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Lady Kestrelwalas74

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Should support of an artist be influenced by their beliefs/attitudes?

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Iznogood - 31 May 2013 06:15 PM

Now lets just imagine for a moment that President Obama decided he wanted to be a game developer instead of president, and started a kikstarter for some game, (yes i know it is not very likely to happen, it is a hypothetical situation) would you then also claim that there is no political aspect about that project?

Yes, provided the game he was developing wasn’t political in nature. No doubt some people would read his politics into it, no matter what, because of who he is, but that doesn’t mean that the project IS political. Outside people imposing some sort of poltical meaning on the project wouldn’t make the project political, IMHO, it would simply make their personal view of it political. That says far more about THEM, though, than it does about the project, if said project is NOT political in nature.

Not saying that what it says is good or bad, just that the political aspect in that case is theirs not the project’s.

     
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But Obama is a powerfull and influential man with a direct saying in the currents affaires of the world.TenNapel is just an artist. If we imagine that Obama wanted to be game developer then also let’s imagine Doug TenNapel never went public with his political opinions.
Now if Obama was retired, and had no influence whatsoever in politics and his game was something unraleted, no, there’s nothing political about it.

Of course you can say everything is political, but then i return to my example from the grocery store, if we should check what everybody thinks on every subject before we make some kind of contact with them, that’s what i find extreme.

Maybe extreme it’s not the correct word, im struggling with english here. Im not saying what you think is good or bad, there is no moral judgment here. 
 

     
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Who is Obama?

     
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Advie - 31 May 2013 09:46 PM

Who is Obama?

The One who supports your Muslim Brotherhood.

     
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Advie - 31 May 2013 09:46 PM

Who is Obama?

Barack Obama is the 44th and current president of the United States of America.

 

Bt

     
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sordy-wordy - 31 May 2013 07:22 PM

But Obama is a powerfull and influential man with a direct saying in the currents affaires of the world.TenNapel is just an artist. If we imagine that Obama wanted to be game developer then also let’s imagine Doug TenNapel never went public with his political opinions.

Actually TenNapel isn’t just an artist, he is also a politically active figure, and that is the whole point, he might not be as influential as Obama is, but that is another story.

If TenNapel wasn’t active in politics, then there wouldn’t be any problem. 

sordy-wordy - 31 May 2013 07:22 PM

Of course you can say everything is political, but then i return to my example from the grocery store, if we should check what everybody thinks on every subject before we make some kind of contact with them, that’s what i find extreme.

Now that would be extreme, but no one has suggested any such thing or even remotely close to that.

All this boils down to is a very simple question, is there a limit to what kind of people you would support on kickstarter, or would you give your money to the devil himself in order to make sure some game is made? (And please note that i am not calling TenNapel the devil himself)

     

You have to play the game, to find out why you are playing the game! - eXistenZ

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Moving this conversation to Chit Chat…

     
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Mister Ed - 31 May 2013 07:16 PM
Iznogood - 31 May 2013 06:15 PM

Now lets just imagine for a moment that President Obama decided he wanted to be a game developer instead of president, and started a kikstarter for some game, (yes i know it is not very likely to happen, it is a hypothetical situation) would you then also claim that there is no political aspect about that project?

Yes, provided the game he was developing wasn’t political in nature. No doubt some people would read his politics into it, no matter what, because of who he is, but that doesn’t mean that the project IS political. Outside people imposing some sort of poltical meaning on the project wouldn’t make the project political, IMHO, it would simply make their personal view of it political. That says far more about THEM, though, than it does about the project, if said project is NOT political in nature.

Not saying that what it says is good or bad, just that the political aspect in that case is theirs not the project’s.

It’s hard not to read politics into it when his professional blog is 50% politics and 50% about his comic and game development.

     
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Personally i try to look the positive side of everything. And like i said, he might be 95% an asshole but we should focus on the 5% that is not. In that 5% he is a good creative person that makes awesome things, if he is not doing that, he is talking crap and making a fool of himself. Do you want him doing that or doing cools games with clay? Let’s keep him occupied whith what we know he is cool and good at.     


Now let’s just imagine it’s the other way around.

An homosexual man, who is heavy into homosexual rights,is making an awesome game totally unraleted from his sexuality or politics. Then a group of conservatives says “your game looks awesome,i would love to back it but i’m not because you are gay and think this way about them”
That makes sense to you?
If you approve some kind of attitude for one point of view, you also approve it for everyones,independently if you share it or not, or else you would being using double standars and being unfair.

I think it’s an attitude that don’t make sense, unless you are so much offended that you truly can’t take no joy out of his work. That’s why (again im being reiterative, sorry)i asked at the very beggining if people still enjoyed The Neverhood and thougth this new game was any good. If you can no longer enjoy his games, then i understand and agree with your decision.
But if not, and you still enjoy his work, not supporting it because of his personal life and opinions doesn’t make sense to me. 

 

     
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Bonsai - 31 May 2013 10:19 PM
Advie - 31 May 2013 09:46 PM

Who is Obama?

The One who supports your Muslim Brotherhood.

ahh .. that Obama .

     

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Oscar - 01 June 2013 05:25 AM
Mister Ed - 31 May 2013 07:16 PM
Iznogood - 31 May 2013 06:15 PM

Now lets just imagine for a moment that President Obama decided he wanted to be a game developer instead of president, and started a kikstarter for some game, (yes i know it is not very likely to happen, it is a hypothetical situation) would you then also claim that there is no political aspect about that project?

Yes, provided the game he was developing wasn’t political in nature. No doubt some people would read his politics into it, no matter what, because of who he is, but that doesn’t mean that the project IS political. Outside people imposing some sort of poltical meaning on the project wouldn’t make the project political, IMHO, it would simply make their personal view of it political. That says far more about THEM, though, than it does about the project, if said project is NOT political in nature.

Not saying that what it says is good or bad, just that the political aspect in that case is theirs not the project’s.

It’s hard not to read politics into it when his professional blog is 50% politics and 50% about his comic and game development.

Odd, then, that I don’t find it that hard not to read politics into it. Perhaps it is because I don’t read his blog? Or because, if I did, I’d likely just skip the entries that were political in nature. Unless you are saying that his blog actually ties his politics into his comics and games, rather than discussing them separately?

A blog that discusses political matters and artistic matters shows that TenNapel is both a poltically active person AND an artist. It doesn’t automatically make the art itself political, IMHO.

     
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Mister Ed - 03 June 2013 10:16 AM
Oscar - 01 June 2013 05:25 AM
Mister Ed - 31 May 2013 07:16 PM
Iznogood - 31 May 2013 06:15 PM

Now lets just imagine for a moment that President Obama decided he wanted to be a game developer instead of president, and started a kikstarter for some game, (yes i know it is not very likely to happen, it is a hypothetical situation) would you then also claim that there is no political aspect about that project?

Yes, provided the game he was developing wasn’t political in nature. No doubt some people would read his politics into it, no matter what, because of who he is, but that doesn’t mean that the project IS political. Outside people imposing some sort of poltical meaning on the project wouldn’t make the project political, IMHO, it would simply make their personal view of it political. That says far more about THEM, though, than it does about the project, if said project is NOT political in nature.

Not saying that what it says is good or bad, just that the political aspect in that case is theirs not the project’s.

It’s hard not to read politics into it when his professional blog is 50% politics and 50% about his comic and game development.

Odd, then, that I don’t find it that hard not to read politics into it. Perhaps it is because I don’t read his blog? Or because, if I did, I’d likely just skip the entries that were political in nature. Unless you are saying that his blog actually ties his politics into his comics and games, rather than discussing them separately?

A blog that discusses political matters and artistic matters shows that TenNapel is both a poltically active person AND an artist. It doesn’t automatically make the art itself political, IMHO.

I haven’t read the blog (not interested) but I know he’s got a piece there titled “Why I’m a Politically Conservative Artist”. It’s rambling and I can’t make much of it since you almost certainly need to know more than I do about American politics, but I think it’s pretty clear he doesn’t think of art as apolitical.

     

Total Posts: 247

Joined 2012-05-21

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Oscar - 03 June 2013 10:52 AM
Mister Ed - 03 June 2013 10:16 AM
Oscar - 01 June 2013 05:25 AM
Mister Ed - 31 May 2013 07:16 PM
Iznogood - 31 May 2013 06:15 PM

Now lets just imagine for a moment that President Obama decided he wanted to be a game developer instead of president, and started a kikstarter for some game, (yes i know it is not very likely to happen, it is a hypothetical situation) would you then also claim that there is no political aspect about that project?

Yes, provided the game he was developing wasn’t political in nature. No doubt some people would read his politics into it, no matter what, because of who he is, but that doesn’t mean that the project IS political. Outside people imposing some sort of poltical meaning on the project wouldn’t make the project political, IMHO, it would simply make their personal view of it political. That says far more about THEM, though, than it does about the project, if said project is NOT political in nature.

Not saying that what it says is good or bad, just that the political aspect in that case is theirs not the project’s.

It’s hard not to read politics into it when his professional blog is 50% politics and 50% about his comic and game development.

Odd, then, that I don’t find it that hard not to read politics into it. Perhaps it is because I don’t read his blog? Or because, if I did, I’d likely just skip the entries that were political in nature. Unless you are saying that his blog actually ties his politics into his comics and games, rather than discussing them separately?

A blog that discusses political matters and artistic matters shows that TenNapel is both a poltically active person AND an artist. It doesn’t automatically make the art itself political, IMHO.

I haven’t read the blog (not interested) but I know he’s got a piece there titled “Why I’m a Politically Conservative Artist”. It’s rambling and I can’t make much of it since you almost certainly need to know more than I do about American politics, but I think it’s pretty clear he doesn’t think of art as apolitical.

Actually, thanks to your pointing it out I actually read that particular blog. I find very little in there that actually implies his art is political. It is mostly explaining why he is conservative even though he is an artist and the general assumption is that artists are liberals. There is some acknowledgement near the beginning that his religious views find expression in his art (and I can assume that the same might be said to be true for his political views), but nothing suggesting that this is universally true of his art, and that is not the point of the blog, which mainly describes why he is a conservative, not why his art is. Inasmuch as he ties his conservatism to his being an artist, it is over financial issues, it seems, like IP rights, and how art sells better when the economy is booming.

     
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Doug TenNapel’s only crime is that he is an unapologetically patriotic American and a proud conservative. People calling him an “asshole” simply don’t like his politics. It’s as simple as that. If this guy were a raging liberal whining about how government doesn’t provide him with enough free stuff, or if he were bashing Christians and disgustingly blaming the great United States or Israel for every problem in the world, then many of these same people throwing hissies over TenNapel having opinions wouldn’t bat an eye. This is about TenNapel expressing politically incorrect opinions, and nothing more.

Well, guess what, the brave and principled man Doug TenNapel seems like a fine person to me, and he’s also a brilliant artist who is going to provide us all with an amazing new adventure game. Deal with it, people.

I say we reject the political and cultural witch hunt instigators!

     
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And can I just say how absolutely disgusting it is for people to attack and smear as “worse than Hitler” anyone who believes the definition of marriage should not be changed. Having that opinion does not make one anti-gay, and it is is a perfectly legitimate opinion to hold. This is also the position that Obama ran on in 2008. Funny how he wasn’t smeared as a hateful anti-gay bigot homophobe for it then. (For those outside the US reading this and wondering whether Obama has been a good president, I will fill you in and tell you categorically that he has been utter crap.) Most of the “hate” is, in reality, coming from the people who won’t tolerate other opinions on this issue. The whole thing is a farce and is about the desire to have power and control. This isn’t simply about “equality.”

Sorry if I posted something similar earlier. Just saw this thread again and it pissed me off all over again. I haven’t been following all this too closely, but I sure hope that many people are defending TenNapel and shaming and calling out the true assholes who are trying to make TenNapel out to be some hateful super villain.

     

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