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Old 03-23-2004, 02:46 AM   #1
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Default 3d modelling

I wanna teach myself 3d modelling. Which program is easier to learn for a newbie, 3d studio max, or maya? Any tips on good material to use when learning them? Do they provide good tutorials themselves? Thanks
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Old 03-23-2004, 03:45 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mares
I wanna teach myself 3d modelling. Which program is easier to learn for a newbie, 3d studio max, or maya? Any tips on good material to use when learning them? Do they provide good tutorials themselves? Thanks

Both are equally as difficult

But I recommend Maya.

The reason is that there are quiet a few different ways of 3D modelling - but maya has them all.

Polygonal-subDs-box modelling - start with a box then subdivide it, extrude cubes, and cut off corners until you have a smooth head/body. This is a bit like scultping.

Nurbs/Patches - start by drawing a bunch of curves then connect them up in three dimensions and make surfaces out of them. This may be best place to start if you are a confident drawer.

Pen Deformation - Start with a ball for a head, and when you draw on it you create lumps or valleys on the ball. Build up the nose, cheekbones, push back the eye sockets etc.

Both packages support some type of Polygonal and Nurbs/Patches.
The reason I recommend Maya is that it is the only one with Pen deformation.
If polygonal, and patches get you no where, then you can use pen deformation (known as Artisan, in Maya) to get started. For newbies, its the easiest of the three techniques, and once you get the hang of it, it makes it easier to learn the other two.

If you want to do content for games, then you will eventually have to learn polygonal/subD modelling. If you are just rendering of frames of animation, or stills, then you can get away with nurbs/patches and pen deformation.

Download Maya Personal Learning Edition and use the book/pdf called "Learning Maya" - it has some great tutorials.

Goodluck!

Anthony.
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Old 03-23-2004, 04:56 AM   #3
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Max or Maya???

I think going for those programs as a newbie might be a bit overambitious to say the least... They have a very steep learning curve and are so stuffed with features you won't see the forest for the trees. Diving in the deep end like that if you're new to modeling is not a very good idea, in my opinion.

I would suggest you try Caligari trueSpace. It's a wonderful program and it's a lot easier to get into than the above two. It's animation tools aren't very good unfortunately (unless you buy plugins) but if you just want to create stills there isn't much you can't do with it. And even if you do feel you've outgrown the progam later, you can always switch to another package.

I've used Maya a little bit and I use Max a lot and I can tell you that if it wasn't for my experience with trueSpace I would've found it very hard to learn these programs.

Check out these links:
http://www.caligari.com/
http://forms.caligari.com/forms/ts3all_free.html

Try out the demo of version 6.6 and maybe give the full version of number 3 a look. I think you'll like it.
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Old 03-23-2004, 05:51 AM   #4
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Max 6 is a lot easier to learn than Maya 4. So I'd recommend Max.
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Old 03-23-2004, 06:10 AM   #5
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If you're only starting, you might want to try a free program first. Try Anim8or!
www.anim8or.com
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Old 03-23-2004, 06:18 AM   #6
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Also, what would be the best software to create 3d backgrounds? I am looking to learn something that would let me create backgrounds like EMI and Sam and Max 2. Simple yet appealing cartoony kinda feel. Could this be accomplished in 'world builder' programs like Bryce? or would I just have to create a scene in say Maya/3d max?
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Old 03-23-2004, 06:44 AM   #7
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How about Lightwave 3d?? Is it any good??
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Old 03-23-2004, 08:36 AM   #8
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Aw, heck, just make a little diarama and photograph the sucker, it can't be harder than that.
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Old 03-23-2004, 10:27 AM   #9
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Default Why not Carrara Studio???

Carrara Studio can do almost everything Maya can, and also save in formats like 3ds, etc.
And it is cheaper, and has a nicher support user base that is very helpful. For someone who is wanting to do indie work, a purchase of Carrara Studio (now 3.0) Is the place to be. Learning is not hard either. Just like anything else, takes time to do stuff!!!

I myself have a purchased copy of Carrara Studio 2.0 and plan on using it in my game developments. Anyway good luck in whatever path you choose!
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Old 03-23-2004, 11:49 AM   #10
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I'm not going to get into a "My software is bigger than yours" debate... but I'll just say that I highly recommended trueSpace for any stills work... and should you want to do animation with it, you absolutely must have the MotionStudio plugin (http://www.turbophp.com/MotionStudio/). With that plugin you can do very nice animation as well.

The big three; Max, Maya and XSI are extremely hard to learn and are also incredibly expensive. The only reason I use them is because we have educational licenses at university and I'm required to use them in class. If you want to learn 3D you're better off starting with something more accessible... trueSpace is just that and it still packs a serious punch.
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Old 03-24-2004, 06:40 AM   #11
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PovRay forever.
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Old 03-24-2004, 09:38 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by karel y2k4
How about Lightwave 3d?? Is it any good??
I've been working with Lightwave for years, so yeah. I think it rocks.

Especially when used for animation.

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Old 03-26-2004, 12:19 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deadworm222
Yes, POV-Ray is nice. Another choice is Blender.
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Old 03-26-2004, 01:23 PM   #14
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I don't really know much about 3D modelling, but the video tutorials at www.3dbuzz.com seem great. I've been learning the basics of 3DMax with their help.
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Old 03-26-2004, 01:36 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ragnar
Yes, POV-Ray is nice. Another choice is Blender.
But Blender, as i remember it anyway, was way to confusing tool, it is definetly not for beginners.

As for lightwave, i started on this tool and i'm sticking with it even today... I think it's a good tool because it's not too hard for beginners, there are tons of free tutorials for it, some great even on their homepage.

It's important that you don't get intimidated by modeling program, whichever you choose. try basic things and then see for yourself what works best for you.
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Old 03-26-2004, 01:58 PM   #16
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Yes, blender was rather confusing last time I tried it. I actually think that POV-Ray is the best thing to do 3D in.
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Old 03-26-2004, 04:12 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VoodooFX
But Blender, as i remember it anyway, was way to confusing tool, it is definetly not for beginners.

As for lightwave, i started on this tool and i'm sticking with it even today... I think it's a good tool because it's not too hard for beginners, there are tons of free tutorials for it, some great even on their homepage.

It's important that you don't get intimidated by modeling program, whichever you choose. try basic things and then see for yourself what works best for you.
Yay, another LW user!

By the way, I believe people generally find other modelers easier when it comes to static 3D modeling. Animation with camera's and such are it's strongest points. Did you know many Star Trek Voyager and DS9 scenes are rendered with it?

--Erwin
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Old 03-26-2004, 04:36 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ragnar
Yes, blender was rather confusing last time I tried it. I actually think that POV-Ray is the best thing to do 3D in.
Isn't that all scripting based? ...not really a very artistic way of working. Don't get me wrong, scripting has its uses and can kick ass in the hands of technically minded people, but if you want to learn how to model you should steer well clear of that kinda stuff.... not to mention it would be a nightmare to learn as a newbie.

Correct me if I'm wrong though... that's what I heard.
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Old 03-26-2004, 05:15 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erwin_Br
Yay, another LW user!

By the way, I believe people generally find other modelers easier when it comes to static 3D modeling. Animation with camera's and such are it's strongest points. Did you know many Star Trek Voyager and DS9 scenes are rendered with it?

--Erwin
Well i've said in one other thread that i use LW, although not as much as i would like to. Maybe you've missed my post there.

LW Modeler certainly has its flaws, god knows i cursed it million times over. But somehow i got used to it very quickly. I like the interface, i also like how much of a use layers can be. But as i've said in that thread, there are absolutely NO classes for 3D modelling in Slovenia, so everything i do is from tutorials, books, etc..

Yes, i know that LW is widely accepted in movie industry... its first major appearance was in Seaquest DSV i think, when effects were done on AMIGA computers. Since then it was used in all sort of shows... Star Trek as you've already mentioned, Babylon 5, Blade(i saw making of Blade on LW6 CD), it is even used by ID for monster modelling for Doom3
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Old 03-27-2004, 12:31 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ninja Dodo
Isn't that all scripting based? ...not really a very artistic way of working. Don't get me wrong, scripting has its uses and can kick ass in the hands of technically minded people, but if you want to learn how to model you should steer well clear of that kinda stuff.... not to mention it would be a nightmare to learn as a newbie.

Correct me if I'm wrong though... that's what I heard.
Check here.

I use a little tool called sPatch to create more complex Povray object - like the ashtray in the Curves Teaser site. I like script-baes programs. Their learning curve isn't as steep - strange keyboard combinations etc. aren't needed - you can just copy & paste sample code and see how it works. Tha's not even possible with visual modellers - though there's probably not much need for that either...
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