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New Tomb Raider

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kuze - 12 March 2013 07:27 AM

I tried the new Tomb Raider, and even though it looks gorgeous, and Lara is a more interesting character than in any other reincarnation of the series, I’m not going to continue playing.  I will not tolerate the disgusting snuff scenes that seem to follow every QTE, of which there seem to be way too many, and I am a little bit sad that most people seem to be fine with watching Lara die a gruesome death over and over again.

So you’ve never played a Tomb Raider game before because every one of them has multiple gruesome death scenes for Lara. Everything from being chomped by a T-Rex, stbbed, shot, squashed and imailed etc etc.

The new game may be a lot more realistic in it’s graphics, but it’s totally in line with the series to have death animations.

I do admit that a couple of them are seriously brutal (Pole through the head, but you see them once then you do better the next attempt.

     

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Exactly what Lucien said. Also, shouldn’t it be an incentive not to die if you find it so terrible? What? You want the game to slap you on your hand and tell you to stop dying? They finally make her more human and people don’t understand why the deaths are so brutal? Its shove a dagger in your heart to make the gamer be more careful. Not as some snuff crap.

     

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Lucien21 - 12 March 2013 03:46 PM
kuze - 12 March 2013 07:27 AM

I tried the new Tomb Raider, and even though it looks gorgeous, and Lara is a more interesting character than in any other reincarnation of the series, I’m not going to continue playing.  I will not tolerate the disgusting snuff scenes that seem to follow every QTE, of which there seem to be way too many, and I am a little bit sad that most people seem to be fine with watching Lara die a gruesome death over and over again.

So you’ve never played a Tomb Raider game before because every one of them has multiple gruesome death scenes for Lara. Everything from being chomped by a T-Rex, stbbed, shot, squashed and imailed etc etc.

The new game may be a lot more realistic in it’s graphics, but it’s totally in line with the series to have death animations.

I do admit that a couple of them are seriously brutal (Pole through the head, but you see them once then you do better the next attempt.

I honestly can’t remember any death scenes as gruesome as in the new game, but I wasn’t a huge fan of the franchise so I haven’t played much of the other games. The graphics do have a huge impact though, and watching a somewhat lifelike doll getting an arrow though her neck is a lot more brutal than the same happening with a painted cardboard box.

Full disclosure: I also suck at QTEs, and Tomb Raider doesn’t have the most forgiving of all implementations. If they made it a tad easier so that I get most of them right the first time and thus don’t have to see what happens if I don’t, I probably wouldn’t have minded as much.

     
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Monolith - 12 March 2013 04:19 PM

Exactly what Lucien said. Also, shouldn’t it be an incentive not to die if you find it so terrible? What? You want the game to slap you on your hand and tell you to stop dying? They finally make her more human and people don’t understand why the deaths are so brutal? Its shove a dagger in your heart to make the gamer be more careful. Not as some snuff crap.

The way it’s implemented, it doesn’t add to her humanity at all. It’s a slap on the wrist for the gamer, as you correctly remarked; “be more careful or you’ll have to watch a girl being murdered in HD all over again”. I agree with SamandMax that showing humanity means showing the person’s actions, not a slo-mo gib-fest. TWD managed to include horrible violence and death and not be subject of this discussion (to me at least) by showing how people deal with such events. With Tomb Raider, someone just thought it might get more press.

     

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Monolith - 12 March 2013 04:19 PM

Exactly what Lucien said. Also, shouldn’t it be an incentive not to die if you find it so terrible? What? You want the game to slap you on your hand and tell you to stop dying? They finally make her more human and people don’t understand why the deaths are so brutal? Its shove a dagger in your heart to make the gamer be more careful. Not as some snuff crap.

Really? You really think players need brutal, gruesome death scenes to give them incentive not to die? Funny, I thought the incentive not to die was usually wanting to progress in the game. Guess that explains why I never finished all those games without brutal death scenes… Wink

Seriously. If you are OK with the level of brutality, fine, but to imply that it actually serves an important purpose in making the gamer work to avoid death seems…silly. It might be argued to serve some narrative purpose, but gamers don’t usually need extra incentive not to get killed over and over.

And in fact, the level of brutality seems likely to lead some people to just give up and quit the game when they hit a spot that they have difficulty with, rather than be forced to watch a gruesome death multiple times. I imagine that would be the effect on me, given some of the footage I have seen, and my middling skills at this sort of game.

     
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kuze - 12 March 2013 07:27 AM

I tried the new Tomb Raider, and even though it looks gorgeous, and Lara is a more interesting character than in any other reincarnation of the series, I’m not going to continue playing.  I will not tolerate the disgusting snuff scenes that seem to follow every QTE, of which there seem to be way too many, and I am a little bit sad that most people seem to be fine with watching Lara die a gruesome death over and over again.

I personally despise the “torture porn” genre.  I’ve never seen any of the Saw movies, and I have no interest in them.  In this genre, the characters are pretty much just pieces of meat, and the films (and audience) take sadistic pleasure in killing them in brutal ways.  I’ve always hated this approach.  In a horror movie, you should be afraid for the protagonist and hoping they’ll make it out alive.  In the torture porn genre, one wants the character to die. 

So, having expressed my distaste with torture porn, let me say that I thought Tomb Raider was nothing like this.  Clearly, you are meant to empathize with and want to protect Lara from all this increasingly [email protected]#*ed up stuff.  You’re not wanting to see her die.  So, in this way, Lara is more likely a character in a traditional (but occasionally brutal) horror movie.  That’s why I think the “torture porn” or “snuff” comparisons are way off base.  The approach is 180 degrees different.

On a lighter note, for those who haven’t seen it, Conan has an absolutely hilarious review of the game (the aforementioned river rapids throat impaling scene features prominently).

     
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Well not to get the press, but the Game is heavily inspired from Descent 2005 film


It was violent adventure survival movie, when i watched it back then i wanted
some game to be like it, and one of the reasons i liked this TR is thanks to
its bold approach, there are too many similarities to point out and i must
recommend the movie.


I have done lots of mountain climbing and adventuring in jungles, and believe me you can have fatal accidents or some really brutal injuries, my friends lost limbs by falling, i got penetrated by huge thorn .....the unexpected brutal danger like
pole in throat is well portrayed, its given in wilderness or hostile environment and it ain’t pretty, infact i missed Bear in this TR, would have been fun fighting huge bear Smile.

     
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Mister Ed - 12 March 2013 05:20 PM

Really? You really think players need brutal, gruesome death scenes to give them incentive not to die? Funny, I thought the incentive not to die was usually wanting to progress in the game. Guess that explains why I never finished all those games without brutal death scenes… Wink

um, what? First of all, did you not like the gruesome scenes? Perfect, then try not to die. That’s an incentive. But I guess we’re in backwards world now.

Think about it this way. If a games incentive is to beat the game, then ok. When you add the element of dying and not wanting to die. Now that’s a game. WE had an argument about regenerating health and you have the nerve to criticizing the game’s incentive not to die? Yeah….ok.

     

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kuze - 12 March 2013 07:27 AM

I tried the new Tomb Raider, and even though it looks gorgeous, and Lara is a more interesting character than in any other reincarnation of the series, I’m not going to continue playing.  I will not tolerate the disgusting snuff scenes that seem to follow every QTE, of which there seem to be way too many, and I am a little bit sad that most people seem to be fine with watching Lara die a gruesome death over and over again.

Can’t agree with you more Kuze.
I’m sick and tired of all the gruesome violence in majority of games today.
Ok, developers are just doing what sells. I’m more concerned about players who enjoy it and want more of this stuff over and over again.

Don’t want to sound like those clownish suits who blame video games for every bad stuff that happens, because I seriously don’t think that’s the case. I’m also all about freedom of choice and if there’s interest for games like this, so be it.
However, such huge fascination with violence (be it shooting or snuff stuff like the latest TR), and having so many games with realistic portraying of killing, does say something about our violent and sadistic nature. You can pack it up however you want it: they are just video game characters, you are shooting pixels, etc… I say, blah, blah, blah.

Might be, I’m also bitter. Games that interest me are so rare these days Shifty Eyed

     
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There is no death in the new Tomb Raider. You “die” and it drops you back to just a few moments ago, alive and ready to face the exact same challenge again.

That’s not death. Death is the end - THE end, permenantly, for good. At the very least it should be the end of the game and require a complete restart from the beginning. That would be an “incentive”. Giving you a second, a third chance and calling it “death” is absurd enough as it is - calling it an “incentive” when you’re not even punished in the slightest for “dying” is just laughable.

Let’s call it what it is, an excuse for violence and fascination with blood and gore, something which didn’t exist if you looked back further in the history of games.

     

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I know this has been said before, but I don’t find it all that fun, it’s like a Far Cry with less options. I did like Lara croft in the older series but not it seems that she is just an imitation. I don’t know that is just my opinion.

     

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Gaming4Life - 13 March 2013 07:45 AM

I know this has been said before, but I don’t find it all that fun, it’s like a Far Cry with less options. I did like Lara croft in the older series but not it seems that she is just an imitation. I don’t know that is just my opinion.

Games without puzzles are rarely fun. That’s what I find anyway. Games need puzzles. Some people might get a thrill out of just running around shooting people but it gets old after the first time, and the first time it was done in computer games was a LONG time ago. We get new graphics each year, but updating the graphics is just like putting on new make-up or clothes on the same mannequin.

     

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Monolith - 13 March 2013 01:11 AM
Mister Ed - 12 March 2013 05:20 PM

Really? You really think players need brutal, gruesome death scenes to give them incentive not to die? Funny, I thought the incentive not to die was usually wanting to progress in the game. Guess that explains why I never finished all those games without brutal death scenes… Wink

um, what? First of all, did you not like the gruesome scenes? Perfect, then try not to die. That’s an incentive. But I guess we’re in backwards world now.

Think about it this way. If a games incentive is to beat the game, then ok. When you add the element of dying and not wanting to die. Now that’s a game. WE had an argument about regenerating health and you have the nerve to criticizing the game’s incentive not to die? Yeah….ok.

What I’m criticizing is the notion that you actually NEED added incentive not to die. As if, without particularly brutal or gruesome death animations, players would happily just die over and over. That’s nonsensical, and completely contradicted by all experience. People generally dislike dying repeatedly no matter WHAT it looks like. I’m not specifically opposed to the inclusion of gruesome death scenes (even if they aren’t my cup of tea, and would make me NOT play the game, that’s just personal preference). I’m just saying that they can’t remotely be justified as necessary on the basis of “providing incentive not to die”. One has to look elsewhere for their justification (and I’m not saying there is none), because nobody really NEEDS extra incentive not to die. Players ALREADY try not to die, naturally.

     
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Igor - 13 March 2013 03:41 AM

However, such huge fascination with violence (be it shooting or snuff stuff like the latest TR), and having so many games with realistic portraying of killing, does say something about our violent and sadistic nature. You can pack it up however you want it: they are just video game characters, you are shooting pixels, etc… I say, blah, blah, blah.

Before you point a finger at video games, have you watched the news… ever?
The violence in movies and games has nothing on the violence the news gives us daily. Just ask Advie about what happens and has happened on his doorstep (in Cairo) these last few months and years. Except that that is real, not a video game.
Conflicts like that, murder, violence in general, that long predates video games. That long predates television. That long predates movies.
I agree that human behaviour and societal ideologies are to blame for all the violence in the world. But we need to point the finger at ourselves, not at video games (or others forms of entertainment).

So yeah, they are just video game characters and we are just shooting pixels. We’re not hurting real people, and if you confuse a video game with reality, then you have serious issues that go beyond anything a form of entertainment could cause.

Oscar - 13 March 2013 05:22 AM

Let’s call it what it is, an excuse for violence and fascination with blood and gore, something which didn’t exist if you looked back further in the history of games.

It did exist and has always existed. It’s just become more realistic with improving graphics.

Mister Ed - 13 March 2013 11:38 AM

People generally dislike dying repeatedly no matter WHAT it looks like.

Tell that to the Space Quest fans… Tongue

     

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Oscar - 13 March 2013 05:22 AM

There is no death in the new Tomb Raider. You “die” and it drops you back to just a few moments ago, alive and ready to face the exact same challenge again.

That’s not death. Death is the end - THE end, permenantly, for good. At the very least it should be the end of the game and require a complete restart from the beginning. That would be an “incentive”. Giving you a second, a third chance and calling it “death” is absurd enough as it is - calling it an “incentive” when you’re not even punished in the slightest for “dying” is just laughable.

I think death scenes punishing enough as it is.

kuze - 12 March 2013 07:27 AM

I tried the new Tomb Raider, and even though it looks gorgeous, and Lara is a more interesting character than in any other reincarnation of the series, I’m not going to continue playing.  I will not tolerate the disgusting snuff scenes that seem to follow every QTE, of which there seem to be way too many, and I am a little bit sad that most people seem to be fine with watching Lara die a gruesome death over and over again.

Really,game makes you think that witnessing a real rather than a staged murder ?

 

     

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