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Two Guys from Andromeda (Space Quest creators) on Kickstarter

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Frogacuda - 09 June 2012 08:26 AM
Oscar - 09 June 2012 08:16 AM

Well, the last few months have shown that a market without publishers is better for adventure gamers in terms of getting games out there. It’s better for everyone concerned - the fans, the developers. Everyone except the publishers, who never really did anything anyway. The only thing now is to wait and see if the quality is up to scratch - which it may not be considering the funding is already there and developers don’t have to break their backs winning over buyers.

Look, publishers aren’t just lunks that like first-person shooters. They’re investors and they don’t like to gamble, so they invest based on observable trends in the market. They don’t want to invest in old brands or niche genres because there’s no tangible metric that shows there’s a market willing to pay for them.

But if that changes, publishers will change their tune as well. It’s not that publishers don’t like adventure games, but they need someone else to take the risk for them and show this is for real. Trust me when I say that publishers are looking very closely at this Kickstarter trend and they want to see where it goes.

And that’s a good thing. Crowdsourcing can’t support an entire genre forever, nor should it have to. That’s not good for consumers, either.

Why? I don’t see why we should hold to the same model of game production forever. I am not sure why we should regard new systems of investment like kickstarter as merely temporary when consumers are becoming intelligent enough and informed enough to invest directly in them games themselves. Let’s get rid of the idea that publishers are necessary - they might be useful and in some cases desirable, but there’s no guarantee we’ll need them in the future.

     
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Frogacuda - 09 June 2012 08:26 AM
Oscar - 09 June 2012 08:16 AM

Well, the last few months have shown that a market without publishers is better for adventure gamers in terms of getting games out there. It’s better for everyone concerned - the fans, the developers. Everyone except the publishers, who never really did anything anyway. The only thing now is to wait and see if the quality is up to scratch - which it may not be considering the funding is already there and developers don’t have to break their backs winning over buyers.

Look, publishers aren’t just lunks that like first-person shooters. They’re investors and they don’t like to gamble, so they invest based on observable trends in the market. They don’t want to invest in old brands or niche genres because there’s no tangible metric that shows there’s a market willing to pay for them.

But if that changes, publishers will change their tune as well. It’s not that publishers don’t like adventure games, but they need someone else to take the risk for them and show this is for real. Trust me when I say that publishers are looking very closely at this Kickstarter trend and they want to see where it goes.

And that’s a good thing. Crowdsourcing can’t support an entire genre forever, nor should it have to. That’s not good for consumers, either.

It certainly will be interesting to see the outcome of these Kickstarters.

If it leads to large sales once the product is out then publishers etc will get more interested in investing in developing more games.

However there is a big risk that the only people who would buy the end product (or at least a large percentage of them) are backer who are getting a free copy of the game. In that scenario the developer doesn’t make any profit for their next project etc.

     

An adventure game is nothing more than a good story set with engaging puzzles that fit seamlessly in with the story and the characters, and looks and sounds beautiful.
Roberta Williams

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If we’re going to experience a publisher-free future in the genre, then I’d prefer to see studios follow the idea of Jane Jensen’s CSG model, rather than a continuous stream of Kickstarters. The hope would also be that once these studios use the initial investment to get off the ground, they can roll their profits into the next project, and steadily become self-sustaining.

Lucien21 - 09 June 2012 09:31 AM

However there is a big risk that the only people who would buy the end product (or at least a large percentage of them) are backer who are getting a free copy of the game. In that scenario the developer doesn’t make any profit for their next project etc.

That is of course is one of the big issues hanging overhead.

     
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Oscar - 09 June 2012 09:20 AM

Why? I don’t see why we should hold to the same model of game production forever. I am not sure why we should regard new systems of investment like kickstarter as merely temporary when consumers are becoming intelligent enough and informed enough to invest directly in them games themselves.

I’m not saying Kickstarter should be temporary, I’m saying that the games raising significant amounts of money on Kickstarter should be exceptional. They should be different, special, and they should have a reason for asking a bunch of hard-working gamers for their money instead of a publisher (and that reason shouldn’t just be “I want free money that I don’t have to pay back).

To just ask people to fork over massive amounts of money because you don’t want to go to actual investors is predatory. It’s anti-consumer. It offloads all of the risk from any developer or investor, while not sharing any of the profit. It gives consumers no ability to really fairly determine if a game is even good or not, because it doesn’t exist. It forces people to cough up large sums of money on a potentially empty promise.

And that’s a risk I’m willing to take every now and then to get what I want when other options have been exhausted, but I wouldn’t want to live in a world where that’s the default way that games are made.

Let’s get rid of the idea that publishers are necessary - they might be useful and in some cases desirable, but there’s no guarantee we’ll need them in the future.

We have gotten rid of the idea that publishers are necessary, and that’s important. There’s another option now. But that doesn’t mean that publishers are irrelevant, or even that they aren’t the best first option for most projects.

The problem with publishers and venture capital was simply that they were the only real options, and they make their decisions conservatively. KS is important as an alternative, but it must remain an alternative.

     
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Lucien21 - 09 June 2012 09:31 AM

However there is a big risk that the only people who would buy the end product (or at least a large percentage of them) are backer who are getting a free copy of the game. In that scenario the developer doesn’t make any profit for their next project etc.

First of all, developers have been risking not getting a profit from their games for the entire history of the game industry. Most games don’t make any additional profit for the developer, in fact. So that’s hardly a scary proposition.

In fact, in order to be as bad as the norm, they’d have to sell ZERO copies. Are you really worried about that possibility? The number of people giving to these Kickstarters, even Double Fine’s, is incredibly low compared to the sales of even moderately low-profile indie games. If Double Fine Adventure sells as much as, say, Machinarium they will have made more money than they ever did on Brutal Legend.

Kickstarter is a no-lose proposition for a developer. All the risk is really put on the backers, which is why I would never hope for it to be the standard funding model.

     
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The big final push has started. Over 50k in the last 2 days according to kicktraq.

Hope they make it.

     

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It will be a damn shame if this falls through. My faith in humanity rests on the outcome of this campaign

     

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it WILL make it. Pretty sure Scott and Mark and a few of the super backers have a few tricks of their sleeves still.

Plus, its the weekend and once everyone realizes only 2 days remain, the shit is going to hit the fan and Ace will soon exist to clean the place up!

     

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dooo not fear. They are pretty much in striking distance now, 500k should be inevitable.

     

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Yeah, plus we have an auction thats over 2k now and it doesn’t end till the final day, I think so who knows where it’ll be.

Also: I bet once people come home and see that the days have turned to mere hours 71 :shudders: Shit will get real

     
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And the next and presumably final interview will be with Gary Owens.

I was kind of hoping this final ‘blitz’ would have more media exposure, especially after the Gamasutra article and then after Ken Williams came out of hiding. However, this is entirely depending on social media exposure and these guys can’t get an article in the two big gaming websites, GameSpot or IGN.

It will feel like a triumph when we hit 500k, but I’ve prepared myself to be embarrassed and humiliated.

     
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This is going to be close.

$60k in 57 hours.

It must be about at the stage where it is surely worth Two Guys topping up the funding rather than have it fail. That of course assumes they can come up with $50-60k, but there is no point being 97% funded in this all or nothing system.

     

An adventure game is nothing more than a good story set with engaging puzzles that fit seamlessly in with the story and the characters, and looks and sounds beautiful.
Roberta Williams

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Lucien21 - 10 June 2012 04:25 AM

This is going to be close.

$60k in 57 hours.

It must be about at the stage where it is surely worth Two Guys topping up the funding rather than have it fail. That of course assumes they can come up with $50-60k, but there is no point being 97% funded in this all or nothing system.

No Kickstarter has ever failed at 97%+ ever. It just doesn’t happen, and it won’t here. This will make its goal, maybe go $15-20,000 over.

     
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Frogacuda - 10 June 2012 07:22 AM
Lucien21 - 10 June 2012 04:25 AM

This is going to be close.

$60k in 57 hours.

It must be about at the stage where it is surely worth Two Guys topping up the funding rather than have it fail. That of course assumes they can come up with $50-60k, but there is no point being 97% funded in this all or nothing system.

No Kickstarter has ever failed at 97%+ ever. It just doesn’t happen, and it won’t here. This will make its goal, maybe go $15-20,000 over.

And how would you know that. Kickstarter does a very good job of hiding it’s failures.

You can only search for ongoing or funded projects.

     

An adventure game is nothing more than a good story set with engaging puzzles that fit seamlessly in with the story and the characters, and looks and sounds beautiful.
Roberta Williams

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Lucien21 - 10 June 2012 04:25 AM

This is going to be close. $60k in 57 hours.

It must be about at the stage where it is surely worth Two Guys topping up the funding rather than have it fail.

Lucien21 - 10 June 2012 10:27 AM

Kickstarter does a very good job of hiding it’s failures. You can only search for ongoing or funded projects.

According to the FAQ, you should be able to find an unsuccessful project by searching for its name. However, I couldn’t get Rob Swigart’s Portal Reborn to come up when I tried that. I got a few other hits on unsuccessful projects though, so I’m pretty sure KS doesn’t try to “hide” them.

Also, you can’t back your own project. If this is going to pull through, it’s up to the backers; the Two Guys can’t add any funds themselves.

     

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