[gray pierce]

Originally Posted by Monolith

So there is no story behind those that were forced into it or even give such a concept depth and personality? there is so much to work with. Life isn't so black & white.

I can only wholeheartedly agree with the last sentence. In fact I've been hoping for a long time for a game where you can also play as the villain but there is a difference between say a deranged serial killer or a white supremacist. And from what I've read this isn't one of the many Germans that were forced into commiting these heinous acts. The fact that he runs rather than face up to the facts gives me the idea he doesn't feel the slightest regret or remorse. And this is the main character, the guy we're supposed to be rooting for. Personally I'd let him be caught in the first scene.

Sure such a concept could be offensive to some, but leave out the fact that nazi's wanted to exterminate jews and we have pretty much every big country in the world.

Holland where I live might be the exception(and that's not even a big country) but generally in most countries there isn't an air of mentallity that says white people are suprme to all other races. Also Nazi's didn't just wanted to exterminate jews. They wanted to extermiante the disabled as well, homosexuals, pretty much every minority. That is a very frightening concept and definitely not suited for a game where you at least control the players actions.

Originally Posted by bakana

There are so many problems with this mentality.

1.) You are not "cast in the role" of an adventure game character. They are an independent story character over whom you exert some control. When Guybrush turns and makes an aside to the 'camera,' he is talking to you, the player, a separate person. In other media, you can read a book about Nazis, hell, you can even read 'Mein Kampf,' without completely identifying with the Nazis. Adventure games are no different in this respect.

With a movie or book you don't control the character's actions. To control the actions of a character to some extend makes you thiks character and I just don't want to be a white supremacist.

2.) Even if you were to be 'cast in the role' of a Nazi, that certainly wouldn't be a bad thing. How many film and TV actors have been literally 'cast in the role' of Nazis? Did any of them become Nazis? Did any of them lament the experience? Of course not. It's an opportunity to explore a new and dark facet of the human experience.

There's a difference between acting and playing a game. With acting it more becomes a sort of job, an intellectual exercise as well of course. You're very tense and focussed. Whereas with playing a game you're more relaxed and more enjoying the moment. More iportantly as an actor you're trying to analise the character, see what makes him tick. As a player you generally aren''t so analythical

3.) There are already plenty of games where you can play as Nazis, terrorists, or a fictional Nazi stand-in. These are mostly shooters, which tackle the subject with less nuance than an adventure game would.

First of all you don't know with how much nuance this adventuregame would've tackled this AG. Just cause it's an AG doesn't mean it's itelligent, deep and thought provoking. I also strongly oppose to those shooters. I think to get the player to kill as a Nazi is the worst decission you can make as a game designer.

4.) And perhaps most importantly, ignoring or glossing over difficult or disgusting parts of our human history is SIGNIFICANTLY more problematic and offensive than trying to face them and grapple with them in art and literature. If we relegate the Nazis to simply evil cartoon bogeymen, if we don't acknowledge and explore their humanity and the very real human situations and decisions that led to the adoption of National Socialism - then we deny the fact that this was something done by people, not monsters, we deny the fact that this is something people are capable of, and could happen again, and we tacitly invite such evil to recur.

I again wholeheartedly agree with the last part but this didn't sound like the kind of game that would dig into the characters deeper psyche. I think from your standpoint it very much is a good idea to humanise the Nazis what with right wing extremism on the rise in Europe. But again this sort of game is imo not the way to do it.

I must admit, I do come from a slightly personal standpoint as I'm part Jewish and have heard stories from my mother who in turn heard it from her grandparents. So not entirely personal but slightly yes.