[Gledster]

Good morning all,

My RSS reader in my browser just 'pimped' this article out to me and I thought it might be of interest to some of you. A journalist over at Eurogamer ( John Walker) has written a Retrospective looking Dreamfall. This is interesting for many reasons, not least because it's a game that tries VERY hard at what it does, but doesn't always succeed, but also because, for the journalist in question who states:

The Longest Journey is my favourite game. It's not the best game ever made. It's not the best-written, although it's up there. It certainly isn't the best example of an adventure game. But it's the game that most touched me – a game that literally changed my life.

Hope this interests some of you. The article can be found at Eurogamer.

[DustCropper]

That's an interesting read, thanks for sharing the link.

Like the author, I really liked Dreamfall despite its shortcomings, and it's disappointing that a sequel was obviously intended but now increasingly unlikely.

In the article I was surprised to read that

Spoiler:

Zoe dies at the end. Is that what happened? I always thought that she was just in a deep coma.

[ADan]

I must say, I'm no fan of Mr. Walker's.

Too much of a subjective approach to the games he reviews using hyperbole too often and sometimes trying to get a point across by using phrasing that doesn't exactly adhere to the facts at hand. He also seems to be absorbed by his own personality to some extend.

I mean, look at this sentence:

"It changed how I think, an aspect of how my imagination works, and my philosophy. I'm not sure what higher praise could be offered."

I probably shouldn't cross a critic, but this is the way I see it. I'm sure, though, that as a person he's quite alright. It's just that I expect other things from a review than he usually provides.

But that's a general thing with critics (of all art forms): You need to choose and find out who you want to trust. Mr. Walker is just not the one for me.

[rayvio]

there's actually another article linked in that one which states that there is still hope for a third Longest Journey game. it looks like Secret World has taken a bit more time than expected but that once it's released work might resume on the sequel

[DustCropper]

Originally Posted by rayvio

there's actually another article linked in that one which states that there is still hope for a third Longest Journey game. it looks like Secret World has taken a bit more time than expected but that once it's released work might resume on the sequel

That's good to hear -- I hope they manage to pull it off!

[Christian IV]

I have total faith in Ragnar and Funcom, both are among the best in the industry and both can be trusted. They have promised in so many words to continue the story of TLJ and I believe they will deliver. It will be in installments i believe for Dreamfall got hit very very hard by the damn pirates out there. Curse them all.

But, I do believe they will keep their word and give us the continuation of the story. And as for Zoe.....well, I know what I believe about that too. But it is up to the player to think that over for themselves.

We have a number of promised sequels some years and years in the making that have come to us including:

a new Elder Scrolls title
a new Mafia
a updated Monkey Island
a new Deus Ex
a new Mass Effect
a new Biowar Knights of the Old Republic title (not exactly a sequel but in the family)

and I do believe we will see more of the wonderful worlds of Stark and Marcuria.

[orient]

Originally Posted by ADan

He also seems to be absorbed by his own personality to some extend.

I mean, look at this sentence:

"It changed how I think, an aspect of how my imagination works, and my philosophy. I'm not sure what higher praise could be offered."

It's sometimes useful to know a person's feelings on a series before reading their entire 700 word article. It's a good way to engage the reader and help them understand where you're coming from.

Personally I prefer reading articles from writers like John Walker, that are openly one man's point of view. The main function of an "objective" review is to serve as a buyer's guide and I have no interest in reading that sort of thing for entertainment.

Stuff like this, however, is actually interesting to read because it's more personal.

[Lee in Limbo]

Adding my thumbs up. I tend to find purely 'objective' reviews to be bland and unhelpful, and also misleading, as they often have an editorial slant that goes unchecked because of the slant of the publications they are published in. I don't mind critics, but I do mind critics who hide behind some so-called standard of impartiality which, when you realize you're talking about a story-heavy video game, simply can't exist.

Of COURSE they're biased. This isn't stock reports we're discussing. This is a form of art, and whether you see it as High Arte or low art, it is nevertheless art, and thus, subjective. Discussions couched in terms of compatibility, playability, interactivity and innovation are really just buzz words to disguise what everyone is really getting at: was it any fun? And if you can remember any of the numerous comments threads, here and at the TLJ forums, on the subject, you'll know that there were as many divergent answers as there were players.

[ADan]

Originally Posted by orient

It's sometimes useful to know a person's feelings on a series before reading their entire 700 word article. It's a good way to engage the reader and help them understand where you're coming from.

I do agree, and that's basically what I was trying to say with my last sentence. To each their own. But for me, when it comes to reviews, I don't want to have to know a person's life story before I can properly assess what they are trying to convey.

Originally Posted by orient

Personally I prefer reading articles from writers like John Walker, that are openly one man's point of view. The main function of an "objective" review is to serve as a buyer's guide and I have no interest in reading that sort of thing for entertainment.

Of course you'd have to like or even agree to "one man's point of view" to some extend to really enjoy the read.

Again, when it comes to reviews, I want a certain standard of objectivity, some comprehensible principles that the "verdict" is based upon. After all, a review is not an opinion piece. Not in my view anyway. Of course it contains personal opinion but the objective is, well, to 'objectify' and justify the verdict by using common sense or logic, if you will, based on a common canon of accuracy and whenever it comes to mere personal taste or preferences I'd like that to be made unmistakably clear.

Sorry, I don't see that in what I've read by John Walker so far.

Originally Posted by orient

Stuff like this, however, is actually interesting to read because it's more personal.

I don't see how it should not be possible to give a review a personal touch without doing away with a certain standard of objectivity and journalistic accuracy.

But I'll say it again: To each their own.

Cheers, Dan.

[noknowncure]

By crikey, I'll never cease to be astonished at how the disappointing, patchwork quilt of other people's ideas that is Dreamfall is dwelt upon as if its some remarkable piece of important and original art.

"This is a downbeat game, and goodness knows that's rare."

I can only hope he was being sarcastic when he wrote that.

And to imply that Dreamfall is in some way different from other games in that it takes cues from cinema?!

I am cross.

[rayvio]

so just because you don't like Dreamfall, nobody can?
personally I thought it was a great game despite the poorly implemented combat. not quite as great as TLJ but still a great game

[Christian IV]

Dreamfall is one of the great games along the path of evolutiion of adventure game genres...it has so much going for it and such a great story that it can be mis understood by some...and just not seen by others. If you realize that what is created is a 3D believable world ..with a remarkable group of characters who we get to venture along with and sometimes play as....and all wrapped in a deep and wide story line.... it is in short a miracle and a work of genius. In time it will gain what it may lack currently in understanding...as TLJ does on careful study. I think these first two titles of what will be a series are equal to Anachronox and Omichiron as true classics of unique type and great artistic quality and depth.

[smulan]

Originally Posted by noknowncure

patchwork quilt of other people's ideas that is Dreamfall

Who are these people and what ideas are theirs?

[Gabe]

Originally Posted by Christian IV

Dreamfall is one of the great games along the path of evolutiion of adventure game genres...it has so much going for it and such a great story that it can be mis understood by some...and just not seen by others. If you realize that what is created is a 3D believable world ..with a remarkable group of characters who we get to venture along with and sometimes play as....and all wrapped in a deep and wide story line.... it is in short a miracle and a work of genius. In time it will gain what it may lack currently in understanding...as TLJ does on careful study. I think these first two titles of what will be a series are equal to Anachronox and Omichiron as true classics of unique type and great artistic quality and depth.

Bah utter trite, Dreamfall nothing but downright rip-off from Neverending story and Existenz.

[noknowncure]

I think it's great that people love the game. People are fully entitled to enjoy what they like and I would hate for them to feel like they couldn't. Similarly, I'm allowed to be astonished by the amount of praise it gets.

Originally Posted by smulan

Who are these people and what ideas are theirs?

Off the top of my head - I haven't played the game for years after writing extensively about what I felt the game did well, but also what was wrong with the title, so I'm not keen to go back - the most obvious direct steals were The Bear from A.I., creatures from Peter Jackson's Lord of the Rings and huge elements of the Ring series. Basically what was in popular culture at the time the game was being made.

As Gabe points out, parallels can be drawn between the story and many other sources. This is fine, but personally I'm uncomfortable when it's heralded as some sort of hugely original masterpiece.

I don't deny Dreamfall had a worthy ambition, but unfortunately it failed. It was also a case of style over substance - they thought of lots of cool ideas and messages to put in the game, but without the skill to tie everything together coherently, counting on the audience's good will to fill in the gaping holes themselves.

Hopefully it will be seen as a fumbled step that was at least heading in the right direction.

[smulan]

A detail from a Spielberg movie and Jackson's filmadaption of Tolkien. Examples of Thörnquist ripoffs for Dreamfall? OK, if you think so, fine with me.

[noknowncure]

Originally Posted by smulan

A detail from a Spielberg movie and Jackson's filmadaption of Tolkien. Examples of Thörnquist ripoffs for Dreamfall? OK, if you think so, fine with me.

Smashing. I'm super stoked I've got your approval!

Don't forget the entire plot from Ring too! You seem to have done so.

[gray pierce]

Originally Posted by Gabe

Bah utter trite, Dreamfall nothing but downright rip-off from Neverending story and Existenz.

The never ending story was the first book I ever read, it's my favorite childrens book and I recall every scene but not once did it even remotely feel like the never ending story in Dreamfall so that's really more of an opinion than a fact.

Personally I think Dreamfall might very well be the best game made so far. Sure it has it's faults but overall playing it for me was simply a truly unique, truly amazing, truly beautiful experience and it made me feel things I've never felt with any game ever before or will most likely ever feel again unless they release a sequal.

[D.C.]

Those screenshots make me want to replay the game, I've got to say. I thought it was pretty damn good. I wouldn't mind if The Longest Journey 3 was more like Heavy Rain. I know that's bound to be a controversial thing to say, but the elements Dreamfall did best were very similar. (Although lacking a whole lot of polish.) I'd love to explore Stark and Arcadia with Heavy Rain production values too.

[ggreen737]

Originally Posted by Gabe

Bah utter trite, Dreamfall nothing but downright rip-off from Neverending story and Existenz.

...Which are rip-offs of old European fairytales, which are re-tellings of the lessons of the first authors of greek tragedies...etc. Nothing is original, it is only original in the manner of presentation. TLJ totally changed the way I perceived games as a medium of entertainment. Call it timing, call it circumstance but that is saying a lot. To go back and play TLJ as a jaded gamer years later I still can re-discover that sense of wonder, THAT'S saying a lot.