Puzzleless Games
 

For the past while, I've been slowly working on designing a game based entirely upon a conversation, and have been thinking a lot about puzzleless adventure games as a result. Certainly, puzzlelessness is a lot more prominent in IF than in graphical adventures (or so I've heard; my experience with IF is admittedly rather limited). Still, with more and more underground graphical adventures getting made, I'd quite like to see more experimentation in this regard.

So my question to you wonderful folks is as follows: what would you say would make a puzzleless adventure game fun to play? The ability for multiple outcomes and for your actions to make a difference in how the story progresses, so it won't just feel like you're clicking through a machinima movie? High interaction density with your surroundings? Just plain good writing, art direction, etc. (which, of course, is important no matter what)? Does it need to be a lengthy epic to be worth playing? And of course, is it still a game if it has no puzzles?

Hmmm...there was that game where you were at a couple's home, and you just talked to them. I guess you could call that puzzle-less, unless you'd consider their relationship the puzzle. I don't know, I consider branching conversations, open environments, even simply just interacting with a game's world all puzzles, in a way. Definitely sounds intriguing, though. Hewck, I'd play it, just for the curiousity factor!

The game you're thinking about is Façade. Very interesting and ambitious, I found, despite still lacking a lot in its execution. Its creators are making a new game called The Party along the same vein but improved, and I look forward to it.

By "puzzle" (and yes, I know we've had a LOT of discussion around these forums on the subject) I'm thinking of obstructions that won't let you progress further into the story unless you solve them. Things that get you stuck and make you reach for the walkthrough, in other words.

IF is definitely a good place to find inspiration. There was one in which you mostly just converse with a statue and find out all about who she was and her relationship with the sculptor. The fun in that lies in the way her story unfolds to you based on what you ask.

Our current game is also without puzzles... so I will be watching this thread methinks.

OK, so no puzzles but what about dialogue triggers? Let's say the protagonist stays at a certain family's house, as in Laura Bow 1. There are various issues going on between the family members, which in LB1 you mostly learn about by spying on people having conversations. I can imagine it would make a fun game if you had to uncover all the people's stories simply by asking questions. At first, you know next to nothing about anyone, but general questions will provide clues which in turn trigger new dialogue options, etc.

in a way it's like new information becomes inventory items... instead of 'use monkey wrench on pipe' you have 'use knowledge about murder on butler' ... makes them puzzles in a way.

Yeah, total agreement here; sorry, didn't intend to make it sound like an argument. I was just saying that in any new game, sometimes just learning what limitations the gameworld possesses can be the puzzle. I mean, there are traditional puzzles, sure. But every so often, you get a game like the aforementioned Facade, where you literally are a "stranger in a strange land", in which just basic conversation and understanding become the greatest puzzles, as opposed to "slip newspaper under door to get key", lol. I guess that's why I find your idea so fascinating.

Two other games come to mind, as well. Gabriel Knight 1 had the interesting "tape splice" recorder, which made a really innovative puzzle out of dialogue, in many interesting combinations. And oddly enough, LSL: Magna Cum Laude, a mostly-tedious game that nonetheless had a rather interesting take on dialogue. It had icons at the bottom of the screen, and the player had to "swim" toward icons, to make the conversation continue. There were some pretty varied responses a player could get, as it was solely up to them where to swim and what icons to choose. It was a neat design in a game that seemed pretty "blah" in other ways.

Anyway, as a writer myself, I look forward to seeing this in development. Far too few games have compelling dialogue these days, and I sorely miss seeing it in games. Good luck with it!!

So would you be able to complete the story without having a conversation with anyone?

Galatea. This and Photopia (Which is, design-wise, different from Galatea in that is very linear, ie. the same thing happen at set times, but there are many options to try in between. It also has one, great, puzzle.) are absolute must-plays for anyone who is considering trying their hand at a "puzzleless game", methinks.

Multiple endings has never been a big deal to me personally (I know that some people value it a lot). I can see its value in a short game, but in something longer, I'd rather experience the designer's created ending than make my own.

This I think is more important. There should be stuff to do, or you end up with a movie. "Stuff to do" can consist mostly of dialogue choices, so basically all I've said is that it's cool to be active as a player.

I'd say so, but some would probably call it a toy, movie or a long cutscene.

You should try Japanese visual novels. Visual novels are classified as a sub-genre of adventure games, referred to as AVGs in Japan. Visual novels are especially prevailent in Japan, where they make up nearly 70% of PC games released.

Visual novels are distinguished from other game types by their extremely minimal gameplay. Typically the majority of player interaction is limited to clicking to keep the text, graphics and sound moving.

Most visual novels have multiple storylines and many endings; the gameplay mechanic in these cases typically consists of intermittent multiple-choice decision points, where the player selects a direction in which to take the game. These can be more closely compared to story-driven interactive fiction.

Visual Novels
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visual_novel

There are some nice freeware creation tools. I like Nscripter:
http://nscripter.insani.org/

that sounds like those "choose your own adventures" books that were popular when I was in my early teens. Neat idea.

Well, the conversation is the story. That being said, it's possible to complete the story by just watching and not doing anything. It'll just have a different outcome, is all. Does that make any sense?

I definitely see where you're coming from. Multiple endings, to me, work a lot better when all endings are equally satisfying, i.e. it's not a matter of one good ending and a bunch of mediocre endings. The latter (in my mind, anyway) tends to make one worry about making the right choices, whereas the former gives more room for just playing and experimenting.

Of course, it's harder to write multiple good endings than it is to just write one good ending...

Puzzles serve a few purposes:

1) They prevent players from completing the game right away. (Aka: Achieving whatever goal the game sets out.)

2) They are interesting in and of themselves.

If you find other features that perform the same basic functionality, then you can avoid puzzles.

For example: CRPGs use hoards of monsters to kill, to prevent players from completing the game right away.

By the way, I have lots of random thoughts about NPCs on http://www.mxac.com.au/drt . I don't remember which articles specifically talk about NPCs, so you'll probably have to sort through a lot of them to find something that'll spur your imagination.

Maybe the Japanese like it, but clicking through a story sounds boring to me. In order for something to qualify as a game, it has to offer a sense of achievement. Multiple endings don't do that. You can't compare them, so you don't know if you picked the better one. It's just, wow, look at me, I'm in control of this. Not only that, you can't write as good of a story no matter how good of a writer you are. You can't foreshadow, you can't use plot twists. You can only write a mediocre story where the player feels a sense of control. There are a lot of people that enjoy that kind of thing, though.
Try playing one of the IF's that do that and see if you enjoy playing it. A lot of inventory puzzles are lame, have too many options, and aren't story related, but that doesn't mean they should be eliminated in my book.

That depends on the quality of the story. Good AVGs are in fact really good Interactive Fictions.

I have. :)

Not always the case. Look at King's Quest 6, for example. There are a few goals in that game that are entirely optional, provide more plot points, and give you a greater sense of achievement if you seek them out...but the story doesn't suffer if you never see them.

In that game, there are a handful of variations of a satisfactory conclusion, and the player doesn't necessarily suffer from the sense of having missed out on something--while, at the same time, replaying the game can lead them to a different course of actions with an ending just as happy. Granted, it's one of the few games where the alternate endings enhance the experience, but they do exist.

I think that's something a little different that more adventures should explore. Much more interesting than the multiple endings for me.