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What themes would you like to see more of in adventure games?
Perhaps it might be more true for an individual to say ‘I want/need more diversity’ rather than ‘we need more diversity.’
Inclusion in games just for the sake of inclusion in games might have the opposite of the desired effect, not just for those who are being included, but for those who are not familiar with the ones who are being included. It’ll ring false, tacked on, or, aha! there’s the word I was looking for: Superficial. Even worse, pandering, condescending, or forcing.
I believe that if someone of a particular demographic, be it racial, ethnic, sexual, disabled/less abled/differently abled TakeYourPick, etc made a game in which their ‘type’ (for lack of a better word coming to mind at the moment) were the protagonist or played a significant role in the plot, the game would sell if it was a good game and all other things were equal (you never can 100% predict success or failure).
I wouldn’t think twice about playing a game in which my character was in a wheelchair, or in which my character was Indian, or just about any religion.
However, I am careful to say ‘a game in which my character is’ and not ‘a game about someone who is’. The former takes the person in stride, the latter runs a severe risk of expressing the person like a novelty. ‘Oooh, look, a game about a black person!’ ‘Oh, look, a game about a guy in a wheelchair!’ In my experience, no one wants to be identified by a singular aspect of their entire self. The intention of making such a game/movie/story might be noble, but it shows a lack of skill, grace, and sensitivity.
As much as the media likes to paint people as being ‘tragically this or that’, no one I know thinks about their identity as primarily one thing. At least, no one who is mentally healthy.
Example: I listen to heavy metal; I do not want to be identified/judged/treated as a ‘metalhead’. I play games; I do not want to be treated as a ‘gamer’. I am an avid bike rider of moderate local acclaim; I hate it when people treat me as if cycling was all there was to me. I skate; I am not a ‘skater’. I have what some people would call a ‘sensitive side’ that borders on what many people would call feminine’; I’m heterosexual and firmly male.
Basically, I, and pretty much everyone else I know, just wants to be treated as a *complete* human being. When they see people who share some of their distinguishing hobbies/features/characteristics/etc in stories, they also want those people to be portrayed as *complete* people, with merits and reasons for being there that go beyond the coincidence of color/sexuality/disability/etc. In my experience, they don’t want condescending tunnel-vision tokenism.
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I am careful to say ‘a game in which my character is’ and not ‘a game about someone who is’. The former takes the person in stride, the latter runs a severe risk of expressing the person like a novelty. ‘Oooh, look, a game about a black person!’ ‘Oh, look, a game about a guy in a wheelchair!’ In my experience, no one wants to be identified by a singular aspect of their entire self. The intention of making such a game/movie/story might be noble, but it shows a lack of skill, grace, and sensitivity.
When it comes to works of art in general, hypothetically speaking, I have no problem with seeing, for example, a movie such as ‘Sound of Metal’, that is about becoming deaf and learning how to live as a deaf person. I’d say that movie is about a person who is deaf, where being deaf is this character’s defining characteristic, although not his only characteristic. I would say that he is also a relatively intelligent, nice, empathetic person, but still, it’s a movie about what it is like to be deaf. And because of the format’s limitations (= it’s a movie, therefore it runs for approximately 2 hours, while focusing on one particular topic), the character has to go through a certain process of abstraction (if that is the right word), in this case, this means that this one characteristic of his (being deaf) is put in the foreground. Again, this doesn’t mean that in “reality” being deaf is his one, only characteristic, just that it is his defining characteristic in the context of the said film.
Well, I think adventure and other games can be made the same way, of course, as it has already been established in this topic, as long as the game works as a game (= it’s fun/interesting to play). Adventure game centered on the idea of a person dealing with becoming, for example, deaf could be good, if the development was put in the right and skillful hands. And yes, I can see how this character could be seen as a sort of a “novelty”, although it’s not really about the character, but about his condition. Sometimes, the character himself is not the focus of the story, but rather what that character represents. At the same time, this character can be rather believable, even though (s)he is not fully fleshed-out and we don’t really get to know his or her other defining characteristics (due to the limitations of some narrative mediums, such as adventure video-games, we have to accept that such characteristics do exist, but we simply cannot see them being explored in as much depth as, in this case, being deaf).
Anyway, I hope this makes cents 
, reading through this topic and its many interesting and thoughtful replies was cool 
I can’t really speak for or about you in this regard, but the “I don’t see colour” approach to diversity has pretty much proven a failure. People have a lot of unconscious bias and internalized norms/prejudice/expectations.
.....
Very interesting answer. Genuine question VP - how much of this came from actually working/living/communicating/having relationships within communities of color on a regular basis?
Your response reminds me of a response of well-meaning and well-read people who have little actual experience of talking WITH people they’re talking ABOUT. I don’t want to assume here, so I’m asking. And I hope it doesn’t come across as anything but a genuine question.
I would also like to clear something up - I’m not quite sure what were you trying to say by challenging yourself or not. Did you mean that people who aren’t subscribing to the philosophy of “color matters” (for the lack of better word! I hope you’ll understand me here) aren’t challenging themselves? If it’s a yes, I will respectfully disagree.
For my part, this is one of those things that I will never see eye to eye with you, but I’m not pushing my point of view. I don’t see color, I see merit. And the longer I live the less I like to use blanket statements to talk about people. I have (and continue living) quite a “colorful” life, and a lot of it is the hard-knock life, so I learned from my personal experience that individual merit is what matters. Most of the people I know and live with, don’t like to be grouped (like BB noticed above) in a category. As a matter of fact, majority just want to live and work and enjoy their family/personal lives and be left alone. Quite a few get offended about assumptions about them based on race, that’s where “white savior” expression comes from. Majority want to speak for themselves. And lots who experienced real life losses and hardships aren’t even entertaining this as anything worthy. Again, this is my personal experience and I’m not implying that people have to think the same way.
I have heard racial slurs - that doesn’t mean the whole country is racist, just those people who said them. I have heard incredibly sexist statements, but that doesn’t mean “the whole system is sexist” and “patriarchy = ultimate evil”, just those people are. And I’ve been cheated on, but it doesn’t mean humanity overall is a bunch of cheaters, just those people who did. I’m a big believer in individual responsibility and what one can make out of themselves regardless of circumstances. So, I don’t see color, I see a human being. And I have a great gender/race/sex/age-neutral term I use - an asshole, if you (not YOU 
) aren’t one - we’re cool, if you are - we’re not.
I’m really glad I got to hear what you have to say, by the way, and I hope to hear more, because I feel like the awesome part of all this is that we have different opinions and talk about them, which makes a world much more interesting and exciting place and allows for all of us to grow. I can’t imagine a universe where people all thought alike.
You know what, I have to think a bit longer about games, but the first character that came to mind overall would be Melanie Hamilton Wilkes from “Gone With The Wind”. I couldn’t be more different from her, bur she’s a great person and I’d love a friend like that.
********
BB. I’m low-key starting to think that you’re my long lost brother.
As far as diversity. No, I don’t NEED it, I welcome it. The difference to me is that, like I stated above, the groups that usually seek representation are numerically in a minority within gen pop, so it’s reasonable to expect less games representing them. To me a healthy way to go about diversity is when authors who are INITIALLY wanted to present a story with a certain diverse character in mind (be it their own personal experience or maybe well-researched genuine interest) get all the support they need to create.
But diversity can’t be forced, it becomes no longer sincere (hey there, BB). Calling for, and even actively demanding it, makes many people - at best - write something for the sake of good intentions resulting in complete ignorance, or at worst - cash in on the trend and downright take advantage of it for personal profit. Which, in turn, does a great disservice to true diverse writers (of which there will never be many, just statistically), by drowning their voices in the stream of unauthenticity (I think i just made this word up). All I want for creator is to sit down and genuinely make up a world, a character, a situation - if it happens to be diverse, great, if it doesn’t - also great, because both cases were cases of sincere creation without any limits or incentives in the mind of the author. People should be able to make what they want to make, not what everyone else tells them to.
Very interesting answer. Genuine question VP - how much of this came from actually working/living/communicating/having relationships within communities of color on a regular basis?
Is it alright if I answer this through PM? I don’t want to take over the thread with my ideas or talk to much about my life.
edit:
@millenia: !
@Baron_Blubba: this kind of ties into a talk we were having personally, I hope we can keep the back and forth going, but if you tire of it, that’s cool as well. I really enjoy our more casual exchange.
@Bon: thanks for your input as well, in particular the suggestion of “Sound of Metal”, I just checked out the trailer and I want to see this movie now.
Perhaps it might be more true for an individual to say ‘I want/need more diversity’ rather than ‘we need more diversity.’
Inclusion in games just for the sake of inclusion in games might have the opposite of the desired effect, not just for those who are being included, but for those who are not familiar with the ones who are being included. It’ll ring false, tacked on, or, aha! there’s the word I was looking for: Superficial. Even worse, pandering, condescending, or forcing.
I believe that if someone of a particular demographic, be it racial, ethnic, sexual, disabled/less abled/differently abled TakeYourPick, etc made a game in which their ‘type’ (for lack of a better word coming to mind at the moment) were the protagonist or played a significant role in the plot, the game would sell if it was a good game and all other things were equal (you never can 100% predict success or failure).
I wouldn’t think twice about playing a game in which my character was in a wheelchair, or in which my character was Indian, or just about any religion.
However, I am careful to say ‘a game in which my character is’ and not ‘a game about someone who is’. The former takes the person in stride, the latter runs a severe risk of expressing the person like a novelty. ‘Oooh, look, a game about a black person!’ ‘Oh, look, a game about a guy in a wheelchair!’ In my experience, no one wants to be identified by a singular aspect of their entire self. The intention of making such a game/movie/story might be noble, but it shows a lack of skill, grace, and sensitivity.
As much as the media likes to paint people as being ‘tragically this or that’, no one I know thinks about their identity as primarily one thing. At least, no one who is mentally healthy.
Example: I listen to heavy metal; I do not want to be identified/judged/treated as a ‘metalhead’. I play games; I do not want to be treated as a ‘gamer’. I am an avid bike rider of moderate local acclaim; I hate it when people treat me as if cycling was all there was to me. I skate; I am not a ‘skater’. I have what some people would call a ‘sensitive side’ that borders on what many people would call feminine’; I’m heterosexual and firmly male.
Basically, I, and pretty much everyone else I know, just wants to be treated as a *complete* human being. When they see people who share some of their distinguishing hobbies/features/characteristics/etc in stories, they also want those people to be portrayed as *complete* people, with merits and reasons for being there that go beyond the coincidence of color/sexuality/disability/etc. In my experience, they don’t want condescending tunnel-vision tokenism.
While I get what you’re saying, I still think this “tokenism” isn’t really such an issue people make it out to be. Usually it is the racists, sexists etc. who will raise noise about these supposed tokens or “virtual signaling” when in truth they are just annoyed having these people represented. Then unfortunately some “regular” people start believing it. I think this is at least partly the fault of the click-bait media of today, where two indignant tweets will be broadcasted as “social media outrage” etc.
Of course I would want wonderful, deep, fleshed out games about diverse characters, but first of all, I just want games with diverse characters. They don’t have to be perfect, it’s already progress that they exist, that they are visible to people. Just representation is a remarkable thing and things can be perfected along the way.
But just like any game, a game with diversity should not and will not be impervious to criticism. This is another annoying thing I stumble onto a lot. There is some kind of representation, and then people are talking about what could have been done better. And the criticism is taken very offensively. Like they shouldn’t have done the game at all. Like those characters or themes should be perfect or not exist at all. And no one is actually demanding that (well I’m sure one can find a person who thinks like that but I guess people know what I mean here). But then it’s said “you got your diversity, why isn’t it good enough?!” which basically translates into: “We gave you these crumbs, be satisfied and shut up!” which is yet another form of discrimination.
In the end I guess what most people are saying here is that people should not add diversity if they have no clue how to do it properly. But isn’t that true of anything? If one doesn’t know shit about something, it’s not smart to put it into one’s game, really. Obviously it’s a bit different if it’s about brewing the coffee wrong than with getting people wrong but if the game’s theme is brewing coffee and it’s all wrong, it is going to get some baaad reviews. And if one really would like to add something they really don’t know much about, they can just consult a person who isn’t clueless - preferrably hire them if possible. Usually when there’s actual backlash about bad representation, it’s not about being perfect, it’s about not listening to the people in question at all.
It’s all valid criticism if one thinks some representation feels forced and it makes the game worse. One can feel the same about sex scenes, for example. I just hope that people wouldn’t be so quick to discourage trying.
Currently Playing: Dragon Age Origins: Awakening
Recently Played: Red Embrace: Hollywood, Dorfromantik, Heirs & Graces, AI: The Somnium Files, PRICE, Frostpunk, The Shapeshifting Detective (CPT), Disco Elysium, Dream Daddy, Four Last Things, Jenny LeClue - Detectivu, The Signifier
Im all for diversity, for instance max was a well written character who happened to be trans in technobabylon. But what they tried in life is strange 2 is shameful. Just like the devs for encoyda making a trump parody, but then lying and denying it.
Hi DCast. If your name is an allusion to the Sega console, you’re welcome in my family tree any day.
By the way, I think I need to start an alternate version of this thread, where we talk about things like ‘I’d like to play more games based on French literature.’ Or I’d like to play more games in the Mother Goose universe—Sierra can’t have entirely milked that cow-jumping-over-the-moon dry in just one-and-a-half games!’
Anyway, I’m not sure if this question has been asked and the distinction clearly made yet, within this thread at least:
For whom do we want these inclusive games to be made, and why?
Is it explicitly for the benefit of the ones being included, and coincidentally for the benefit of others? Or is it the other way around?
Is it so that the included ones feel included? Or is it so that the others become used to and develop greater understanding and empathy toward people who are different from themselves? ‘Walk a mile in my shoes’ and whatnot.
Because I think the latter has much more value. It’s like making your kid a sandwich or teaching him to make his own sandwich: You can make a game that will make people feel included, or you can make a game that will actually take steps toward them *being* included in the category of ‘majority/normal’. I know that’s not a pc way to put it, but you get my drift here, I hope.
To that end, yes, there is social value in creating works of art, and games 
, which display diversity. To me, one of the few *true* virtues of TV and movies is that they show people that there are other things out there, there are other ways to be. Yes, this is a double edged sword, but that’s outside the scope of the point I want to make here.
You could have a kid who grows up in the ghetto. Most of his experiences are of violence, drugs, corruption, the less wholesome sides of sex (to put it euphemistically). Without experiences or exposure to the brighter sides of life, he might believe that the ghetto is *all* there is. But fortunately, he has Superman. He can learn, to a valuable extent, about justice and injustice, about right and wrong, about what a healthy family environment might look like—in a number of different forms—, that love exists, that the world in general is a bright place where mine is mine, yours is yours, and effort and merit are generally rewarded. Without this exposure, he might only conceive of the world as the place where he physically exists.
Similarly, playing games, watching movies, reading books—*experiencing* media—that involves people and places and situations that we are unfamiliar with can help us to become familiar with them. They will help us, when we encounter them, to be within the scope of our ‘normality’ (hi-ho—this is an adventure game forum, after all!). We won’t be ‘scared’ or nervous or entirely ignorant. It will help ‘us’—whoever ‘us’ is—to integrate with them—whoever ‘they’ are. And that is a good thing.
**THAT SAID** Even living in a fairly racist and diverse-but-segregated (ethnically, religiously, racially) southern small town in America (moved here from cosmopolitan New Jersey a year ago), I think the problem is vastly overstated, and the PROGRESS has been vastly understated. I’m not a historian, but I read a lot of history, particularly world and American history from the 1700’s - the 1900’s. The world has been taking exponentially tremendous giant steps toward integration and equality over the last 150 years or so, and the last 50-70 years have been *huge*.
Is there a long way to go until there is perfect social fairness and harmony between genders, cultures, races, lifestyles, classes, and religions? Yes there is. But I think a lot of people these days are forcing the issue like no one has ever forced it in the past, and while a great many of their hearts are in the right place, I think there is a lack of historical education that causes them to think they are the first to carry the torch, and they push hard and in the wrong places, and the result is counter-productive.
(Some people’s hearts are not in the right places, and they co-opt movements just to give themselves an identity and something to do, but that’s almost another story.)
I know what you’re thinking: Surely the issue was pushed harder during the Civil Rights movement in the first 60 years of the 20th century? Yes, but that was the explicitly FORS (and the African American population) pushing against the AGAINST. No pun intended, but it was truly black and white, and it was a matter of life and death.
Since then, despite all too frequent outrageous setbacks, we have been making amazing progress in the right direction, and yet people are panicking more than ever and pretending that we’re right back in Mark Twain’s America, having never gone anywhere at all.
Player, purveyor, and propagator of smart toys and games for all ages.
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That is a stereotype that im ready to die. Not all southern small towns are racist. As someone who grew up in georgia his whole life, but spent many yrs in boston. I saw WAY more racism in the north, people segregate themselves by ethnicity in neighborhoods all over the place, and the racist language used regularly was shocking to me. Im not saying racism doesnt exist in the south, but by god, the crap i heard in boston and new york was shocking.
Hi!
There’s a lot to read and I don’t have the time right now. I just wanted to say off topic that “The sound of metal” is for me the best movie of last year.
Currently translating Strangeland into Spanish. Wish me luck, or send me money to my Paypal haha
That is a stereotype that im ready to die. Not all southern small towns are racist. As someone who grew up in georgia his whole life, but spent many yrs in boston. I saw WAY more racism in the north, people segregate themselves by ethnicity in neighborhoods all over the place, and the racist language used regularly was shocking to me. Im not saying racism doesnt exist in the south, but by god, the crap i heard in boston and new york was shocking.
By contrast, I lived in Central NJ for the first 32 years of my life, barring a few months here and there spent living overseas, and time spent traveling the US and other countries. Barring the odd f-tard lunatic here and there, I never experienced overt or explicit racism. Within a couple of days of moving to this town, I was sitting in a restaurant (owned by a black man, ironically) watching a friend play music. There was a white guy and a black guy working behind the bar, and there was an old-timer blue collar patron sitting there. He asked for something, and the white guy said ‘no problem, I’ll get right on it.’ The patron called him over, looked him in the eye and said ‘No. Make him do it. You’re white, he’s black. That’s the way it works.’
I almost packed everything right back up and went right back home.
To Jdawg’s point though, this town is a bit of an anomaly. There is a ton of diversity, and almost no integration. People keep to their own, whether that means their own ethnicity, their own church, their own class, and cross-divisions between those pies. It’s a town that is thank goodness becoming gentrified and integrated by an influx of people from the DC area, which is just an hour away. Despite being so close to such a liberal city, this town has managed to cling voraciously to their old ways. If it happened after 1864, it’s fake news. This is not the whole town by any means, but more than enough that their presence is undeniable.
Player, purveyor, and propagator of smart toys and games for all ages.
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@Bon: thanks for your input as well, in particular the suggestion of “Sound of Metal”, I just checked out the trailer and I want to see this movie now.
Personally, I had a blast, I think it’s a very well-crafted movie in every aspect. Also, I used to think that going deaf was one of the worst things that could happen to someone, but not after seeing this beautiful film, which managed to present a lovely point of view capturing the beauty of life, not just for deaf persons, but universally speaking, for (almost) everyone, while seemingly being realistic about it, and without holding any punches. I hope you’ll enjoy it!
That is a stereotype that im ready to die. Not all southern small towns are racist. As someone who grew up in georgia his whole life, but spent many yrs in boston. I saw WAY more racism in the north, people segregate themselves by ethnicity in neighborhoods all over the place, and the racist language used regularly was shocking to me. Im not saying racism doesnt exist in the south, but by god, the crap i heard in boston and new york was shocking.
By contrast, I lived in Central NJ for the first 32 years of my life, barring a few months here and there spent living overseas, and time spent traveling the US and other countries. Barring the odd f-tard lunatic here and there, I never experienced overt or explicit racism. Within a couple of days of moving to this town, I was sitting in a restaurant (owned by a black man, ironically) watching a friend play music. There was a white guy and a black guy working behind the bar, and there was an old-timer blue collar patron sitting there. He asked for something, and the white guy said ‘no problem, I’ll get right on it.’ The patron called him over, looked him in the eye and said ‘No. Make him do it. You’re white, he’s black. That’s the way it works.’
I almost packed everything right back up and went right back home.
To Jdawg’s point though, this town is a bit of an anomaly. There is a ton of diversity, and almost no integration. People keep to their own, whether that means their own ethnicity, their own church, their own class, and cross-divisions between those pies. It’s a town that is thank goodness becoming gentrified and integrated by an influx of people from the DC area, which is just an hour away. Despite being so close to such a liberal city, this town has managed to cling voraciously to their old ways. If it happened after 1864, it’s fake news. This is not the whole town by any means, but more than enough that their presence is undeniable.
I went drinking at an irish bar in boston and i heard names and terms, that i long thought were extinct. I Got told what neighborhoods were safe and not safe to go to bc of what races live there. In georgia people are seperated, but more in the way of who has money and who doesnt. I like this quote from killer mike…
“I mean, being a young black man in the South can be a difficult and arduous task at times, but at some point, after you get past the anger and some of the confusion of adolescence and you grow up and travel the world, the people who are stereotypically supposed to hate me, or the people I’m supposed to mistrust, have always been my neighbors. And for most of my life, we’ve been really nice to each other.
“That’s my honest experience with whites in the South, and I think a lot of times when people say ‘Southerner’ or make those crass jokes, I, as the black guy, am supposed to excuse myself from the joke.
“But we’re all Southerners. We all talk with these drawls and twangs. We all go to the race track on Sunday. We all go fishing. I don’t have a Dixie flag on the back of my pickup, but it still has mud flaps and big tires. So you’re talking about me, too. I am that redneck guy you’re talking about. I’m not him, racially. He’s not me, racially. But culturally, in the geography of where we’re from, our grandfathers did the same things. They did the same shit. I fiercely identify with being a Southerner because I value that culture. Everybody else thinks we’re country as shit, anyway. So why not just be who I am? I am Southern. I rap. I wear cheesy jewelry. I bounce around on stage. But when I take that shit off and go home, I fish. And I’m your neighbor. I do the same things you do.”
Is it alright if I answer this through PM? I don’t want to take over the thread with my ideas or talk to much about my life.
Will be waiting for your reply!
@Bon: thanks for your input as well, in particular the suggestion of “Sound of Metal”, I just checked out the trailer and I want to see this movie now.
I think that brings another interesting point in the discussion about games which is WHY do we play? I’m assuming it’s for entirely different reasons. I, for one, just reading about the movie decided that it’s not for me. I usually learn or take in stuff from people in real life, educate myself through literature (especially non-fiction), independent journalists and, in lesser degree, documentaries. When it comes to fiction, films or games I largely (but not always) look to be entertained and escape for awhile from everyday life. I want to be on a spaceship! I want to shoot fireballs out of my hands into mean dragon faces! I want to deal with supernatural! And, like the famous quote goes - I want all the adventure, murders and mayhem it can bring me with it. I don’t need a game to teach me to be compassionate or understand that living with a disability is hard, I’m aware of that and try to be understanding to my best possible ability, so maybe that’s another reason a game like VP suggested or this film doesn’t sound all that enticing to me. I’m looking for different things from these mediums, and I’m sure there’s an audience that will be the target one for those ideas. When it comes to games, however, I want to PLAY and have fun with it. And, I guess, these aren’t my ideas of fun.
Well, I think adventure and other games can be made the same way, of course, as it has already been established in this topic, as long as the game works as a game (= it’s fun/interesting to play). Adventure game centered on the idea of a person dealing with becoming, for example, deaf could be good, if the development was put in the right and skillful hands. And yes, I can see how this character could be seen as a sort of a “novelty”, although it’s not really about the character, but about his condition. Sometimes, the character himself is not the focus of the story, but rather what that character represents.
Sure, and if the adventure that can pull THAT off will be also an interesting game to play - I’m all for it. It just doesn’t seem likely. Adventure about someone’s condition, either would have to explore this in depth which will inevitably affect other aspects, because, like you said, it’s also has format limitations, or have a rudimentary swipe at such condition.
Also, what is that skillful hands and authors who has RIGHT understanding many people referring to? We have plenty of skillful creators, the reason why these games aren’t really being made is because a) well, it’s a pretty obscure topic (just like many many conditions); 2) making of a game takes LOT of resources and time, so the developer would need to SELL it to people.
Imagine selling a game with a premise of “Adventure game centered on the idea of a person dealing with becoming, for example, deaf” where it’s not “about the character, but about his condition” ... Do you think it sounds like something that a lot of people would want to play? Some, of course, would - I don’t doubt it, but I sure as hell wouldn’t. Why would I want to play it? I’m not just aware what it’s like to deal with a serious condition, I’m also aware of people who are dealing with it in real life and that it sucks. I know about dealing and about loss - the last thing I want to do is to play through it. I’m going to go ahead and imagine that this kind of game would be a hard sell for a wide audience, and it’s not because they are all insensitive or close-minded or uneducated, but because many wouldn’t want to deal with this in a game on top of dealing with shit in real life. And since the developer still needs to make money, this kind of product would be VERY niche, practically charity.
I absolutely think that if someone wants to do it - they should go ahead and proceed, again, I’m for purely driven creative force, but I hope they have realistic expectations and understanding that there will never be a huge market for it. And if this kinda game actually happens to be phenomena where the developer managed not just truly explore condition, but also present a fully fleshed-out game play of, say, mystery solving - I’ll be the first one to say that he did what was practically impossible and back that up 100%.
This is some great discussion.
I can’t speak for VP, but when I mentioned a game featuring someone with a disability, I didn’t have in mind being “educated” or learning to be compassionate or how hard life is. For me adventure games are always first and foremost about the adventure, and for a long time it just seems like there’s been the commonly accepted idea that this means the response you’re likely to get from a child when you ask them what their idea of adventure is:
fantasy
the supernatural
monsters
spooky stories
ghosts
pirates
time travel
spaceships
...I’m sure you get the picture. I just wanted to question that mindset, and to ask whether when the “adventure” we have been going on for so many years has been to the exact same places, if it could be in some cases even more adventurous to look somewhere closer to home, somewhere which hasn’t actually been explored before in a game. Because when you say that a game about a disabled person isn’t your idea of fun, well, others are discovering that going to Fantasy Land #28547 or Outer Space Planet X for the 100th time… is not theirs.
So it’s really not about education for me, but the adventure. It’s taken some time for our genre to mature to the point where developers don’t necessarily see “adventure” as being flung to the far corners of the galaxy, exploring underground troll-filled caverns, or going ghost hunting in Cornwall, but the popularity of games like Cat Lady suggests it’s happening.
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