Adventure Gamers - Forums

I know that there is this brilliant archive (created by ATMachine) with tons of “screens” from the unreleased version of The Dig, but I’ve never seen this game/version in motion before:

I wanted to dig (ha ha, get it?) the old topic dedicated to Brian Moriarty’s The Dig from the forum archives. Unfortunately that’s impossible, so I’ve decided to create a new one.

Very cool-thank you

I like the finished game just ok, but the Brian Moriarty version seems so much richer, more complex and interesting.
I’ve always wished some enterprising freeware developer would make the Brian Moriarty version of the Dig using AGS. The design documents must still be around, and some of the graphics are already done.

Just a dream. But I would put a lot of money into a kickstarter for that

TimovieMan - 23 April 2013 12:03 PM

The thing that somewhat bothers me about this version is how much it resembles the actual finished version. All I’ve heard and read was that the game underwent two major overhauls, but I’m not really seeing that.
The only differences appear to be things they *left out* (the fourth crew member for one). A lot of stuff in this version looks like it would’ve improved the game even more!

Go to The Dig Museum or go to Mixnmojo.com Secret History The Dig. Basically the first major overhaul was the major major overhaul was a different game. Designed by Noah Falstein it would’ve had RPG elements, you’d need to find food to survive and there were more sci-fi ideas, like a living city.

Moriarty’s version is closer to the finished project, but some of the graphics were changed and a lot of the more complicated ideas were cut away. Again there were far more complicated science-fiction elements, like a Klein bottle they passed through, causing them all to become left-handed. The climax was also different .IIRC The puzzles were also more complicated but with less of the backwards puzzles (Ron Gilbert term) that crop up in the game. So a lot of the second overhaul was a scaling back

For me it was a mistake to simplify the ideas. As it is The Dig, has all this promise, great atmosphere and beautiful graphics but many of the big ideas, when they’re finally revealed are quite bland. I would’ve welcomed more complexity.

oh also check out http://home.comcast.net/~ervind/digbm1.html

afterglow2001 - 23 April 2013 02:37 PM

[As it is The Dig, has all this promise, great atmosphere and beautiful graphics but many of the big ideas, when they’re finally revealed are quite bland. I would’ve welcomed more complexity.

Really?  I always thought The Dig was about as deep as Lucasarts adventure games got, philosophy-wise.

Lambonius - 23 April 2013 05:53 PM

afterglow2001 - 23 April 2013 02:37 PM

[As it is The Dig, has all this promise, great atmosphere and beautiful graphics but many of the big ideas, when they’re finally revealed are quite bland. I would’ve welcomed more complexity.

Really?  I always thought The Dig was about as deep as Lucasarts adventure games got, philosophy-wise.

Well-discuss… (100 words minimum)

I’m not sure about depth, how deep can an adventure game be

(The following is all in my opinion)

I’d argue the characters of the Dig are particularly bland. The orignal idea was supposed to be like The Treasure of Sierra Madre, but in contrast to the complex characterisations of that film (remember how Bogey starts out as the hero?) the characters in The Dig are simple and 2D. In The Dig the hero is a rather dull jock, and the German starts out a jerk pretty much stays that way. There’s no complexity and little development, we never learn more about them and it feels like there’s a gap where we should. Similarly the science fiction ideas are quite basic, there are thses resurrection crystals that act like drugs. You get addicted and get agressive. What’s more there were once super intelligent aliens, who designed everything but lost themeselves in a different dimension, which just seems to be a lot of pretty lights. The hero overcomes this by not being interested in it.
Compare this with Moriarty’s and Falstein’s more complex ideas

In contrast Maniac Mansion and the first two Monkey Island games are both complex and playful. They poke fun of their genres and have jokes while still being emotionally effective. That’s a very complex balance. The ending of Monkey Island II seems like its breaking the 4th wall but is also creepy, dreamlike and at times genuinely chilling. Also back in the 90s the idea of mixing pirates and supernatural ghost stories was still pretty novel especially when so many games were just copying popular film genres

Zak McKracken is again not very deep but has some wonderfuly complex ideas-a near future world where all conspiracy theories are true, aliens do control the world, the Aztecs did know everything, Elvis lives.

Day of the Tentacle is a sequel to Maniac Mansion that doesn’t repeat the same horror genre. It instead combines Chuck Jones style animation with fun ideas about time travel and popular myths about the founding fathers. Such an odd combination for a sequel

Grim Fandango is probably the most *deep*, combining as it does the idea of the doomed protagonists of a Film Noir with the Mexican afterlife idea of redemption. That’s probably one of the more deep ideas in any game. Do our past actions condemn us? Is there redemption for our crimes? What should one does if one feels trapped by past sins like characters in so many Film Noirs. Should we just accept it and enjoy ourselves (like Hector LeMans/Domino) Can we just buy our way out? (like the lawyer) or can we change? Like Manny ultimately does, working for other people instead of himself.
All this combined with complex combination of different noir and noirish films with Aztec style and an offbeat world of cat races and underwater factories.

So a lot interesting ideas, and combinations of ideas, not that much depth but what do you feel are deep games?

I think this is a discussion for another thread, but I’ll just say for now that I think you are grossly oversimplifying the themes and character arcs in The Dig.  Also, ghost-pirate stories were not particularly original, even in the 90s.

Lambonius - 23 April 2013 07:00 PM

I think you are grossly oversimplifying the themes and character arcs in The Dig.

Yay! Grossly Oversimplifying!

It’s no Treasure of Sierra Madre though, is it?

Brian Moriarty was one of the most brilliant original voices in adventure gaming, Trinity, Wishbringer, Beyond Zork, Loom.
The fact that we lost this game from him and he will now probably never make another one is a damn shame.

Yeah, I can agree with the sentiment that Brian Moriarty’s The Dig might have been a more interesting game than we got, for sure.

I just wish we got a sequel to Loom!  I am definitely a Loom fan.

Bt

I’m an unabashed Dig fan.  I think it’s probably Lucasarts’ most underrated game.  It blew my mind back when it first came out—there really weren’t any other games out there like it.  At least, none that were so cinematic and had such an epic scope.

Blackthorne - 23 April 2013 09:41 PM

Yeah, I can agree with the sentiment that Brian Moriarty’s The Dig might have been a more interesting game than we got, for sure.

I just wish we got a sequel to Loom!  I am definitely a Loom fan.

Bt

Again would love it if some enterprising young adventure game developer went out there and made this. Enough with the Maniac Mansion fangames! On with “The Forge”. I always imagined music by Holst

Oh and again if anyone important enough is listening I would pay money for a kickstarter of this.