05-03-2010, 10:23 AM | #41 | |
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Also, other games don't require much skill either, been hearing this thing in WoW for many years. Well, I was in one of the EU-side top guilds for quite awhile, skill at what? at pushing buttons? it's just a video game, people play it as long as they have fun and that's what it's designed to give, some hours of fun. Video Games are not Poincare's conjecture nor quantum gravity nor do they require reflexes that f16 pilots have. They're just games, I really fail to see any skill or intellectual challenges in them, they're a medium for entertainment and that's what they provide. |
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05-03-2010, 10:25 AM | #42 | ||
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05-03-2010, 10:31 AM | #43 |
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05-03-2010, 10:43 AM | #44 |
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AGs not challenging?
Should something burn half of the brain cells to be considered challenging? |
05-03-2010, 10:47 AM | #45 | |
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You can "hardly" think it compares to getting a phd, but yet millions get PHDs. How about we use your boring=no challenge argument. I find going to school boring, so it is not challenging. |
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05-03-2010, 10:48 AM | #46 |
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05-03-2010, 11:04 AM | #47 | |
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It is competitive to get an MD/PhD spot in good university and demands lots of work to complete. How does that compare to a video game? Also for the millions, if RHEM was good, then more millions would have played it, it happens with the better video games out there. |
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05-03-2010, 11:10 AM | #48 |
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Anyhow, all this is getting a little off topic, I'll stick to the main topic of this thread.
If peeps like to believe that completing Myst is an IQ certificate, they can write it more if it helps them believe it themselves, I won't interfere. Last edited by imisssunwell; 05-03-2010 at 11:20 AM. |
05-03-2010, 11:11 AM | #49 | |
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1. It is boring, therefore not challenging. Getting a PHD is boring, therefore not challenging. 2. Thousands have done it, therefore it is not challenging. Millions have their PHD, therefore it is not challenging. I can quote where you made these assertions if you'd like. |
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05-03-2010, 11:15 AM | #50 |
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On the other hand, if some elitist believes that an Ivy League admission, a PhD or the invention of the nuclear bomb are the only challenging things in life, I won't interfere.
No more off topic from me for this ridiculous argument |
05-03-2010, 11:17 AM | #51 |
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I don't think this argument helps the thread.
That being said, imissunwell, I think you don't know the definition of challenging would be my guess, because to claim adventure games aren't challenging is...well, I don't know how you could possibly back that statement up. Did anyone not find Riven challenging? Heck, I had to use a walkthrough for parts of TLJ, which I found challenging from time to time. Amber: Journeys Beyond was challenging, for sure, so was Blackstone Chronicles in places. Myst definitely was. Myst III had its moments. I can't think of a single adventure I've played, and I'm purty smart, that I didn't think was challenging. Ok, Loom wasn't. That being said, going back to original thread, I truly believe this is the best time ever for adventure games. Even in the "glory years," in the 90s you didn't have not only this much (Heavy Rain, Sam & Max) coming from the major publishers, you also have tons of really quality independent adventures (The Whispered World, Dark Fall) also coming out. There's simply, for me, way too much to choose from. I only get to 2-3 games/year, and I don't even know where to begin. Good stuff.
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05-03-2010, 12:46 PM | #52 |
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The disturbing trend to me is toward casual portal/drm based gaming.
Casual portal/drm based games. I don't support DRM and will leave that to another discussion. Developers that are well loved such as Tex Murphy's creators have gone over to the casual type games instead of traditional adventures that I personally want to play. I love the Blackwell series, but I would not support DRM based Emerald City Confidential... up until it was $2.99 on Steam... for 3 bucks, I figure'd who cares. The "game" was barely a game. Find sparkling object in the room, talk using all threads, move on... constant bombardment of "quests" interrupting the flow of gameplay, telling you exactly what to do next. I deleted it after less than an hour. If that is the future of adventures, I want no part of it! |
05-03-2010, 12:59 PM | #53 |
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I haven't followed all of the discussion here because it drifted a little off topic but i got from the first page that other platforms than PC have been discussed.
How about thinking about the iPad and derivatives that will follow. I believe those would be a great opportunity to expand the base of AG users. I reckon that a lot of the "hardware geeks" and "early adaptors" are possibly interested in AGs. Think of an easy to use touch interface, a sufficiently large screen and additional features and functions (3G, 4G, skype mphone, etc ...) and there's a formula for success. I don't know exactly how things work there but I think Apple must have a real interest in getting good titles for the "skillet" (sorry). So I guess the developer software must be virtually free. I really don't know about those things. I've heard quite a few people who'd love to see AGs on the iPhone but why would you go for that if you can have a decent screen? And near reasonable ratio , too. Well, those are my two cents. What do you think of the future of gaming on the pad? I think it could open a whole new market. Cheers, Dan. |
05-03-2010, 02:45 PM | #54 |
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I agree with the OP. The gaming industry is very saturated and for the past few years it seems like the major game companies have done nothing but recycle their own ideas over and over again. It appears to me that recently, game developers have been trying to explore other genres and moving away from the counterproductive generic mainstream FPS titles.
I don't believe that we'll see a full revival of the classic point-and-click graphic adventure games, but it'd be plausible to expect future games to incorporate more elements from the genre. A good example would be 'Heavy Rain'. The final product of that title is an extremely polished adventure game with a few button-mashing fight sequences and a captivating plot. The sales appear to have been relatively good, specially if you take into consideration how much the average 'adventure' game sells. I wouldn't be surprised if its creators had another go at developing something similar. Hopefully it'll turn into a trend that will help traditional adventure games get back on track, though we should expect them to be slightly dumbened down and with small features that are supposed to make them attractive to younger generations and casual gamers. Lucasarts' remakes are also worth mentioning. They're obviously trying to revive the Monkey Island series and slightly adapting them to the mainstream (an example of this would be the ability to ask for hints to solve the game's numerous puzzles). |
05-03-2010, 03:27 PM | #55 | |
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05-03-2010, 03:32 PM | #56 | |
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The problem I see with the iPad is that while I want to buy one, I don't know what to do with it. At the moment it doesn't offer too much in comparison to an iphone and also my laptop (apple) is really lightweight and it can certainly do everything the iPad does. It is not a gaming console, it is not a mobile phone, it is not a laptop. I guess I'll just buy it and find out what to do with it later The Dev Software is, iirc, XCode (which comes with every new mac for free, together with the OS) and the iPhone SDK, which is also free, requiring a mere registration. So yes, it could expand the amount of games available for iPhoneOS environments but I don't expect to see it attract allot of heavy weight titles in the style of Mass Effect. In my view iPad is sexy and a worthy gadget but I don't see it replacing my 360 as my main gaming platform. |
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05-03-2010, 04:36 PM | #57 | |
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No, just kidding (kind of), but I do think there's huge potential there. Sooo many people are buying them/have bought them, and from what I've experienced the apps and games seem to be what most users spend their time on. So what better place for AG's to stand out where the Mass Effect's and the God of War's don't belong? This is part of what I mean by indie developers having their 'own thing' now - they don't necessarily need to compete. They are the game that sells for far less than the console competititors and such, and are the games you find on steam, on the app store, etc. I think it's great! Where they once disappeared into obscurity in the PC aisle underneath the million copies of the next firs person shooter and WoW expansions, they now have their own pedastal to show themselves off on. It was a sad time to see the decline in AG boxes on shelves, agreed, but it's better to see them gain more success this way at least. And as for Monkey Island, I wholeheartedly agree with it being a major positive influence. If anything, it's drawing more people into this market of AG's in digital distribution. As Jacques said, the AG's are all connected with each other, bringing more audiences back into the genre. And so what if they are cashing in on an old franchise? The games were great, they ARE bringing plenty more attention to AG's, and they're updated and adapted - as people have mentioned - to today's standard of playing AG's (which is to have hint systems, improved animation etc). By the way, thank you to those that brought this back on topic
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05-03-2010, 05:33 PM | #58 |
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Online stores but mostly their ability to provide a platform for episodic gaming can boost AGs (and indie games in general).
Also locked platforms do help against piracy. Other networks like the xbox network/psn also provide a similar structure, the only advantage the iPad has is that it makes point & click intuitive, its point & touch now. I feel that without the use of a touch screen this interface belongs to the stoneage of gaming but it seems natural enough for the ipad. My concerns are in its limitations, it memory, processor & disk space - It has little to no support for AAA+ stuff. If it is an indie only platform, is that enough for purchasing it? It will depend on the quality of indie games. E.g. indie rpg games are generally speaking of low quality and the high-budget titles are usually far better. If the *whole* ScummVM collection got a remake (that is all old Lucasarts games) and 2-3 titles are iPad exclusive, it would do the job for me. I love these games but I just can't get into them anymore. New graphics, sounds & an intuitive control system would do what it takes. Ragnar announcing Dreamfall chapters coming to the iPad 1 month before the PC version would make me buy all stock but that's probably not gonna happen. It all comes down to effectiveness/cost, will the iPad manage to attract ~15 good & new games plus 3-4 exclusives? Then it should be good value/money. Of course this is about if it's worth it as a gaming platform, gadgetwhores like me will get it anyhow. ps: My other concern is, considering clients don't really own the game anymore, will the pricing be reasonable? If online distribution is indeed the way of the future, I want rental prices, not prices which the a retail copy of the full game would cost. |
05-03-2010, 10:35 PM | #59 | ||||||||||
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So the question I ask wouldn't be to you in this case; it would be asked of Eidos. Which could lead to a dialogue about the idea that there could be different kinds of games that fall under the umbrella of "adventure game" - games that feature no action but only puzzles, games that include some action with puzzles, and so forth. Quote:
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Remember, Dreamfall also got a lot of hype. It also got a lot of controversy, here in discussions and at other adventure game forums. Many outspoken adventure gamers hated it because they thought it signaled the death of 2D point-&-clickers. Well, was it the death of 2D? Quote:
No wonder David Cage and Ragnar Tornquist and even the Rand brothers stopped listening to this "small whiny group" while producing their new titles. In the end these creators chose to DUMP the traditional 2D point-&-click puzzle paradigm behind them, in spite of what the tiny number of 2D traditionalists demanded of them (I remember an interview where Tornquist complained in passing about this vociferous group). That in part finally allowed them the freedom to create such games that offered new experiences to us - Uru, Myst V, In Memoriam, Dreamfall, Indigo Prophecy, Heavy Rain, etc. Quote:
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05-04-2010, 12:46 AM | #60 | ||||||||||
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As for the second bit. I guess that's possible looking at games like Dreamfall and Fahrenheit and probably Heavy Rain but the emphasis of the action sequences has to be on the story rather than the challenge otherwise I wouldn't call it an AG. Quote:
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One final question. I also asked someone else but maybe you can answer this too. Do you know of Uncharted is going to get a PC release somewhere in the near future? Because you keep mentioning that game along with Tomb Raider and I love those games. And even more importantly do you know if Heavy Rain is ever going to be released for PC? Last edited by gray pierce; 05-04-2010 at 01:45 AM. Reason: Fixed quote tag |
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