[smulan]

Good luck with the game, Martin.

TMOS was a very good game, funny to play and grown up.

[nomadsoul]

So... Bioshock has a story?

Martin


Seriously though, I tried to dowload the Bioshock demo a couple of days ago, to the above-mentioned notebook of mine, and guess what? Bioshock does NOT run on this machine.

Not just story lol, Bioshock is infact finest example of interactive fiction according to most of the reviewers one example of such praise
http://www.1up.com/do/reviewPage?cId...17&sec=REVIEWS

Some sites even say that the game narrative and how it unfolds, serves as example for even developers themselves, which according to me is true.
The 'execution' of story was indeed creative, but the 'whole' story is not original and blatantly ripped from some other games.

I would suggest 360 to play since PC version had other compatibility issues let alone meeting min requirements, which developers are fixing and some of them are fixed.

So martin , are you doing the script/story of Overclocked, you didn't answer that?

[samIamsad]

Originally Posted by nomadsoul

Some sites even say that the game narrative and how it unfolds, serves as example for even developers themselves, which according to me is true.

I'm a big fan of the Origin/Looking Glass games of old, and Bioshock is apparently following that philosophy. Which means games that aren't telling stories, but simulating believable interactive worlds (LG employed a physics guy back in the days of 1992's Underworld already..) which *contain* stories. Meaning that I can dig as deep as a player into everything as I want to at any time. Anyway, back on topic:

Originally Posted by Martin Gantefoehr

As an unofficial remark, I have a notebook with a Pentium 1.5 G Mobility chip that runs the game just fine.

That should ease all of our fears.

Originally Posted by Steve Ince

What about my Commodore 64?

Well, most of them. I wouldn't worry much about even that, since all great current-gen™ games will end up being "ported" to a classic vintage machine of your choice instantly.

[Steve Ince]

Originally Posted by Martin Gantefoehr

Seriously though, I tried to dowload the Bioshock demo a couple of days ago, to the above-mentioned notebook of mine, and guess what? Bioshock does NOT run on this machine.

This is the best reason to put out a demo - so that the unsure can test their systems. It was how I found that BS4 wouldn't run on my computer. Is there a plan to release demos of Overclocked?

[Steve Ince]

Originally Posted by samIamsad

I'm a big fan of the Origin/Looking Glass games of old, and Bioshock is apparently following that philosophy. Which means games that aren't telling stories, but simulating believable interactive worlds (LG employed a physics guy back in the days of 1992's Underworld already..) which *contain* stories. Meaning that I can dig as deep as a player into everything as I want to at any time.

Your words are very interesting and remind me of something I've been thinking about for some time. While I like the idea of rich and rewarding game worlds, I do wonder if sometimes this is being confused with story-telling. Of course, much of it depends on how it's presented, but uncovering world details can often feel more like back-story than story. Clearly I'm going to have to move Bioshock nearer to the top of my list of games to play to see what they're doing.

The biggest problem I see with game story-telling, in the main, is that it's in danger of getting stuck in the type of story we see in Bioshock, Half-Life, Resident Evil, etc. They may be very good games and even good stories, but we need greater breadth as well as depth. One of the reasons I'm looking forward to Overclocked is that it's a game with a story subject/theme that helps broaden game story-telling.

[Martin Gantefoehr]

Originally Posted by nomadsoul

So martin , are you doing the script/story of Overclocked, you didn't answer that?

Oh, sorry, I overlooked that one. Yes, I wrote the story, dialogue and cut scene screenplays. (I also scripted a good chunk of the game, which was a real, uh, challenge, to say the least )

Originally Posted by Steve

One of the reasons I'm looking forward to Overclocked is that it's a game with a story subject/theme that helps broaden game story-telling.

I had two goals with Overclocked: Firstly, present a different approach to how narrative can be structured, constructed, and accessed in a game. And secondly, move away from outer journeys as a main narrative device, and instead get closer to the feelings and ambivalences of the main protagonist. To which degree I've succeeded (if at all), remains to be seen. I guess I'll read about that here.

[Steve Ince]

Originally Posted by Martin Gantefoehr

Oh, sorry, I overlooked that one. Yes, I wrote the story, dialogue and cut scene screenplays. (I also scripted a good chunk of the game, which was a real, uh, challenge, to say the least )

I enjoy the scripting. To me it's at the heart of game design and development. Of course, I don't always get to do the scripting myself, but I'm always thinking of it when I'm designing and writing interactive scenes. I like to think I structure it in a way that makes things simpler for the scripter.

I had two goals with Overclocked: Firstly, present a different approach to how narrative can be structured, constructed, and accessed in a game. And secondly, move away from outer journeys as a main narrative device, and instead get closer to the feelings and ambivalences of the main protagonist. To which degree I've succeeded (if at all), remains to be seen. I guess I'll read about that here.

That's part of the attraction, too - seeing how you've approached it and how close you're getting to your aims.

[samIamsad]

Originally Posted by Steve Ince

The biggest problem I see with game story-telling, in the main, is that it's in danger of getting stuck in the type of story we see in Bioshock..

I think there's nothing to fear. What I'm seeing is a medium developing its own narrative vocabulary, so while games like Overclocked, Fahrenheit, and many many more might stick very close to traditional narratives as found in movies or books*, there's also other people thinking about storytelling in games differently. I think that's awesome.

For some like Warren Spector or the other old lads from Looking Glass the theory goes that everything scripted that happens in your game is pre-determined by you, while gaming allows for an additional dimension unknown to static mediums: Interactivity. That's nothing new, and no amount of entirely pre-scripted paths can hide the fact that the autorship still entirely belongs to the game's designer and the designer's only. Arguably one thing that is perceived to make a story a story, but rules need to be challenged once in a while, no? So, where's the PLAYER in that? Ah well, I think this is well worth a read, even though it goes pretty much against everything adventure gaming™ (heh) is standing for.

It's just a point of view, and I really don't think philosophies like that are something to be afraid of. I'm really curious what Spector and his studio who recently teamed up with Disney(!) can come up with. Gaming has come pretty far already, a villain like System Shock's Shodan could have never been conveyed like that in any static medium at all. You're playing her game(s), literally, and that's a big part of what makes her such a bitch.




* truth be told, from my point of view, that's what pretty much each and every game containing a narrative of kinds is doing. I mean, when was the last time a press release DIDN'T drop the term "cinematic"?

That's part of the attraction, too - seeing how you've approached it and how close you're getting to your aims.

Definitely, going that deep into a character's psyche is almost unheard of in the world of gaming. Btw, with themes like that, did House Of Tales consult any experts in the field of human psychology? Did it *need* to?

[Martin Gantefoehr]

Originally Posted by samIamsad

Btw, with themes like that, did House Of Tales consult any experts in the field of human psychology? Did it *need* to?

Um, no. In the early Nineties, I worked in a Mental Health Ward (for two and a half years). Parts of what I learned and experienced there, went into this game. Of course, I adapted, abstracted, simplified, translated and changed many things -- to shape them into what I hope is an interesting playing experience.

So, you won't be prepared to pass any medical exams after having played the game -- if you feel for some of the characters, then my job is done.

[nomadsoul]

This will more shed light on nextgen of storytelling(Kenlevine thoughts but read only if you want to be spoiled).
http://www.shacknews.com/featuredarticle.x?id=539

My problem with games like Bioshock is
Originality- Game takes to many ideas from random games and put it into one, like throwing them at random, some are very technical and some are rather dumb. Levine excuse is 'suspend your disbelief'.
The genetic mutations is too cliched now , and Bioshock is full of magics with cheap scientific excuse. This is problem of thinking games story later and designing game first.
Read the interview how the story changed in later stages, it first involved lesbians deprogramming.
In adventure games generally story is designed first and puzzles later.

Moment of silence is cohesive, everything goes hand in hand and what took me by surprise was how believable characters were ,thier reactions and situations were close to reality, i didn't feel to suspend my disbelief story wise much.
Its future is well conceived, i am biased towards TMOS maybe because my love for Cyberpunk.
But futuristic/cyberpunk themes are tricky too, it has t be intelligent and believable to stand out from rest of the games like DeusEx,Systemshock2 or Bladerunner. It had some similarities with above mentioned titles but human relations and other aspects are well explored, which i found rather original.

Psycho thrillers like Overclocked is tough ground to tread too, gamer like me are accustomed to games like Silenthill and Condemned(highly underrated and overlooked), also another gem The suffering.
I am loking forward too the game and will see how well it will stand on its own against those games. I hope it won't be another Fightclub,memento,Identity ripoff. Leave these movies they are being copied to limit now, i dont want MPDs anymore.

Overclocked multiple characters and how the story will unfold with them, will be hallmark of the game, my speculation.

And my personal thoughts on something
Mamrtin choice to stick to 2/2.5d was very smart.
If you can't execute JUSTICE to game in 3d , don't do it , even if you have fears of BROAD market appeal.
I am poitning to Brokensword series here, which got bad and bad with every iteration.
I got into adventure gaming for Broken sword and look where it is now.
If one has budget/resources like Davidcage/quanitcdream , which can actually do justice to thier game then its ok to do in 3d.

I believe that even now games like meoment of silence don't look bad even in 2d, a pure gem , timeless evergreen game. If renders are very well done they dont look rusty with time, since its like canvas painting, which never gets old with time.
The 3dphobia should end.

[Martin Gantefoehr]

Originally Posted by me, aeons ago

Right. I'll try to clear this up and will be back with updates as soon as I've got them.

You guys didn't expect me to get back to this anymore, did you? Ha. Weeks ago, I sent off an email regarding the specs, causing the wheels of an incredibly complex transcontinental machinery to begin turning.

Today, the machine has returned a result. ( ) Lighthouse have changed Overclocked's specs on their site.

[Steve Ince]

The Lighthouse keeper returned.

I hope the German version of the game is doing well, Martin.

[Tiocfaidh]

Well, two days ago I got it from Amazon

I´m playing the second chapter right now.
Main character is very interesting, coping with problems (at least) I can relate to.

Graphics are nice (especially backgrounds and weather effects) sound is perfect, (German) voice acting is top notch as well.

Only (minor) gripe: The exit arrows are pitch black, they should be white/silver) as all the other interaction icons but for some reason they aren´t on my system.

Sorry, gotta go into cell #5

[The sleuth]

One word, YES! I think in total there are three games I'm eagerly waiting to be released, Heavy Rain, Overclocked and Artemedia Belief and Betrayal. Im sure I'm going to wait a fair bit more for all three, maybe the latter is already released although amazon points at Feb 2008.

Absolutely loved moment of silence and indigo p. Damn good shows. MOS had so much detail in the plot, and it wasnt superficial either totally relevant and integrated with the story and atmosphere of the game. Anyway, enough arse-kissing why do uk releases have to take so long? More devs based in the UK please!

[Fien]

I finished Overclocked (in German) a couple of days ago, and we have a winner here! The dark, gripping story rules and everything else is subservient to it. Great music and atmosphere, the use of splitscreens, the way the story unfolds, it's all very "cinematic", as someone called it in this thread.

I love the unique way the story is told by five people, from the most recent events going back in time. Lots of dialogue, but always related to what is actually happening in the here and now. That includes reliving past memories, as opposed to merely talking about them. The sessions with the patients felt like a series of "mini-cliffhangers" which kept me glued to the computer. More, more!

I had two goals with Overclocked: Firstly, present a different approach to how narrative can be structured, constructed, and accessed in a game. And secondly, move away from outer journeys as a main narrative device, and instead get closer to the feelings and ambivalences of the main protagonist. To which degree I've succeeded (if at all), remains to be seen. I guess I'll read about that here.

I have some minor criticisms and people who are looking for hard puzzles will be disappointed. But as far as I'm concerned, you have succeeded!

[Steve Ince]

Way to go, Martin and crew!

It's really encouraging that we're reading such positive feedback. When you combime this with the love that Culpa Innata is also getting, along with the games on the horizon, then 07/08 is going to be the best period for adventures for a long while.

[TangentBlack]

Originally Posted by Steve Ince

While I like the idea of rich and rewarding game worlds, I do wonder if sometimes this is being confused with story-telling. Of course, much of it depends on how it's presented, but uncovering world details can often feel more like back-story than story.

This is very profound. There is a very distinct difference between allowing the player to be immersed in a world that is driven by a story and immersing a player in a world where the story is written by the player.

I hear all too much that a game is much too linear and needs an open endedness that games like Gothic and Oblivion have to offer. Do they really? I have even heard (on this website in fact) the word linear used strictly by individuals when they want to criticize a game. Since when has a classic storytelling structure need to have a democratic, freebased world that requires complete and utter user choice? It is when this change has been made that it ceases to be a narrative with a subjective theme. Gothic and Oblivion still do have the telltale signs of an overarching theme/story (albeit a weak one) and Bioshock definitly does and is much more linear in design then it pretends to be, but if we push developers to the extremes of these games, all we will have is a world to walk around in, parellel or otherwise to our own, where we create and react, rather than learning and reacting to what themes the writers concoct.

Being fans of adventure games, all of us should appreciate a strong narrative. Narratives are hierarchical in their design: one tells the story, another listens. Derivitives of this may be appropriate at times, of course, such as an interactive story where listeners may chime in at times, but anything more than that becomes something much different. Remember that this different, open ended, spawn of the classic story is not bad or should not be looked at in a derogatory manner. It can simulate incredible settings in wonderful places, it can introduces characters from faraway lands just as a narrative can do, but it is not a narrative.

The importance of this is a response to a complaint as of late that games are not innovative enough (i.e. open to the player as the misguided minority would have it). The interesting thing is, we have not even crossed the line between a narrative and a simulation in the way I am describing. So why do I bring this up? Because I think that when people criticize Oblivion or Gothic or Bioshock or Grand Theft Auto.....actually scratch Grand Theft Auto....but the others, when those are criticized for not being open ended enough, it then appears that these are the people that want something like everyone's favorite Runescape, Guild Wars, WOW, or Maple Story. A simulation with a story tacked on to it or in some of those game's cases, no story tacked on to it. Oblivion is not Wow and Gothic is not Guild Wars, they come from two different backgrounds and one doesn't need to be more like the other.

Finally, be weary of games that claim to be both the most open ended game and to have a story driven game, because I have yet to see a successful one yet. More importantly, be appreciative of our strong narrative roots in adventure games. While other genres struggle with being both a narrative and an open ended simulation, adventure gamers know what they will recieve and if they don't like it, they can find a different genre. We as adventurers will recieve a strong story, a colorful cast, an entertaining and captivating environment, and most importantly, we will benefit from a structured story without giving in to what some gamers call innovation and I call fraudulent simulation.

[Steve Ince]

Excellent thoughts, TangentBlack.

Originally Posted by TangentBlack

Finally, be weary of games that claim to be both the most open ended game and to have a story driven game, because I have yet to see a successful one yet.

Stories have been around in fundamentally the same structure for thousands of years. The more I read about story, character, plot, drama, etc. the more I'm convinced that open ended means that you don't have a story because a story needs a conclusion. We need that closure to feel that a story has been told.

That's not to say that open ended games cannot have value and that it could be a rewarding experience for the people who favour something along those lines, but there may come a point where we have to say that story and open-ended do not mix and to try and do so will do a disservice to both, perhaps.

[Merricat]

Agreed. Whether oral or written, one of the central aims of the storyteller is to gradually unfold a plot (what happens) to reveal the theme (what the story is about) in such a way that the arc and resolution of the conflict(s) seems inevitable. Open-ended narratives are for people who want to write their own stories, which is great, but a different animal altogether.

[Merricat]

Addendum:
Holy cats, I just went to the website for this game, and I am so impressed--it looks fascinating. Can't wait for the English version.