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Bioshock Infinite

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There’s a difference between looking at a game blindly by its binary concepts instead of its overall medley. Bioshock Infinite is unique and hasn’t been done before. Name one game like it? No dishonored is nothing like it. Dishonored was more like Thief.

     

Stuart Bradley Newsom - Naughty Shinobi || Our Game: Shadow Over Isolation

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Monolith - 29 March 2013 04:45 AM

Bioshock Infinite is unique and hasn’t been done before. Name one game like it?

Bioshock.

     
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kuze - 29 March 2013 05:18 AM
Monolith - 29 March 2013 04:45 AM

Bioshock Infinite is unique and hasn’t been done before. Name one game like it?

Bioshock.

And SystemShock2 Tongue

You misunderstood the point, Ken and Harvey have same pedigree, that Looking Glass
history, carrying essence of their old efforts, there are 2 things wrong in your statement.

You can go all crazy with powers in Dishonored , like super hero, there are videos on
Youtube where the skills of player (executing moves and killing tallboys, 8 enemies
within minute and what not) ,are way more crazier than BSInfinite (and nothing like Thief).

Ken himself said that there are three games doing this nature of games , and he mentioned Dishonored, DX HR and BSInfinite, basically in their old games (for your understanding) the essence always was to give you PLAYGROUND, to use your own strategies for different outcomes, DX HR and DISHONORED have more ways, though BSI is pretty limiting on your freedom.

 

     
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Bioshock, System Shock and Infinite share the same core mechanics which make the games so great, but by no means are they all the same. So all those games have a unique rail system on top of an excellent system created by previous games, on top of a great way of telling a story between sinner and his romantic target, in addition to ‘ACTUAL NPCS’ that aren’t always out to kill you,....on top of this visually stunning game? I can go on, add more details at what makes Infinite unique. Then again, people love to be coy and act dumb.

@Nomad: Dishonored was heavily inspired by thief. FUnny since you’re looking a the find details that make Dishonored different….but you can’t do the same for Infinite? Was freedom really that big of a feature? I digress, I’m missing your insight on why infinite is not unique? Everyone I know who are big time gamers and a big time developers find Infinite very unique.

What does DX HR, BI and Dishonored have in common? Its story. Conspiracy. Ken was right, but his opinion was based on the ignorance of the audience. Ken said himself that he knows Infinite is nothing like Dishonored and DX Hr, but the people need time to soak into these games, therefore they were released far and between from each other. Infinite was delayed because the industry knew you, the audience, don’t understand much.

Bioshock Infinite redefined escort missions. You no longer hate the person you’re escorting. There’s an article praising it as Elizabeth was an ally instead of a nuisance. Then again, I guess Bioshock and System Shock did that better than this game.

     

Stuart Bradley Newsom - Naughty Shinobi || Our Game: Shadow Over Isolation

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I don’t understand the decline of this series, or people’s defense of it. And yes, there IS a decline.

From strikingly original game that is still unclassifiable in terms of genre (System Shock) to a complex and thrilling role-player that is now the benchmark for a whole subtype of games (SS2), to what are basically a series of first person shooters with a variety of slightly different seasonings.

For me the problem is not wanting to punish the gamer. For anything. So while in SS2 (eg) you had a limited inventory meaning your ability to carry things depended on how much you developed your strength, and if you didn’t develop it you had to find other ways around problems or other strategies, you can do no wrong in Bioshock and its sequels except die. Unfortunately depriving me of interesting choices like this this meant for me that I couldn’t care less about my character and my time spent in Rapture was an apathetic rampage rather than a strategic and immersive journey. “Dumbed down” is perfect term for it. They want to remove any ability or need to think, because gamers are dumb. Kill things and stay alive? Good. Die? Bad. Any decision more complex than what to shoot and when, is out of the question.Maybe Monolith can confirm that this is the kind of thought process that actually goes on in the studios nowadays. I have little doubt that it most certainly is.

 

     
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kuze - 29 March 2013 05:18 AM
Monolith - 29 March 2013 04:45 AM

Bioshock Infinite is unique and hasn’t been done before. Name one game like it?

Bioshock.

It’s so not, though. I mean they have some common DNA, but they’re really different in tone, setting, presentation, and the feel of the action.

Infinite moves completely away from the Cronenberg-esque body horror stuff, and really isn’t even a horror game at all. It isn’t set in a dystopia that’s already falling apart, and the story isn’t so focused on retrospect. It actually has a real character who talks, and you don’t go through the game alone. Even the gameplay is way more action-focused this time, pitting you against spawning waves of dozens of enemies, and letting you swing around on skylines.

Honestly, while it obviously draws from Bioshock, the only reason to actually call it Bioshock was to generate hype and sales. It’s not a sequel to Bioshock at all. What tenuous connection they have is more of a wink than anything.

     
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Monolith - 29 March 2013 02:45 PM

@Nomad: Dishonored was heavily inspired by thief. FUnny since you’re looking a the find details that make Dishonored different….but you can’t do the same for Infinite? Was freedom really that big of a feature? I digress, I’m missing your insight on why infinite is not unique? Everyone I know who are big time gamers and a big time developers find Infinite very unique.

 


Well maybe you read into either different comments, played different games, or played
without going for all options, yes Dishonored has plenty of Thief elements, but
gives you choice to adopt totally fast, super hero , agile, playstyle very unlike Thief.
As i said , check videos of expert players. BSI offers no stealth option, no item or powers management, the 1999 mode is an afterthought and shoehorned ,gives only aggressive option.
DX and System shock, offered multiple options. Yes playground freedom and multiple choices made their early titles so famous. In gameplay perspective , BSI is
limiting, and Skyrails are also underused which are the only new element in combat,
vigors feel recycled.

e.g

Crows = Bees
Fire both have
Shock both have
Rebound = Teleknesis etc.

Now,
Compare that with Dishonored 1.summoning rats to attack,2. now summon rats and possess one of them and use it to pass the guards,3. or summon rats , bend time and attach wire trap and send it in patrol area to kill multiple enemies 4. summon rats to distract. And thats one Power, there is plenty more to experiment and that serves not story but gameplay and fun from gameplay.Tongue
Use blink on tallboys front and milisecond stab kill on chest, that finesse in
skill is so hard to master but so satisfying, again shows the depth of gameplay.
Can go on and on.

I want to get rid of Liz, but i cannot, i dont want to drag her along, and so on, but she is forced upon me for Story purposes which i mentioned earlier , the main goal of game, which BSI did very smartly, infact the story is the main purpose why the game is made, linear, artistic, less freedom etc. and only thing unique and what expected from levine and he gave that , which i am not complaining, but would have
enjoyed more content in game mechanics. Heck even in recent Ken interview to BBC, he said that putting action , FPS elements and all , including gun carrying hero cover was
marketing decision to make shooter crowd happy (maye be you). Dishonored was made without any mass market segmentation Tongue

Dont defend BSI , since i liked it very much, but i have my fangirl mechanisms in control, and dont jump the gun.Tongue

 

 

Frogacuda - 29 March 2013 11:45 PM
kuze - 29 March 2013 05:18 AM
Monolith - 29 March 2013 04:45 AM

Bioshock Infinite is unique and hasn’t been done before. Name one game like it?

Bioshock.

Honestly, while it obviously draws from Bioshock, the only reason to actually call it Bioshock was to generate hype and sales. It’s not a sequel to Bioshock at all. What tenuous connection they have is more of a wink than anything.

 

This statement is wrong, finish the game , and we can start debate Tongue

     
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Frogacuda - 29 March 2013 11:45 PM

Honestly, while it obviously draws from Bioshock, the only reason to actually call it Bioshock was to generate hype and sales. It’s not a sequel to Bioshock at all. What tenuous connection they have is more of a wink than anything.

Yeah, because the original developers of bioshock, system shock used it as a marketing ploy. This is the saddest excuse of an opinion.

You don’t even need to beat the game to understand this is a Bioshock game. Bioshock Infinite is the true sequel to Bioshock. Bioshock 2 wasn’t suppose to happen, but the powers at be over at 2K wanted to make it and ruin Ken Levine overall plan. (Once again, the problems of working with Publishers)

     

Stuart Bradley Newsom - Naughty Shinobi || Our Game: Shadow Over Isolation

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Frogacuda - 29 March 2013 11:45 PM

Honestly, while it obviously draws from Bioshock, the only reason to actually call it Bioshock was to generate hype and sales. It’s not a sequel to Bioshock at all. What tenuous connection they have is more of a wink than anything.

The connection is hardly tenuous. All the “Shock” games have had the same story, repeated in different settings.

The fact that bright, colorful and highly populated setting in Infinite is almost the inverse of the dark setting previously used really only strengthens the connection. Opposites have a closeness that is made closer by their being so far apart.

     
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Just finished the game.

A game like this probably needs to be played more than once. However, if you want to cut to the chase…
 
Booker was haunted by the horrible things he did as a young man, first at wounded knee when he gunned down women and children, then in china, and and then as Pinkerton when he beat up strikers as a mercenary. Then he met his wife and turned his life around and started working as a private investigator. But his pregnant wife dies and his life turned to shit, and he ends up shooting himself in his office after falling into despair.

So he’s in purgatory and his unborn daughter Elizabeth is his guide. Whenever he goes astray (dies) without her around he returns to his office, where his journey begin. They travel together through Columbia exploring the past and the future and what might have been and what still could be. Booker confronts his past as a soldier through Slade. Then he confronts his life as a strikebreaking Pinkerton through Fink. All the while he’s haunted by his vices through Comstock. He even confronts the ghost of his wife through Lady Comstock. Finally, he defeats them all and conquers his inner demons. He sees the infinite and uncontrollable nature of the universe as something not to fear but to accept, and finally is allowed to pass on into darkness and peace.

     
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Further more on the name Bioshock. The bioshock name and series is suppose to take place in various biomes. Air, Sea, and the next will be somewhere else unique. Thats the thing, each game wasn’t suppose to be a clean cut copy.

     

Stuart Bradley Newsom - Naughty Shinobi || Our Game: Shadow Over Isolation

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Zifnab - 30 March 2013 12:57 AM

The connection is hardly tenuous. All the “Shock” games have had the same story, repeated in different settings.

Honestly, I don’t really see a lot of story parallels between Infinite and Bioshock. Maybe in the broadest sense that you go to a seperatist city and shoot people, but that’s about it.

     
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Monolith - 30 March 2013 12:46 AM

You don’t even need to beat the game to understand this is a Bioshock game.

I did beat the game. It’s undeniably an Irrational game, and it borrows from Bioshock, but this is common even in non-sequels. Crysis obviously borrows from the original Far Cry, but you wouldn’t call it a sequel. Infinite feels more like that, to me. It’s a “successor” more than a sequel. Even what very tenuous connection they’re given in the end is little more than a wink, and much weaker than the connection between, say, Portal and Half-Life.

This is a good thing, by the way.

Bioshock Infinite is the true sequel to Bioshock. Bioshock 2 wasn’t suppose to happen, but the powers at be over at 2K wanted to make it and ruin Ken Levine overall plan. (Once again, the problems of working with Publishers)

You have mistaken my comment for a criticism. It was anything but.

I think making a real Bioshock sequel is a fucking terrible idea. I refuse to play Bioshock 2 because I found the very idea of trying to do another game in that universe to be utterly pointless. I think it’s great that Ken got to go make the game that he wanted instead of doing a real sequel.

But if they called this game “Fall of Columbia” or something else, it would still be just as awesome and no one would think it strange not to call it Bioshock. That’s all I’m saying. It stands on its own.

     
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If they named it anything but Bioshock Infinite, it wouldn’t be the same. Bioshock is not a description of a story, its a description of the setting. Why would it be strange to call it Bioshock? I would call those people stupid. No other name would describe it that well.

     

Stuart Bradley Newsom - Naughty Shinobi || Our Game: Shadow Over Isolation

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Monolith - 30 March 2013 12:38 PM

If they named it anything but Bioshock Infinite, it wouldn’t be the same. Bioshock is not a description of a story, its a description of the setting. Why would it be strange to call it Bioshock? I would call those people stupid. No other name would describe it that well.

But Infinite isn’t really connected to the story OR the setting of the old game. I mean, I guess there are other series like this too. Final Fantasy especially. But those never felt like sequels in the classic sense to me either.

Also—and I guess we can argue about this—but the name “Bioshock” to me is very evocative of the kind of body horror themes explored by the first game, which are just not present here. No one is really Bioengineering themselves in shocking ways.

System Shock was a game where people were corrupted by a computer system. Bioshock was a game where they were corrupted through genetic engineering. I’m not buying the “Biomeshock” theory. Neither Rapture nor Columbia were biomes in any meaningful sense of the word, nor is their ecology really relevant to the game.

     

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