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Adventure Game Scene of the Day - Wednesday 16 November 2016
Some happy relations can turn to some hazard unexpected status; people could change and would sadly harm and hurt each other…
It was because of Adrienne opening a locked box atop an altar (after finding a secret chapel) she unknowingly releases demon, which promptly possessed her husband, that changed him into a human beast. From rage, abuse, and rape Don does everything that turns Adrienne life into living hell.
Feminism voice wasn’t as loud as today or mayhap the game would have to put up with many objections and accusations due to the vulgar and controversial acts Adrienne had put up with.
Roberta Williams wanted to include more scenes with Adrienne and Don as a happy, normal couple, so that Don’s transformation to evil would be more impactful.
But here lies the strength of the lady who her impact over the genre had exceeded everyone else; she was unable to do so, so to maintain the correct pacing for the gameplay ..
“From a “story” standpoint that approach is better, but from a ‘gameplay’ standpoint that’s not better, since Phantasmagoria was a game, the “gameplay” standpoint won, which is as it should be.”, Roberta Said.
Feminism voice wasn’t as loud as today or mayhap the game would have to put up with many objections and accusations due to the vulgar and controversial acts Adrienne had put up with.
If your statement is not intended as a provocation, I can only conclude that you don’t know much about feminism.
First of all, the so-called third wave of feminism was well under way years before Phantasmagoria was released. Feminism is opposed to rape in real life, that goes without saying, and to stereotyping in education, but it is not, and never was, about curtailing the freedom of authors, developers, directors.
Secondly, you seem unaware of the fact that both the rape scene and the violence in Phantasmagoria did indeed cause a lot of controversy, not among feminists, but among the usual suspects: religious groups, concerned parents, teachers. The game was banned in some places, even though it provided the option to censor violent content.
Butter my buns and call me a biscuit! - Agent A
First of all, the so-called third wave of feminism was well under way years before Phantasmagoria was released. Feminism is opposed to rape in real life, that goes without saying, and to stereotyping in education, but it is not, and never was, about curtailing the freedom of authors, developers, directors.
You are right but you probably also know what happens now when something remotely controversial gets released. No doubt that game would have caused a bigger uproar if released now.
Edit: I mean bigger because it’s easier now to show indignation everywhere
Feminism voice wasn’t as loud as today or mayhap the game would have to put up with many objections and accusations due to the vulgar and controversial acts Adrienne had put up with.
I can only conclude that you don’t know much about feminism.
First of all, the so-called third wave of feminism was well under way years before Phantasmagoria was released
http://search.proquest.com/docview/869515028
This thesis concludes that the feminist reading of the game is the most significant, but must be informed by other critical approaches to arrive at a clear conclusion that reads the game as an allegory about the historical development of feminism that celebrates the progress of feminism since the late 19th century but also criticizes it as not being effective in completely stamping out misogyny
Moreover he is right saying that it wasnt loud just because of the fact that social media awareness is changing Millennials in all walks of life ,all genders in all directions, i.e wired world.
I mean bigger because it’s easier now to show indignation everywhere
http://search.proquest.com/docview/869515028
This thesis concludes that the feminist reading of the game is the most significant, but must be informed by other critical approaches to arrive at a clear conclusion that reads the game as an allegory about the historical development of feminism that celebrates the progress of feminism since the late 19th century but also criticizes it as not being effective in completely stamping out misogyny
Yes, and…? Of course there are countless analyses, readings, interpretations from a feminist point of view of films, books, games, whatever. That has nothing to do with my resonse to Advie’s post. I’m sure you know the difference between protesting and analysing.
Moreover he is right saying that it wasnt loud just because of the fact that social media awareness is changing Millennials in all walks of life ,all genders in all directions, i.e wired world.
IT? It = protest? I hope you’re not saying that millenial feminists would accuse a game of portraying a woman who gets raped.
I mean bigger because it’s easier now to show indignation everywhere
Yes, everybody is protesting everything nowadays. But the issue was FEMINISM.
Butter my buns and call me a biscuit! - Agent A
I mean bigger because it’s easier now to show indignation everywhere
Yes, everybody is protesting everything nowadays. But the issue was FEMINISM.
Are you saying there wouldn’t be more feminist voices protesting today about the game on social media or random articles?
(assuming the game would have the same level popularity today)
@karlok
-A research thesis is better than random small post on mighty thin line of Feminism
-Which says its open to critical analyses for clear conclusion, in other words your fact posting is just a fact like some xyz game gets banned in Arab nations
-It means Advie has right to have his opinion to reach clear conclusion as an avid AG gameplayer regardless of his attitude, but he aint showing anti female attitude
-Its a great post i made to have researcher who happens to be Female so that you could not throw another Male opinion bias bait, which is the impression btw
-It means you are dragging advie into derailed discussion of Feminism in reality the Advie paragraph you quoted is just a fact that net exposure through all kinds Media is more than before, there are all kinds of famous people talking about gamergate and what not so its not a vocal minority anymore, (same what wilco said), now could have caused much repercussions, just take you as an example, straw arguments
-Recently ubi censored female body parts but not male ones, imagine Phantasmagoria being released today
-I could start a debate too that why the Husband got possessed and why the Author didnt give choice to us let the wife open the box of Demon? But i wont derail
IT? It = protest? I hope you’re not saying that millenial feminists would accuse a game of portraying a woman who gets raped.
Another straw, you are right i am not saying that, on the contrary i was profiled by Tim as avid female lover , i am all for female empowerment no matter what means they use.
I mean bigger because it’s easier now to show indignation everywhere
Yes, everybody is protesting everything nowadays. But the issue was FEMINISM.
Are you saying there wouldn’t be more feminist voices protesting today about the game on social media or random articles?
(assuming the game would have the same level popularity today)
Words and Deeds
First of all, the so-called third wave of feminism was well under way years before Phantasmagoria was released. Feminism is opposed to rape in real life, that goes without saying, and to stereotyping in education, but it is not, and never was, about curtailing the freedom of authors, developers, directors.
You are right but you probably also know what happens now when something remotely controversial gets released. No doubt that game would have caused a bigger uproar if released now.
Edit: I mean bigger because it’s easier now to show indignation everywhere
, Wilco had to clear up certain point to avoid Karlok provocation 
I mean bigger because it’s easier now to show indignation everywhere
Yes, everybody is protesting everything nowadays. But the issue was FEMINISM.
Are you saying there wouldn’t be more feminist voices protesting today about the game on social media or random articles?
(assuming the game would have the same level popularity today)
Yes, that’s what I think. I’d expect controversy about the gory and/or shocking scenes (although the rape is actually quite tame compared to modern stuff), among the same groups, like teachers and parents. There might be more protests in general, some people might consider the game gross and tasteless, but violence in itself is to be expected in an adult horror game. So I don’t see why female millennials would object to Phantasmagoria. It’s not like it features a damsel in distress waiting for a man to save her – one of those recurring themes that second-wave feminists got awfully tired of. Adrienne is not a helpless victim, in the end she saves herself from a man who hates women for no reason.*
I’ve been playing adventure games since 1986 and I got connected to the Internet in 1995. No social media like today, but we had Usenet with popular groups like comp.sys.ibm.pcgames.adventure and many others. I don’t remember any feminists complaining about the rape and violence from a feminist perspective. Just people being turned off by the violence, both men and women. What I do remember is that me and a few female real-life friends who were also into games, were very pleased that Sierra at least had several female protagonists. Twenty years is a long time…
*I love how Don reassures Adrienne when she wakes up from a nightmare with a male cliche: “I’m just here to protect you” and not long afterwards turns into this monster. Good for you, Roberta!
Butter my buns and call me a biscuit! - Agent A
Nomadsoul, I often find your posts both fascinating and frustrating. Frustrating because it’s like we’re living in two different universes, like Clinton voters versus Trump voters. And never the twain shall meet. I see one long stream of associations. From your remarkable interpretation of a googled abstract (which doesn’t even support Advie’s views) of a thesis you haven’t read, to someone profiling you as an avid female lover. If there’s a connection to my response to Advie’s post, I don’t see it. You pick something and run with it, that’s your modus operandi in discussions. I don’t mean to offend you, but IMNVHO a dangerous one. Still, it’s effective in the sense that I don’t know how to deal with your stream of associations. From where I’m sitting, all I hear you saying is that you think I’m wrong.
@karlok
-A research thesis is better than random small post on mighty thin line of Feminism
-Which says its open to critical analyses for clear conclusion, in other words your fact posting is just a fact like some xyz game gets banned in Arab nations
-It means Advie has right to have his opinion to reach clear conclusion as an avid AG gameplayer regardless of his attitude, but he aint showing anti female attitude
-Its a great post i made to have researcher who happens to be Female so that you could not throw another Male opinion bias bait, which is the impression btw
-It means you are dragging advie into derailed discussion of Feminism in reality the Advie paragraph you quoted is just a fact that net exposure through all kinds Media is more than before, there are all kinds of famous people talking about gamergate and what not so its not a vocal minority anymore, (same what wilco said), now could have caused much repercussions, just take you as an example, straw arguments
-Recently ubi censored female body parts but not male ones, imagine Phantasmagoria being released today
-I could start a debate too that why the Husband got possessed and why the Author didnt give choice to us let the wife open the box of Demon? But i wont derailIT? It = protest? I hope you’re not saying that millenial feminists would accuse a game of portraying a woman who gets raped.
Another straw, you are right i am not saying that, on the contrary i was profiled by Tim as avid female lover , i am all for female empowerment no matter what means they use.
Butter my buns and call me a biscuit! - Agent A
1)Nomadsoul, I often find your posts both fascinating and frustrating.
2)Frustrating because it’s like we’re living in two different universes, like Clinton voters versus Trump voters. And never the twain shall meet. I see one long stream of associations.
3)From your remarkable interpretation of a googled abstract (which doesn’t even support Advie’s views) of a thesis you haven’t read, to someone profiling you as an avid female lover.
4)If there’s a connection to my response to Advie’s post, I don’t see it.
5)You pick something and run with it, that’s your modus operandi in discussions.
6)I don’t mean to offend you, but IMNVHO a dangerous one.
7)Still, it’s effective in the sense that I don’t know how to deal with your stream of associations. From where I’m sitting, all I hear you saying is that you think I’m wrong.
1)Thank you but dont feel offended
2)Yes we are different, i like different mindsets so that i can learn
3)All you need is Conclusion of Thesis
4)Fair enough, i think wilco and Advie have
5&6)PMed you, since you will feel offended
7)No we all are entitled to our opinion
Edit
your pm box is full
No PMs. Whatever you want to say to me, you say it in public.
Butter my buns and call me a biscuit! - Agent A
No PMs. Whatever you want to say to me, you say it in public.
As you wish,
You pick something and run with it, that’s your modus operandi in discussions.
I don’t mean to offend you, but IMNVHO a dangerous one.
Well Advie and Oscar had falling out with you where you were called as a person with assassination list, you also had long meltdown against Asylum Dev. you want me to search the thread?
So the only person with MO is you and your baits, Feminism debate could have turned into something messier and Advie could have said something leading to his ban, like old times
you gave impression of a bait where there was no need so i helped him to diffuse the situation
Didnt mean to offend you tbh just diffusing, you should know better feminism is a sensitive topic
You pick something and run with it, that’s your modus operandi in discussions.
I don’t mean to offend you, but IMNVHO a dangerous one.Well Advie and Oscar had falling out with you where you were called as a person with assassination list,
My what!?! My ASSASSINATION list??
ROTFL! From my killfile (= ignore list) to Iznogood’s kill list to your assassination list. Couldn’t have wished for better proof that you pick something and run with it.
you also had long meltdown against Asylum Dev. you want me to search the thread?
So the only person with MO is you and your baits,
I get the feeling this ASSASSINATION LIST of mine is becoming something of an honor badge. Anybody else want to be put on my highly popular ASSASSINATION LIST? Just say the word. :) Asylum Dev. is certainly welcome.
Feminism debate could have turned into something messier and Advie could have said something leading to his ban, like old times
you gave impression of a bait where there was no need so i helped him to diffuse the situationDidnt mean to offend you tbh just diffusing,
Good of you to mention twice that you were just diffusing, I might have gotten the wrong impression otherwise.
you should know better feminism is a sensitive topic
You’re telling ME I should know better when Advie is the one who started talking about this so-called “sensitive” topic? Heh. Sensitive for whom, for Advie?? 
Nomadsoul, if you think you or any other man can tell me what feminism is and how it should be discussed, then you don’t understand the first thing about it either.
Butter my buns and call me a biscuit! - Agent A
if you think you or any other man can tell me what feminism is and how it should be discussed
I bought Phantasmagoria way back from GoG but still haven’t got around to playing it!
.......which promptly possessed her husband, that changed him into a human beast. From rage, abuse, and rape Don does everything that turns Adrienne life into living hell.
Feminism voice wasn’t as loud as today or mayhap the game would have to put up with many objections and accusations due to the vulgar and controversial acts Adrienne had put up with.
I think it’s a false perception that objections to any kind of story-orientated production i.e. films, TV programmes, books etc that include the abuse of a woman/women are from feminists!
If your statement is not intended as a provocation, I can only conclude that you don’t know much about feminism.
Feminism is opposed to rape in real life, that goes without saying and to stereotyping in education, but it is not, and never was, about curtailing the freedom of authors, developers, directors.
Secondly, you seem unaware of the fact that both the rape scene and the violence in Phantasmagoria did indeed cause a lot of controversy, not among feminists, but among the usual suspects: religious groups, concerned parents, teachers. The game was banned in some places, even though it provided the option to censor violent content.
Karlok, I don’t believe that Advie’s statement was intended as provocation but was just perhaps an overly-sensitive & sympathetic view which exposes a lack of understanding of the female brain along with (sorry wilco)
Are you saying there wouldn’t be more feminist voices protesting today about the game on social media or random articles?
(assuming the game would have the same level popularity today)
No, in this case I don’t believe that ‘feminist voices’ are that relevant; as already said by Karlok feminism was never about curtailing artistic freedom; in comparison to the do-gooder ‘usual suspects’’ loud voices already mentioned that like to speak for a particular group of people (in this case women) without even asking!!
nomadsoul, feminism (actually I hate that word!) is about women having the same opportunities in life as men…. not about portrayals of them in a game, TV show, Film , book etc & not about MISANDRY!!!!
I’m yet pushed to come across any male that gets near to the workings of a woman’s mind but Stephen King’s not bad!
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