and detail of some of the images I'm able to use (generously donated by various folks). But on the other hand I often have ideas that I can't use because they would take too long to draw or (especially) to animate. So on balance I would have most fun with the fastest method, which in the long run is the minimalist one.

At present I've had to remove almost half the game world (the past/future/other nations and undersea parts) because I simply can't get them all added in time. But with simpler graphics I could have the whole thing ready in the first release of the game, and that's really getting me salivating.

Finally, a polished and consistent but minimalist style might, just MIGHT get closer to the Holy Grail of story telling: Give the reader just enough hints and no more, so they create the most incredible story and graphics in their head as they read. That would be just sublime. Maybe it's an unrealistic hope, but you have to dream.

What would you think of minimalistic characters on the current backgrounds?

Yes, that's the plan. The back story revolves around the hero's unwanted ability to move between "objective" and "subjective" realities. I have a new intro section that begins with a video of me walking up a hill near my house, then this becomes the hill at the start of the game, just to drive home the point about layers of (un)reality. (The main character animation was based on me - its a long story)

HOWEVER... even if I explain it, I think most people won't get it. First, people tend to form judgements very quickly. I will have lost half the potential users before they even get as far as the exolanation for the odd art. Second, the concept is fundamentally complicated (at least until you get used to it). I want the game to be accessible not just to sci-fi geeks, but to other people as well.

If I do go down the minimalist route, that's the section I will miss the most. The kids' world has some really fun parts, and most of it is drawn by my own children when they were younger, so I'm quite attached to it. On the other hand, a sketchy style gives far more potential for using kids' drawings, just in a different way...

It's an interesting idea. But it's the backgrounds that change most and have the most obvious jaggies. Also, a major advantage of uber-simple backgrounds is the potential for more creative backgrounds. Take the city streets in Paris for example. I don't think any feature on the video, but I have several thousand generic streets that are created from the same hundred houses. So all but a few of the streets look boring. Which is frustrating to me, bacause if you look at any paintings of nineteenth century the streets look amazing! I want to suggest streets like that. I can do it with very simple sketches, but I can't do it with any style that takes time to draw. And the sketches can easily draw on copyright images, while more detailed pictures can't. So many possibilities!

Not exactly minimalist but a different graphics style with minimal animation whilst still maintaining a level of detail.

Menulis

That's a really good example, thanks! Obviously I plan for mine to be smoother and to show more background, but it's good to see the precedent for simple sketches being animated.

Here are three "minimalist" screenshots, so you can see what I'm talking about.

Most people haven't see the full size art from the existing game, but trust me, there's a BIG difference. I still haven't decided whether to switch styles, but I am sorely tempted, as the new style offers so many possibilities (as it's quicker to create).

http://www.lesmisgame.com/work_in_progress/scene1.gif
http://www.lesmisgame.com/work_in_pr...ithcosette.gif
http://www.lesmisgame.com/work_in_pr...riverbank2.gif

I've been comparing the two different styles for a short while now and my first impression is: keep the old style. Imho it'll be a completely different game with the minimalistic style, at least for the eye. It's not that I don't like the new screenshots, on the contrary. They are very elegant and I really like the woman by the window. But it's such a huge difference from the original screenshots which I immediately were impressed with and liked.
The minimalistic screenshots definitely need some colour or it'll be hard on the eyes playing a game with a mostly white and not so much to look at -screen. (My opinion again of course.)

What's holding you back from just throwing the minimalist style in the mix you already have? Wouldn't that be the ideal solution?

The main reason for all this is that, based on everything I can discover, non-adventure gamers like polish and consistency. And non-adventure gamers are in the vast majority. Even if all the new stuff I added was minimalist, more than half of the game would appear unpolished and inconsistent.

I'd also need a completely new set of sprites and new work patterns for the minimalist sections, and if I'm going to all that trouble then it's not a great leap to just make everything minimalist and be done with it.

Having said that, if the new art gores down like a lead balloon then I'll have to try plan "C." One person suggested that I keep the existing art but shrink it down and design the game so all that stuff happens inside a window. Like maybe you take a book off the shelf, and each book opens ot become a window on another world, with its own distinctive art style. Shrinking the art into a window-within-the-game would make the quality look better. (But it would also make floors into a nightmare! Sludge doesn't like narrow floors, and many of mine are already very narrow indeed). So that's the fallback position.

If it turns out that most people like the new style, then fear not, the existing animations and stuff won't be wasted. I'll probably create an archive of free Sludge resources so anyone can use them to make their own Sludge game. Or donate them all to Squinky. There's a couple of very nice animations that nobody's seen yet (ideal for a mind-blowing sci fi story), so it would be a shame to lose them completely.

Even though I think it would be foolish to throw away years of work, I kind of like the style of the recent screens too (I have a feeling they might look very cool animated), so I say that it's all up to you...

Those pics would look great with simple watercolour effects. The buildings and stuff look too solid and precise compared to the living creatures so I think watercolour would readress the balance.
Great pics though.

That's a tricky problem. Adding a ton of color and precision takes a long time. The simpler it is, the more I can get away with! On the other hand, if I remove the color and bold lines from the buildings then it becomes hard to see what's happening. But I might experiment with giving the character outlines some kind of hint of color. A lot will depend on how it looks when animated.

I actually really like the minimalist style too. Very clean and elegant, and a lot more capable of conveying emotion. Are those actual screenshots from the SLUDGE engine?

Not yet, but they will look pretty much the same, although with slightly more detail. I'm working on some experimental sprites right now.