[mgeorge]

For me it's refreshing to see some honest go goodness debating around here. Everyones to nice on these forums haha.

Anyway, back on topic.

I asked earlier in this thread if there's a definitive release date yet, because truthfully, this game does intrigue me, even if I am personally disappointed in the genre as of late. However no one has answered.

Anyone know, other than Q4 of 2010?

[Hannes]

Originally Posted by Luther10

OMG, not this again... LOL at the game requiring no thought and only button presing skills... At least get the facts right, if you've not played the game...

I have and for the most part, that's exactly what it was (along with shaking and tilting). Just like Fahrenheit.

Originally Posted by Luther10

And come on, no one expected Heavy Rain to sell this good. It's definitely a surprise. Monstrous marketing certainly helps a bit into making the game a million seller, but quality of the game itself is definitely the main driving force here...

Actually, since Fahrenheit sold so well, I expected this from Heavy Rain as well. They make big budget games and promote them, of course they'll sell.

[Sughly]

Originally Posted by AndreaDraco83

Even if I understand where all of you are coming from, can we please stay on topic and talk about Gray Matter? Let's discuss Heavy Rain in the appropriate thread

+1. Curse the person who brought up the xbox port!

I'm just joking, please don't attack me

[UPtimist]

Originally Posted by Hannes

Why do you worry about things you don't know about? Wait and see.

In case someone happens to get the message and fixes it.

Anyways, too bad about the XBox version not being regular point'n'click (the Monkey Island SE worked just fine). I'll have to rethink what I'll get the game for.

[Igor]

http://www.gameboomers.com/Editorial...GrayMatter.htm

Looks promising

[UPtimist]

Always great to have even a bit of info (and it's great that it shows that there's been so much progress that they can show it off) Thanks for posting it.

[Lupin The Third]

Originally Posted by Phaid

De-railing this thread is not my intention, but I feel obliged to respond to certain accusations.

There's no need to speak in such an antagonizing tone. If you wish to spark a PC vs console debate however, be my guest.

Last time I checked, it's never been PC only, so I have no idea what you're getting at. The fact remains, an average consumer these days couldn't be less interested in the genre - that for the most part has nothing to do with the platform your typical adventure game gets released on.

You seem to miss the fact that I was responding to your assertion, and your implication that console gamers are idiots, with the comment you made about the game being on a console won't make console gamers want it.
Your comment was clearly ripe with vitriol for console gamers. Maybe you didn't mean it, but it was there...acting like you didn't make the implication is childish and silly. My point wasn't a "let's start a PC vs Console debate". It was clearly to illustrate that if you want to make unfounded implications about console gamers the exact same things can be done for the PC crowd.

Originally Posted by Phaid

Except pretty much everyone who owns a console already has a PC more than capable of running adventure games, yet vast majority of people choose to play Farmville, PoP Cap Games etc. as opposed to giving representatives of the aformentioned genre a chance. Why? "Not enough action, they're BORING." It is delusional to assume that a console release will change anyone's taste.

Never said that being on a console would. I merely point out that not every console gamer wants to play Madden or GTA, in spite of how you want to characterize the situation.

Originally Posted by Phaid

Again, the antagonizing tone and putting words into my mouth won't help you get your point across.

Not at all what I was doing....

Originally Posted by Phaid

Yet even the adventure games that eventually made it there despite those difficulties were hardly good sellers.

I don't think we're in disagreement on this....nothing I said indicated that AGs were huge sellers or that Grey Matter is going to sell millions. But my point does stand that the genre will appear on PC because of economics, especially given the small nature of most AG devs, and nostalgia/history. That they appear less frequently on consoles isn't necessarily because console gamers don't want them.

Originally Posted by Phaid

The number of explosions on screen per minute was too low. It's as simple as that.
Need I remind you that quite a lot of a.g. made it to the consoles, too? How successful were they? Not very, it seems since not a single console publisher funds new releases anymore.

I'm sorry but how many publishers funded console ags ten years ago? Virtually no one. Almost every AG for a console has been a port. There are a few exceptions (especially amongst Japanese developers in the PSX/Saturn era with their psuedo-adventure/fmv games) but mostly the games have originated on PC and then received console ports. It's ALWAYS been that way. Again you seem to lack any historical perspective for how things became as they are. Sure, it's all the console gamer's faults that a PC_centric genre has dwindled into obscurity....sure it is....

Originally Posted by Phaid

And how many copies did other adventure games sell? Like recently released Sherlock Holmes on xbox360?

Well SH has been out in the US for less than a week. My copy's still in transit from Amazon. So that's maybe not the best example (unless someone can provide European sales of the port). I don't really see what you're disagreeing with here. Sale data for the PC versions of AGs are virtually impossible to find (just ask Sughly) so I really can't say how the genre compares cross platform. Can you show me sales data for a recent AG that shows it selling 100,000 copies? If you can I'd be glad to see a comparison. All you have to do is check Monkey Island's leaderboards to see that well over 100,000 gamers bought it for XBLA. By contrast we've no idea how many sold for PC. I'd certainly wager that more copies of MI sold on pc (duh!), but there really isn't anything to compare. So attacking the console crowd for supporting AGs really is childish. IF MI sold 750,000 copies on PC and 50,000 copies on XBLA, maybe then you'd have an argument.

But my examples for consoles do show that there is a market in the console world for these games. Obviously not like that of Halo, but neither is there a market share in the PC world for AGs on the scale of WOW.

Originally Posted by Phaid

HR is not an adventure game. It's an interactive movie. Dragon's Lair with an enormous budget and monstrous marketing machine of Sony behind it. It caught the attention of the masses with its great graphics and cinematic "feel", in addition, it was hyped for years as "something revolutionary". There are no puzzles, it requires no thought, only button pressing skills.
It's not a surprise it sold decently, considering all the aspects mentioned above.

Well I haven't played it yet....though, on a side note, it always amuses me to have seen reviewers who lambasted Shenmue's amazing use of QTE, which entirely paved reinvigorated designers to use it in a cinematic manner, then praise Indigo and Heavy Rain's use of the same concepts.

Whether it's an AG or not will obviously be debated for years to come, but clearly many consider it close enough in spirit to consider it so. Either way this is a game built on many of the storytelling foundations of AG and was very successful. And successful with a console crowd at that. Which only proves my point that games like Heavy Rain and Alan Wake prove that there is a mature demographic of console gamers who are receptive of AGs and games that draw inspiration from them.

Originally Posted by Phaid

Gray Matter, on the other hand, will NOT sell nearly as good. It's an adventure game, and those products masses are NOT interested in. Let's see where your "adventure games-loving console audience which bought Heavy Rain" will be when the game ships.

Talk about attitude...and the anger beneath the surface finally bubbles forth for all to see. Your hostility toward consoles is immature and stupid. ANY sales of Grey Matter on the console will only add more revenues for the developer. But if you want to deny an AG developer revenue...well then...by all means....that'll certainly help the genre! No offense but Grey Matter won't sell as many copies on the PC as Heavy Rain did on PS3. And you're deluding yourself if you think your argument has any validity to it.

Originally Posted by Phaid

Freaked out? I haven't noticed.

Here's a few examples of people being upset and it took me all of 5 seconds to google them....
http://www.playfire.com/a/forum/mach...m/thread/73588
http://www.xblafans.com/tag/machinarium
http://topnews.us/content/216466-mic...rt-machinarium
http://kotaku.com/5514127/report-mac...-%5Bupdated%5D
http://xboxblips.dailyradar.com/stor...used-for-xbla/
http://play.tm/wire/3461217/microsof...ium-from-xbla/
http://www.destructoid.com/microsoft...a-170603.phtml

...maybe you should read a website other than just this one?

Originally Posted by Phaid

Nothing wrong with adventure gaming on the go.

Which only proves my points. Why are you even debating this issue?

Originally Posted by Phaid

They ship consoles with 57" HDTVs these days? PCs, including even the cheapest laptops have HDMI ports for a reason.

True....so then I can sit with a laptop on my lap while playing or come up with some keyboard/mouse apparatus that works on my lap....sure you can make PC gaming work on a TV in your living room. But personally I'd rather just have a console option.

Originally Posted by Phaid

Where you put your computer or whether you buy a desktop or a laptop is entirely up to you. You have only yourslef to blame if you threw your computer into the office.

This is just an idiotic response. It doesn't fit everyone's lifestyle to setup their PC next to their living room tv, or however else you'd have me play games. What works for you may not work for someone else.

Originally Posted by Phaid

You twisted my argument which had nothing to do with attacking anything or anyone and for some reason unnecessarily sparked an anti-PC tirade. Let us forget about this incident and get back on topic.

Not really, your implication is clear as day and your responses only emphasize your disdain for console gamers. While that's entirely your right to be a console bigot I have every right to illustrate how your attitude is silly and only detrimental to the AG genre. But I guess because I bought Sherlock Holmes for 360 instead of PC, because I'll have more enjoyment and access to playing it on a console, I guess that makes me a bad Adventuregamer....

[Lupin The Third]

Originally Posted by Intrepid Homoludens

I actually played Still Life on the original XBox. Started it on an analog TV, then about halfway through I acquired an HDTV and proceeded from there. I had a difficult time reading the text, as it was originally done for low res screens for the console.

Regardless, I enjoy the game and was able to kick my feet up, sit back, and just work the controller interface.

It would be awesome to have more adventure game developers and publishers invest resources in bringing more games to consoles and do heavy marketing for it accordingly. I would definitely support it as a consumer.

Gray Matter is gonna look amazing in high res on large HDTV screens!

Same here. I played Still Life and both Syberias on Xbox 1 and loved them. I even went and bought Syberia for PC after wards just to have it available on another format (though it's still sealed). I was hoping Still Life 2 would get a console port but after the reviews I lost interest in playing it at all. And Monkey Island totally disproved the assertion that a good control scheme can't be designed for consoles that stays true to the PC version. I wish Grey Matter for 360 was using a similar system rather than the highlighting system they're touting. Which give me shivers to think that it may work like Wallace & Grommit's....ughhh....

Originally Posted by Luther10

I'll write to whoever in charge, developer or distributer, and demand a ps3 version. They said they want to reach a broader audience then why not release the game on all platforms? They can just get another company to do the port if they don't know how to do one. Anyway I wonder if different versions have different prices? Will the 360 version have a regular price tag of $59.99?

I agree that a $60 price tag would be crazy, for either version. I doubt writing to the dev will make a difference. The fact that there's any console version is surprising and given the developer's small size I doubt they could handle a third version right now. But perhaps there will be a PS3 version after release. In all likelyhood they probably chose the 360 first due to the fact that it's universally considered to be a very easy machine to work with and less intensive to design for than the PS3. Just a guess mind you, but while a company like Squaresoft or Activision has the resources to learn how to properly use the PS3 hardware a small AG developer might have a much more difficult time. Or maybe they felt it was a better fit for them in terms of the software library...who knows? It would be interesting to know.

[Lupin The Third]

Originally Posted by Igor

http://www.gameboomers.com/Editorial...GrayMatter.htm

Looks promising

Agreed....I just want to see some actual footage.

[Intrepid Homoludens]

Originally Posted by Lupin The Third

You seem to miss the fact that I was responding to your assertion, and your implication that console gamers are idiots, with the comment you made about the game being on a console won't make console gamers want it.
Your comment was clearly ripe with vitriol for console gamers. Maybe you didn't mean it, but it was there...acting like you didn't make the implication is childish and silly. My point wasn't a "let's start a PC vs Console debate". It was clearly to illustrate that if you want to make unfounded implications about console gamers the exact same things can be done for the PC crowd.

That's what I got from his post as well. I'll not go into, though, as you have already eloquently spoken on my behalf.

In any case, that Gray Matter will be a multiplatform release can only be a good thing, yes? If the Xbox version sells even just some tens of thousands of copies, that should augment the number of sales it will have on the PC, thereby making even more money for the game, allowing console gamers to enjoy an adventure game and wanting more of it, and upping the possibility of a sequel and/or some more multiplatform adventure games down the line.

Furthermore, 300,000 iPads sold on its day of release, and sales continue to climb. That's a ton of potential gamers right there for adventure games (and other kinds of games, natch). With more advanced technology coming up in hardware, why should adventure game developers, whether established or independent, restrict themselves to PC releases only? To me choosing that restriction is idiotic and masochistic, if not outright suicidal, in terms of business.

[MoP]

I think you're a bit over-reacting, seeing an attack in every opinion that isn't a pro-console one. (not commenting on the validity of the statement, just the reaction to it)

Ripe with vitriol? I don't see how
"console gamers likely also own a PC (capable of running an AG), so if they were interested in the game they could also get it for the PC"
is an

Originally Posted by Lupin The Third

assertion and implication that console gamers are idiots

Calm down. Not everyone that doesn't see consoles as the second coming is a close-minded hater.

Sorry for further derailing.

[Little Writer]

Why do I think of NCIS's Pauley Perrette when I look at the (current) cover?

[UPtimist]

Just to note that, in case you haven't noticed, the official site and the links and screenshots and whatnot are working just fine now.

[Lupin The Third]

Originally Posted by Intrepid Homoludens

That's what I got from his post as well. I'll not go into, though, as you have already eloquently spoken on my behalf.

In any case, that Gray Matter will be a multiplatform release can only be a good thing, yes? If the Xbox version sells even just some tens of thousands of copies, that should augment the number of sales it will have on the PC, thereby making even more money for the game, allowing console gamers to enjoy an adventure game and wanting more of it, and upping the possibility of a sequel and/or some more multiplatform adventure games down the line.

Furthermore, 300,000 iPads sold on its day of release, and sales continue to climb. That's a ton of potential gamers right there for adventure games (and other kinds of games, natch). With more advanced technology coming up in hardware, why should adventure game developers, whether established or independent, restrict themselves to PC releases only? To me choosing that restriction is idiotic and masochistic, if not outright suicidal, in terms of business.

Just for the heck of it I took a peek today at MI:SE on XBLA, according to the leaderboards just under 125,000 gamers have bought the game. Last time I looked at this was at the end of December when it went on sale for a day as part of MS's holiday celebration. At that time it was around 110,000. Sure 15,000 additional copies sold in the past few months isn't much....but I doubt LucasArts is scoffing at the extra $150,000 in revenue. And this extra revenue is only going to help make more remakes/re-releases possible. Especially given the relative inexpensive nature of remaking a game like MI. But if people here really think that $1.25 Million dollars from Xbox gamers alone isn't going to help the AG genre then they're seriously deluded.

Will Grey Matter sell as well? No idea...it might between both the US and Europe. But even if it only sells 50,000-70,000 on 360 alone that's only a positive thing for the developer, the genre, and even PC-only gamers. It is interesting how things like the ipad/iphone and NDS get an exemption from being considered a "console" by the crowd that then picks on us for also wanting the same games on a 360 or PS3....

[Lupin The Third]

Originally Posted by UPtimist

Just to note that, in case you haven't noticed, the official site and the links and screenshots and whatnot are working just fine now.

I love the music and ambiance. I also like what I've read about the magic system. I don't recall a game in quite a while that's used magic in a non-RPG formula...Eternal Darkness is the last good example I can think of. Hopefully this will be equally clever and make for a great gameplay/puzzle solving addition.

[UPtimist]

I'm wondering whether the choice of themes in Gray Matter has anything to do with the fact that GK4 was never made - after all, both had/have the theme of ghosts (GK4 famously had hints starting from GK3's Sidney search (and eventually JJ said it herself, right?) and in Gray Matter you can see from David Styles' bio page that "there have already been rumours that mr. Styles migh be haunted by his late wife" (and I'm sure this has been common knowledge quite from the beginning)). Of course Gray Matter probably also focuses more on the subconcious and such while GK4 would've been more purely about the supernatural (I'm not saying GM won't be, but I'm sure you understand the difference I'm talking about). But still could there be any intentional connection, or was it just the convenient way to make the story, with the same ingredients?

[teme]

Eurogamer just posted nice and positive preview of Gray Matter: http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/gray-matter-preview

[UPtimist]

Thanks! Nice to see it getting coverage in sites that aren't so AG-oriented. Bodes well, perhaps?

[AndreaDraco83]

Yeah, I hope it bodes well for the game. Certainly the preview seems enthusiastic.

[booB]

Sorry if this has been brought up already, but I'm too lazy to go back and re-read five zillion posts on this topic. I noticed that the short blurb about this game says that it will feature point-and-click control, as well as direct (game pad) control. Obviously the latter is because of the Xbox version coming out... but does anyone know if the PC version will include the direct control option as well? I'm hoping it does, because I was one of the few who enjoyed the direct control on games like Dreamfall and Broken Sword 3. Likewise, the P&C option should be available for people who want it as well.

Forgive me, as I just now started checking out the screens and news blurbs for this game. Consider me an excited passenger on the hype train!