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Old 02-19-2006, 04:21 AM   #841
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I can't see how Mirrormask is "too out there" at all. It all made sense to me, what with the entire film taking place in her imagination (or... is it?). I can't see how fantasy being "too out there" is a valid accusation, as everything in the movie had some kind of purpose and character.

But then, perhaps I'm an odd guy.
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Old 02-19-2006, 04:59 AM   #842
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Ofcourse LOTR or Willow is not "too out there" IMO this film made a hell of a lot more sense (ofcourse I haven't read LOTR) than any of those (lack of) fantasy films
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Old 02-19-2006, 06:29 AM   #843
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spiwak
That's not true. As long as it has a reason to be "out there."
I was going to quote your first sentence and disagree, but like that, I agree. I haven't seen MirrorMask, so I can't comment on that, but a movie can, most definitely, be "too far out there", namely when it deviates so much from normality for the sake of deviating from normality. In other words, when it does not have a reason to be "out there".

So, frankly put, as I see it, you haven't said anything to refute Legolas813's point at all.
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Old 02-19-2006, 07:39 AM   #844
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I wasn't really refuting his point. That's his opinion, and I was simple asserting my opinion with some good "out there" movies that I think are good examples of it. But if I wanted to refute his statement, and yours, I would say that "deviating from normality for the sake of deviating from normality" is in itself a reason for it to do so. What else were the surrealists doing when, for instance, Bunuel and Dali crafted Un Chien Andalou (just a popular example). When people tried to assert "meaning" and philosophies to the work Bunuel simply laughed it off, because it has no meaning other than to present some wierd crap that came from a conversation the two had about dreams. Or how about the Dada movement, which had the purpose of art with little or no meaning behind it but to question the meaning of art? When I said that it needs a reason that wasn't supposed to be taken as such a restricting bound, just an assumption that there is some thought to it.

It sounds to me like this MirrorMask is imitating some sort of dream world, so I would expect that many of the images don't mean anything and aren't necessarily connected to the rest of the movie. And I'm thinking that it's probably not so chaotic, so I figured that the statement I initially replied to probably didn't really apply to the movie. Again, I don't know about MirrorMask, but people have said to me the same line about movies that I think are actually structurally tight and deep, if they would just think about it a little more.

Again this is all opinion and speculation, and I'm not looking to start any arguments, but I just thought that if Legolas dislikes what he calls "abstract" cinema then he should try some of the bonafide masterpieces and see what he thinks. That's all.
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Old 02-19-2006, 10:09 AM   #845
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I've seen The New World. I though it was very good; beautiful and poetic, and for once it focuses on the meeting between two cultures, rather than on their clashes, which brings a breath of fresh air.
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Old 02-19-2006, 11:43 AM   #846
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spiwak
But if I wanted to refute his statement, and yours, I would say that "deviating from normality for the sake of deviating from normality" is in itself a reason for it to do so. What else were the surrealists doing when, for instance, Bunuel and Dali crafted Un Chien Andalou (just a popular example).
Then there is no such thing as being "out there" for "no reason", because that is always given if nothing else is. I'm sorry, Spiwak, but reading your posts seems like you're contradicting yourself to me - maybe I'm not catching your point (that's definitely possible), then, but that's how I see it. *shrug*
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Old 02-19-2006, 12:25 PM   #847
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I'm not saying I didn't like Mirrormask, but that it was very strange and different from a lot of movies I've seen. I think it might require a second watch to fully appreciate.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jjacob
Ofcourse LOTR or Willow is not "too out there" IMO this film made a hell of a lot more sense (ofcourse I haven't read LOTR) than any of those (lack of) fantasy films
LOTR made perfect sense to me (but I did read the books, which of course are much better).
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Old 02-19-2006, 01:28 PM   #848
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Well, I just saw Dead Men Don't Wear Plaid, and I have to say I really liked it. It was a film noir parody with footage from old movies intercut, combining them with the new stuff. It created some fun moments and it was hilarious otherwise too (I'm great in this, aren't I?). It included such actors (in the old clips I mean) as Humphrey Bogart, Cary Grant, Joan Crawford and Ingrid Bergman. The story was a basic detective story parody...

I don't really know what to say...

And I still haven't finished Where's Marlowe... Funny how all the movies I see are some kind of detective stories...
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Old 02-19-2006, 02:03 PM   #849
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UPtimist
Well, I just saw Dead Men Don't Wear Plaid...
I would've watched it too, but I've began to really dislike these 4:3 versions.
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Old 02-19-2006, 03:27 PM   #850
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I love Dead Men Don't Wear Plaid, one of Steve Martins best. Makes me shiver whenever I see the Cheaper By The Dozen 2 posters
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Old 02-19-2006, 03:47 PM   #851
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I swore I posted, but it disappeared.

Ah well.

Just finished The Corpse Bride. I know a ton of people didn't like it much (including Mira), but I rather thought it was lovely. Beautiful animation and elegant style dressed over a simple story that doesn't over-run... many thought it was boring. I personally think they might've been expecting another Nightmare Before Christmas, not this... which I feel is understated and closer to Burton's illustrations in tone. It's also quite a short film, which suits the story. Any longer would've been overkill. The songs, although not Nightmare-catchy, are also well written and fit the movie without getting in the way.

As a side note, I met a board artist that worked on it this week on my latest project. His own drawings really reflected his time on Corpse Bride and I should ask him about working with Burton. My only criticisms of the movie, something which a good friend shares, is the amount of mid-shots... it feels rather too tight on each character all the time and could've benefitted from wider framing. Sounds like something to discuss!

I also bought Ghost In The Shell: Innocence whilst in Japan. It's a great, eloquent piece of animation from Oshii... with a stunning soundtrack to boot. Some wonderful moments, even if the plot loses coherency about half way through, but the depth and visual splendour cast aside any negatives. Some might find it too slow, like Corpse Bride... perhaps its my age, but I found it really well paced.
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Old 02-19-2006, 04:20 PM   #852
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I haven't seen Corpse Bride (but want to) - a friend of mine has and LOVED it. She's a huge Nightmare Before Christmas fan and says that Corpse Bride isn't quite that but she loved it nonetheless. Also I've seen a couple of episodes of Ghost In The Shell: Stand Alone Complex on Cartoon Network but I keep missing it because when I try staying up to watch it (it's on laaaate), I end up falling asleep.
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Old 02-19-2006, 04:23 PM   #853
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To watch in the next few days:

Donnie Darko: Collector's Cut (to show what a cheapskate I am, I got this as a freebie disc with The Sunday Times, effectively getting the film for £1.80).

Wallace & Gromit: Curse of the Were-Rabbit (I'm not quite sure how I managed to miss this in the cinemas, but the DVD is out tomorrow).

Serenity (whenever my import copy arrives).

That's a lot of movies for me .
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Old 02-19-2006, 05:26 PM   #854
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Hm, shame I missed the Directors Cut of Darko. I've got the original on the oop Region 2 version with extras.

@Mel - I've no idea on the television series, but do check out the two movies. They're standalone in themselves so you don't really need to watch the tv show to understand it, only maybe the first film to truly get the second.

RE Corpse Bride/Nightmare, the two films are trying different things. I don't see them as a pair but as two movies in a varied directors repetoire that just happen to be model animated. As such, I didn't view CB through the eyes of a NBC fan, but as an animation and Burton fan. In my view it succeeded my somewhat low expectations!
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Old 02-19-2006, 06:06 PM   #855
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Quote:
Originally Posted by squarejawhero
My only criticisms of the movie, something which a good friend shares, is the amount of mid-shots... it feels rather too tight on each character all the time and could've benefitted from wider framing.
Funny, I thought I was the only one who came away from it with that feeling. My friends completely disagreed with me.

My guess would be that Burton was so excited about using the new gear and paddle facial system, which allowed for extremely smooth expression changes, that he wanted to keep the camera near the characters in order to showcase this to the fullest.
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Old 02-19-2006, 08:01 PM   #856
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It's not the last movie I saw by a long shot (there's been all kinds of things in between, from Sunset Blvd. and Jan Svankmajer's Otesanek to Final Destination 3 and .... errm, Hoodwinked), but I would really like to talk about Picnic at Hanging Rock.

It's such a strange, haunting movie. Like Heavenly Creatures meets The Virgin Suicides. (In fact, I'd wager that both Jackson and Coppola were heavily influenced by Picnic.) Nothing much actually happens (except for the inexplicable and unexplained disappearance of a bunch of schoolgirls and their teacher), but the atmosphere is so heavy that I could hardly tear my eyes away from the screen; so languid, so dreamlike, so erotic, and so disturbing.

I'm really looking forward to MirrorMask, now. When I saw the trailers, I wasn't impressed. It all looked very CGI'y, and the story didn't sound compelling. Now, however, it's been getting so many good reviews that I simply can't not see it. I should have had more faith in McKean and Gaiman.
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Old 02-19-2006, 08:33 PM   #857
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Doroposo, your new avatar makes me miss my old Nokia.

EDIT: It also makes me wanna resurrect my old thread in which I gripe about new phones having no preset video games.
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Old 02-19-2006, 09:59 PM   #858
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mares
Doroposo, your new avatar makes me miss my old Nokia.
Sometimes I miss mine, too. Now I have a cellphone that plays MP3s, takes pictures and short videos, can browse the internet, and so on, but it doesn't even have Snake. How can they make cellphones without built-in games? Sure, I can download games to it, but I shouldn't have to.
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Old 02-19-2006, 10:15 PM   #859
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i no!

*expression used with permission from SamnMax
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Last edited by Maquisard; 02-19-2006 at 10:23 PM.
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Old 02-19-2006, 10:40 PM   #860
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Ghost in the Shell: Innocence is an awesome film. The pacing was notably slower than the first one, but indeed suits the film a lot better. I liked the film's philosophising, even though some might find it pretentious. The visuals alone are enough to make it a must-see, but as a whole it's just amazing.
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