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LGBT Topics in Adventure Games

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McCoy97 - 19 June 2017 01:39 AM

Gabriel is not gay. Not in the remake, not anywhere. He’s still the same womanizer as in the original and has a thing for Malia Gedde.
Maybe cakesofdoom meant he looks gay based on his new portrait.

More than “a thing” I would say. Gay must be ruled out. You might argue bi on the strength of the second game, but it can’t be more than conjecture.

     

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I haven’t played the second game in many years and can’t remember any bi actions from Gabe. I say he’s 100% straight and a womanizer who flirts with every hot chick he sees.

Phlebas - 19 June 2017 04:43 AM

Being played by Tim Curry doesn’t automatically make him gay…

Also he wasn’t voiced by Tim Curry in the remake. None of the original voice actors returned

     
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McCoy97 - 19 June 2017 05:05 AM

I haven’t played the second game in many years and can’t remember any bi actions from Gabe. I say he’s 100% straight and a womanizer who flirts with every hot chick he sees.

I also haven’t played The Beast Within in many years - but didn’t he have sex with Von Glover??? I know that there was also a prostitute involved, but I thought that 3-way bi-action was very heavily implied in this scene!

     

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No definitely not. As far as I remember, that von Glover guy “gave” the prostitute to Gabriel for the night as a gift or whatever. Von Glover then left Gabriel alone with the prostitute. That night as Gabriel was sleeping, Von Glover entered the room and started touching him. Gabriel didn’t know about it and definitely didn’t have sex with any of those old guys or anything like that.

     
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McCoy97 - 19 June 2017 02:50 PM

No definitely not. As far as I remember, that von Glover guy “gave” the prostitute to Gabriel for the night as a gift or whatever. Von Glover then left Gabriel alone with the prostitute. That night as Gabriel was sleeping, Von Glover entered the room and started touching him. Gabriel didn’t know about it and definitely didn’t have sex with any of those old guys or anything like that.

     

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nomadsoul - 18 June 2017 05:30 PM

I feel a bit leftist agenda if its not done properly, i think it has to be done properly, not as a acceptance or normalizing tool but something that really does some good to narrative

So, a straight white male as a main character in a game would be perfectly “natural” and “normal” and “default”, but, for example, a black gay woman (or any combination thereof) would be a “leftist agenda”?

Why is a straight white male character the default?

     
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Venkman - 20 June 2017 11:47 AM

Why is a straight white male character the default?

You are answering yourself, why the resurgence now ?? the issue begets itself by treating it as a problem and shoehorned in every other games like some kind of movement rather than fitting narrative properly
It wasn’t an issue when we had lesbians in Feareffect, done properly without politics not shoehorned, but now it seems like diversity agenda is hamfisted like anything, not that i dont like it but feels off manytimes , recent issue with indie game LastNight pretty much nailed the attitude in general of more politics in gaming than ever

That was also the reason why i praised gay black in DragonAge , he was written well
But this is clumsy

 

     

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Nomadsoul, if you read that JJ interview that you yourself posted, she said all the female betatesters loved the gay sidekick and the relationship between them.

Apparently it’s only you who thinks it is clumsy.

     
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BitingWit - 20 June 2017 08:18 PM

she said all the female betatesters loved the gay sidekick and the relationship between them

Yeah is her target audience was focus group of females only? that practically what i said about being political from the outset
What about being diverse and not rule out plenty of other demographics

That article already triggered many people and minorities, read the comments on that page

And her focus group liked it those are all the people or gamers in the world hence i am the only guy who didnt like it is bad correlation tbh

Edit

Here one of the comment on same page

This article is not only offensive, it also provides many poor advice for character and story development and derive “evidence” from generalised assumptions about popular culture and a rose-tinted lens about her own games. Just because you make the NPCs in the game felt attracted towards the protagonist (despite what a dick he is, a la Malachi Rector), it doesn’t mean the player will automatically think the protagonist is hot as well. If the protagonist is a dick and has no redeeming traits (again, see Malachi as example), no matter how many NPCs throw themselves prostrate at his foot, the player simply won’t buy it. In fact, they will feel insulted that the game has such low opinion of the player’s intellect and taste.

Finally, Ms Jensen, just because some male game designers and story writers sexualise female characters it doesn’t mean you should do the same for male characters. Feminism is about challenging sexism, and you are merely reinforcing sexist stereotypes, albeit for male characters.

 

 

     

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nomadsoul - 20 June 2017 09:20 PM
BitingWit - 20 June 2017 08:18 PM

she said all the female betatesters loved the gay sidekick and the relationship between them

Yeah is her target audience was focus group of females only? that practically what i said about being political from the outset
What about being diverse and not rule out plenty of other demographics

That article already triggered many people and minorities, read the comments on that page

And her focus group liked it those are all the people or gamers in the world hence i am the only guy who didnt like it is bad correlation tbh

Edit

Here one of the comment on same page

This article is not only offensive, it also provides many poor advice for character and story development and derive “evidence” from generalised assumptions about popular culture and a rose-tinted lens about her own games. Just because you make the NPCs in the game felt attracted towards the protagonist (despite what a dick he is, a la Malachi Rector), it doesn’t mean the player will automatically think the protagonist is hot as well. If the protagonist is a dick and has no redeeming traits (again, see Malachi as example), no matter how many NPCs throw themselves prostrate at his foot, the player simply won’t buy it. In fact, they will feel insulted that the game has such low opinion of the player’s intellect and taste.

Finally, Ms Jensen, just because some male game designers and story writers sexualise female characters it doesn’t mean you should do the same for male characters. Feminism is about challenging sexism, and you are merely reinforcing sexist stereotypes, albeit for male characters.

 

Around 95% of games are made for the male audience, despite women being 50% of the gaming audience. No one complains about that (well, some women do, but they are rare). So why is it such a bad thing for JJ to admit that Moebius MIGHT have been made primarily for the enjoyment of women? (Not that I think it necessarily was - I enjoyed it even though I’m a guy. Although I will admit it wasn’t a very good game).

Btw.. if you’re going to quote someone on sexism, make sure you choose someone who understands what sexism is.

     

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nomadsoul - 20 June 2017 04:00 PM
Venkman - 20 June 2017 11:47 AM

Why is a straight white male character the default?

You are answering yourself, why the resurgence now ?? the issue begets itself by treating it as a problem and shoehorned in every other games like some kind of movement rather than fitting narrative properly

What resurgence? You believe that the default main game character should be a straight white male, and that anything else, unless done to “fit the narrative” (what does that mean?), is wrong.

You are talking utter nonsense with “fitting narrative properly”. A character’s race or sexuality has little to no effect on most video game stories; they can often be completely interchangeable. If anything, going beyond straight white male stories is going to almost-automatically open up more interesting possibilities, because most of the stories throughout the history of Western civilization and certainly in video games are about white straight males.

If the designers choose not to take those possibilities and simply have whatever you’d consider a “standard boring video game story”, the only major difference being that the main character happens to be a gay black woman instead of a straight white male, that’s fine too.

     
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BitingWit - 20 June 2017 10:35 PM
nomadsoul - 20 June 2017 09:20 PM
BitingWit - 20 June 2017 08:18 PM

she said all the female betatesters loved the gay sidekick and the relationship between them

Yeah is her target audience was focus group of females only? that practically what i said about being political from the outset
What about being diverse and not rule out plenty of other demographics

That article already triggered many people and minorities, read the comments on that page

And her focus group liked it those are all the people or gamers in the world hence i am the only guy who didnt like it is bad correlation tbh

Edit

Here one of the comment on same page

This article is not only offensive, it also provides many poor advice for character and story development and derive “evidence” from generalised assumptions about popular culture and a rose-tinted lens about her own games. Just because you make the NPCs in the game felt attracted towards the protagonist (despite what a dick he is, a la Malachi Rector), it doesn’t mean the player will automatically think the protagonist is hot as well. If the protagonist is a dick and has no redeeming traits (again, see Malachi as example), no matter how many NPCs throw themselves prostrate at his foot, the player simply won’t buy it. In fact, they will feel insulted that the game has such low opinion of the player’s intellect and taste.

Finally, Ms Jensen, just because some male game designers and story writers sexualise female characters it doesn’t mean you should do the same for male characters. Feminism is about challenging sexism, and you are merely reinforcing sexist stereotypes, albeit for male characters.

 

Around 95% of games are made for the male audience, despite women being 50% of the gaming audience. No one complains about that (well, some women do, but they are rare). So why is it such a bad thing for JJ to admit that Moebius MIGHT have been made primarily for the enjoyment of women? (Not that I think it necessarily was - I enjoyed it even though I’m a guy. Although I will admit it wasn’t a very good game).

Btw.. if you’re going to quote someone on sexism, make sure you choose someone who understands what sexism is.

That 50% statistic is probably correct but misleading. It really depends on the games women play so you can’t use it as a blanket statement for any game being made. Does that stat include mobile games and casuals like Candy Crush Saga which tend to attract women more? Are you telling me for example 50% of people who are playing Call of Duty are women? I have a youtube channel dedicated to the Blizzard game Hearthstone, and my analytics show that 95% of my videos are watched by males. I do not market them to males, nor I scew my content towards them, but those are the people who play that type of game. In the same way, a game like Candy Crush will probably have more female players if I were to venture a guess. So my point, your target audience is not 50/50 for every type of game.

     

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SoccerDude28 - 21 June 2017 02:16 AM

That 50% statistic is probably correct but misleading. It really depends on the games women play so you can’t use it as a blanket statement for any game being made

Yup you are right i will ans other points by venkandbitt tomorrow but for now bookmark this article when someone throws incorrect generalized study

http://www.oneangrygamer.net/2017/04/esa-muddies-gaming-stats-between-male-and-female-gaming-demographics/29044/

So many points , people don’t even research and call utter nonsense to others
smh Pan

notice how female is 89% in hidden object

     

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SoccerDude28 - 21 June 2017 02:16 AM
BitingWit - 20 June 2017 10:35 PM
nomadsoul - 20 June 2017 09:20 PM
BitingWit - 20 June 2017 08:18 PM

she said all the female betatesters loved the gay sidekick and the relationship between them

Yeah is her target audience was focus group of females only? that practically what i said about being political from the outset
What about being diverse and not rule out plenty of other demographics

That article already triggered many people and minorities, read the comments on that page

And her focus group liked it those are all the people or gamers in the world hence i am the only guy who didnt like it is bad correlation tbh

Edit

Here one of the comment on same page

This article is not only offensive, it also provides many poor advice for character and story development and derive “evidence” from generalised assumptions about popular culture and a rose-tinted lens about her own games. Just because you make the NPCs in the game felt attracted towards the protagonist (despite what a dick he is, a la Malachi Rector), it doesn’t mean the player will automatically think the protagonist is hot as well. If the protagonist is a dick and has no redeeming traits (again, see Malachi as example), no matter how many NPCs throw themselves prostrate at his foot, the player simply won’t buy it. In fact, they will feel insulted that the game has such low opinion of the player’s intellect and taste.

Finally, Ms Jensen, just because some male game designers and story writers sexualise female characters it doesn’t mean you should do the same for male characters. Feminism is about challenging sexism, and you are merely reinforcing sexist stereotypes, albeit for male characters.

 

Around 95% of games are made for the male audience, despite women being 50% of the gaming audience. No one complains about that (well, some women do, but they are rare). So why is it such a bad thing for JJ to admit that Moebius MIGHT have been made primarily for the enjoyment of women? (Not that I think it necessarily was - I enjoyed it even though I’m a guy. Although I will admit it wasn’t a very good game).

Btw.. if you’re going to quote someone on sexism, make sure you choose someone who understands what sexism is.

That 50% statistic is probably correct but misleading. It really depends on the games women play so you can’t use it as a blanket statement for any game being made. Does that stat include mobile games and casuals like Candy Crush Saga which tend to attract women more? Are you telling me for example 50% of people who are playing Call of Duty are women? I have a youtube channel dedicated to the Blizzard game Hearthstone, and my analytics show that 95% of my videos are watched by males. I do not market them to males, nor I scew my content towards them, but those are the people who play that type of game. In the same way, a game like Candy Crush will probably have more female players if I were to venture a guess. So my point, your target audience is not 50/50 for every type of game.

BitingWit still has a point though - what’s wrong with making a game for women?

     

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Jane Jensen,

One of the most important adventure game designers & writers of all times by day,

and a writer of gay romance novels by night (http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/23963387-the-lion-and-the-crow)...

Seriously, you gotta love the woman :3

     
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