[Idrisguitar]

Basically a while ago I wanted to get into this genre of games. I missed out on its popularity when I was younger, and was really excited about really digging into adventure games. My favourite things about these games are the more focused story, the art, and mainly my most enjoyable type of gameplay mechanic (puzzle based). So I was kind of disappointed that my first attempts with the genre really did not go well. (there may be a few old topics on this forum I'm not sure)

My first game was Broken Sword, and I loved the art, the mood, the story, and the early puzzles were fun and rewarding. However further into it I found there were leaps in logic my brain wasn’t able to get to and it left me frustrated.

Another thing I found annoying was for example when I was stuck, and the game didn’t give me any indication or clue of where to look to move on. So trawling through multiple areas of the game map clicking everything and talking to everyone was the only way to proceed. And this was no fun at all. A similar problem occurred with SOMI, and is what made me give up on that one too.

I did complete Broken Sword with help from a guide (which really is something I won’t do again as it ruined the fun.) I didn’t get to the end of SOMI. A more serious storyline is probably needed to keep me interested. Also I did try Syberia, but it didn’t suck me in (seemed slow, and again had a few puzzles where literally the answer could have been in 1 of 20 possible areas. (NO FUN)

Now I’m sure a lot of these troubles has to do with me not being patient enough, and not having the right mindset and procedure to approach these games properly. The fact is, finally now, I feel I'm ready to give it another shot and I am really hoping you guys can maybe help me out with some advice.

I'm thinking I might buy the first Gabriel Knight from GOG. Now I know this is meant to be one of the hardest, but I think with some advice from you guys on my approach, and the fact that Gabriel Knight will probably (almost definitely) have a better more engaging story than both Broken Sword and SOMI, it might just keep me with it through the tough times.

Anyway, I'm sorry for the long post. I'm hoping this time I can really get into it and enjoy a few adventure games, because on paper, this should be my perfect genre.

~
Idris

EDIT: I want to just clarify, that I'm not looking for recommendations. I have a fairly complete list compiled from the first time I tried the genre. In this topic I'm mostly looking for advice on how to fare better with these games. Basically change my thought proccess so I have more patience and enjoy these games more.

I apologise if I did not communicate this properly in this original message.

[Manly One]

Playing Gabriel Knight is most definitely one of the best choices to make. The story (which is a mix of deadly serious and gruesome incidents, adult themes, romance and a light dash of humor) is good enough by itself to completely dull any shortcomings it may have. Most of the puzzles are very logical in an "everyman" sort of way. Hard, but not too difficult for it to be frustrating.

There was a recent community play through of the GK series in these forums. I suggest to browse and read the insightful anecdotes, provided by the host, AndreaDraco, periodically during your own run through the games.

[diego]

Go to the store and buy Full Throttle. If you own a motorcycle, ride it to the store. Go back home (if you're lazy, download will do).

Don't play just yet. Wait until the evening, and in the meantime put some mean rock playlist on, something like Detroit Rock City, Whole Lotta Rosie... Postpone all your night plans and go make some pizza. Don't try to spin it. Finally, when you're set, turn off the lights in your room and loosely shut the windows so there is just enough space for some gentle post-summer breeze to sneak in. Get a wine if you like it. Finally, install the game, and start it. Take a slice of pizza while the intro is starting.

Whenever i smell asphalt, i think of Maureen...

[Ascovel]

Originally Posted by diego

Take a slice of pizza while the intro is starting.

Whenever i smell asphalt, i think of Maureen...

Pizza smelling of asphalt... Eeeew!

[diego]

To tell you the truth, my last homemade pizza had a crust that was exactly like - asphalt! I'm getting the hang of it, though...

[Sughly]

Really great to see that attitude! So tired of people calling the genre dead, it's nice to see when people give it a chance instead.

Actually I was just thinking of Full Throttle before diego suggested it. I always tend to suggest this to people getting into the genre because it's so accessible, has great writing, great animation, not too difficult puzzle design (but good puzzle design nonetheless).

Also, if your favourite gameplay mechanic is puzzle then if you can get your hands on a DS you could always give Professor Layton games a go. The stories are never really that in depth, but have plenty of charm as do the characters, and is more or less a great forum for puzzles. As a fan of Japanese animation the cutscenes are particularly worth the invested time.

I can understand the hangups witrh Broken sword - it becomes quite complex and can take some trial and error to find your way through a lot of the story and puzzles. Definately one to come back to when you're more accustomed to getting stuck in adventures though

You should report back after you play through some other titles to give your thoughts. Always interested to hear from people that are new to the genre, particularly to see what does and doesn't work for them...

[Fien]

Idris, have you seen this thread?

http://forums.adventuregamers.com/fo...ad.php?t=26054

Lots of good suggestions, just for people like you.

[Idrisguitar]

Haha, that was the other topic I mentioned in my first post.

I decided to make a new thread becuase this time, I'm not simply asking for game recommendations. I have lists compiled from my first time researching the genre. I know all the classics and modern classics etc. Thats not my problem. (although i am VERY grateful for the above posters' suggestions)

This new thread is really about overcoming my impatience and my troubles I had when i first tried the genre back then. (with games like SOMI and broken sword.)

Is there a method, a thought proccess that I'm missing? and will games like Gabriel Knight help, with their more engaging storylines to keep me going and hopefully build up appreciation for the genre.

So I apologise if I didn't comminucate this well in the OP and if this seems a bit wasteful, but honestly its a different request I have here, and I hope people see that, and dont simply think I'm a random forum spammer.

Again I would truly appreciate some insight into this, so I have a better chance of getting through and enjoying these games. And the OP has been edit to clear up any misunderstanding. Once again I apologise,

[cbman]

For your basic, inventory-type adventure game follow this procedure everytime you are at a loss for further progression:

Go back and speak to every character that you have access too. Most of these games rely on event triggers to allow the gameplay to advance. You are not allowed to think too far ahead. So make sure that you have exhausted all conversations with each character.

Try every item in your inventory with every click spot you can find no matter how illogical.

If nothing in your inventory helps you you should try combining all of your items with each other, even if it makes no apparent sense. The puzzles often don't Missing the opportunity to combine inventory items is one of the most common sticking points.

If none of the above works then it is very likely you are missing a click spot. These are sometimes very obscure and the most experienced players can easily miss them. This is part and parcel of these games unfortunately and it is the time you require patience.

If I have exhausted all of the above options (and there is no obvious puzzle for me to solve (ie a set of levers, some sliding tiles etc)) then I normally give all of the accesible screens one further once-over for clickspots. If I still can't anything I consult http://www.uhs-hints.com/ - a vital website for all adventure gamers. It is broken down in such a way that you cna get the hint you need whilst minimizing the risk of spoilers (and allowign you some satisfaction in not having it completely spelled out for you) Pixel hunting simply isn't fun but most developers will use it to pad gameplay out in areas of the game that they have come up with insufficient legitimate challenge for.

The vast majority of modern adventure games will not allow you to get stuck in 'dead ends'. There will always be some means of progression, so don't be afraid to try anything; you cannot make a game-killing mistake. If what you are trying sounds potentially dangerous however make sure you have your game saved before you do it.

[Idrisguitar]

Originally Posted by cbman

For your basic, inventory-type adventure game follow this procedure everytime you are at a loss for further progression:

Go back and speak to every character that you have access too. Most of these games rely on event triggers to allow the gameplay to advance. You are not allowed to think too far ahead. So make sure that you have exhausted all conversations with each character.

Try every item in your inventory with every click spot you can find no matter how illogical.

If nothing in your inventory helps you you should try combining all of your items with each other, even if it makes no apparent sense. The puzzles often don't Missing the opportunity to combine inventory items is one of the most common sticking points.

If none of the above works then it is very likely you are missing a click spot. These are sometimes very obscure and the most experienced players can easily miss them. This is part and parcel of these games unfortunately and it is the time you require patience.

If I have exhausted all of the above options (and there is no obvious puzzle for me to solve (ie a set of levers, some sliding tiles etc)) then I normally give all of the accesible screens one further once-over for clickspots. If I still can't anything I consult http://www.uhs-hints.com/ - a vital website for all adventure gamers. It is broken down in such a way that you cna get the hint you need whilst minimizing the risk of spoilers (and allowign you some satisfaction in not having it completely spelled out for you) Pixel hunting simply isn't fun but most developers will use it to pad gameplay out in areas of the game that they have come up with insufficient legitimate challenge for.

The vast majority of modern adventure games will not allow you to get stuck in 'dead ends'. There will always be some means of progression, so don't be afraid to try anything; you cannot make a game-killing mistake. If what you are trying sounds potentially dangerous however make sure you have your game saved before you do it.

thanks a lot, that should go a long way in helping me.

pixel hunting is not fun. but as i mentioned earlier, if a game has me very involved in its narrative and i truly care about whaat will happen next i will happily pixel hunt to progress. unfortunately both broken sword and SOMI didn't quite get there.

if anyone has anythign they can add that might help more (although cbman's method seems pretty conclusive) then i would again be very gratefu.

[Fien]

Of course you’re not “spamming” the forums. I didn’t mean to imply that you were. (I participated in that thread, and a couple of months later I even wondered aloud where you had disappeared to.) But people gave you a lot of suggestions in the old thread, and some of your problems with SoMI and BS1 were already discussed back then. I’ll do my best to give you advice, based on what I already know of you. Correct me if I’m wrong:

An immersive story and great atmosphere are very important to you. Puzzles are your stumbling block. You enjoyed Machinarium and Fahrenheid/Indigo. Challenging puzzles are okay (Machinarium had quite a few), as long as the game gives you hints on what to do next. You’d rather not consult a walkthrough. Too much trial-and-error and wandering around 20 screens looking for something to do/find kills the fun. No pixelhunting. Long conversations don’t appeal to you.

I don’t share your general dislike of walkthroughs, but learning to be more “patient” is not the answer. Why force yourself to change? Games are supposed to be enjoyed. Some people love to spend days figuring out puzzles and other people don’t, there’s no right or wrong about it. On the other hand, no game is perfect. There will always be one or two things you don’t like.

Yes, by all means, play Gabriel Knight 2. The easiest of the series. Wonderful story.

Return to Mysterious Island has inventory puzzles you can solve in all sorts of different ways. Fun. Hard to get stuck.

The Longest Journey has only a few whacky puzzles and unfortunately too many long conversations, but the story is very good. Dreamfall is in both regards better, IMO, and the story shines. .

BS1 and SoMI are the same type of adventure game and you had problems with both. Cbman gave you great strategy tips. Another option is getting away from classic inventory-based puzzlesolving. Have you played any other adventures since, besides Syberia? Played any demos?
I recommended The Last Express, not just because it’s a favorite of mine, but it meets your criteria. Immersive, great music, hardly any real puzzles. Not an easy game though, you have to understand what’s going on or you’ll make the wrong move. Some people find the real-time aspect frustrating, so play the demo first.

Shadow of Memories isn’t like any other game I can think of.

EDIT: I realize you're not really looking for more recommendations, but I honestly feel that you can only discover what *you* like by trying different adventures.

[Idrisguitar]

thanks a lot for the suggestions and recommendations.

is there a re-released version of last express that works well with win 7? (like gog or dotemu) that game really does have me interested.

also im not looking to change the way i play 100% but i do believe if i played and truly was patient with a game, and enjoyed it and felt great achievment when i finished it, that could be the start of somethign massive. it would make me look back on games i didn;t enjoy before and try them aagain with more confidence patient and probably more reward.

so a game like gabriel knight, lauded for its story might just be good enough to keep me involved even through the hard bits, and if i complete ONE adventure game without a walkthrough i know the rewarding feeling will be enough to vault me onto more and more games in the genre.

[Jannik]

Originally Posted by Idrisguitar

...and not having the right mindset and procedure to approach these games properly.

Playing traditional adventure games is definately about procedure (cbman gave som good tips here) and applying The Almighty Adventure Game Mindset(tm etc.) - and that you probably only get by experience. So starting out by playing a couple of fairly easy adventure games, like Dreamfall, might be the best approach.

[Fien]

Originally Posted by Idrisguitar

is there a re-released version of last express that works well with win 7? (like gog or dotemu) that game really does have me interested.

The original Last Express runs fine with windows 7 (64) if you follow the steps posted at another site:
1. create a new folder
2. insert CD 1
3. copy all files in DATA to the new folder
4. copy expressw.exe, MFC42.DLL, MSVCRT.DLL from the WINDOWS folder to the new folder (“flat” copy, all files must be in the same directory)
5. run expressw.exe

You can also play it online for a couple of bucks (forgot the site, not DRM-free) if you're in the US.

so a game like gabriel knight, lauded for its story might just be good enough to keep me involved even through the hard bits, and if i complete ONE adventure game without a walkthrough i know the rewarding feeling will be enough to vault me onto more and more games in the genre.

GK1 is very hard in places. I replayed it last year in the AG community playthrough and I was surprised how little I remembered of some of the more obscure puzzles. GK2 is really rather easy, with the exception of one whacky puzzle, which most people get by trial and error. Not counting the many shameless players who go for the walkthrough.

[Idrisguitar]

thanks for the info, might try last express first then

if i can fnid it, if not ill wait till i move to canada in two weeks and try that online version. (if its avil in CA)

[sierramindy]

Hi Idrisquitar,
Have you tried playing Myst? This is a very mechanical-type, puzzle game with great graphics and a storyline. Very different from either Broken Sword or Secret of Monkey Island. I personally did not like Myst, because of the puzzles, which are not my thing, but I greatly enjoyed the other 2 games which you didn't care for, so maybe you will like the game I didn't. Just trying to help you find the right game for you.

[ozzie]

Well, Tex Murphy: The Pandora Directive is a great game that has two difficulty settings and offers a hint system on the easier one.
You can find it on GOG.

[Idrisguitar]

Originally Posted by sierramindy

Hi Idrisquitar,
Have you tried playing Myst? This is a very mechanical-type, puzzle game with great graphics and a storyline. Very different from either Broken Sword or Secret of Monkey Island. I personally did not like Myst, because of the puzzles, which are not my thing, but I greatly enjoyed the other 2 games which you didn't care for, so maybe you will like the game I didn't. Just trying to help you find the right game for you.

Thanks.

I want to make clear, I enjoyed Broken Sword, but got frustrated with the difficulty, due to my inexperience with the genre, more-so than simply not clicking with the game. I also started using a guide when I got to stressed, and this diminished the reward for the game and overall it all just fell a bit flat. Again though, none of that is the games fault. I will probably try it again down the line for sure.

And I think Monkey Island was a bit too leftfield logically for me as a beginner, who evidently could hardly cope with fairly straight forward puzzles.



I am currently playing Drawn: Painted Tower and so far I'm really enjoying it. It's simple, but it's fun and its allowing me to enjoy the genre without too much danger of getting stuck and frustrated. So while I know its easy, (and I know fien is not a fan) it's simplicity and fun factor is a great window into the genre for me.

Loom and Full Throttle will come next, hopefully having a slow upward curve of difficulty will really allow me to enjoy all the games a lot more.

Thanks soooooooo much guys (especially fien, who has been an awesome help now, and last year), im finally enjoying this genre again, and hope this time the right approach will allow that enjoyment to stay through the harder games too.

[rtrooney]

Bit of warning...If you want to get back into the genre at ground zero, e.g., games such as Shivers or Myst that were designed to play on early Windows machines you may be out of luck. Unless you install scumvee/dosbox utilities that will allow you to play older games on current systems.

I applaud your desire to catch up! There is much to play in the adventure game "archive."

[Brimstone]

Actually, if you really want to get a good start on adventures I'd suggest something simpler at first like Discworld 1 & 2. Granted it's a comedy but the main character will talk to the player from time to time during conversations that gives hints that won't spoil the game. The story line is a bit weird and as the main character often states, requires some lateral thinking. Really good starter game really.