[Lee in Limbo]

Well, on the beefcake front, I'd just like to say that fashion magazines do have a certain percentage of male models posing scantily clad in alluring poses and such (I was going to mention expressions, but I find most fashion models devoid of expression). That said, it takes some careful skill to portray a male model in an alluring manner without tripping into camp, something the designers of Mata Hari's proposed packaging don't seem to possess, having opted instead for the sledgehammer.

There was a way to use a sexy model on this cover without being offensive. The photographer and/or art director were either inept or crass, and either way, they've clearly failed to realize how many women play AGs. They should try a less frontal pose, and incorporate some more fabric, like a veil, to occlude some of the flesh and create a bit of mystery. You could do far more with this model if you put a more traditional belly dancing outfit on her and had her looking over her shoulder with a winsome smile than you can with her showing us her almost-bare breasts, long lean legs and oh-so-flat tummy.

No subtlety or imagination. And meanwhile, I'm clinging to my last client like a life raft. Something's not right, there.

Mata Hari did some 'French Postcard' pictures in her time, but I hardly think we're going to be seeing any of that in the game. I've seen one or two images of the Mata Hari model in game wearing lingerie, but have seen nothing to indicate that there would be excessive cheesecake. If I thought there was going to be excessive cheesecake, I'd ignore the game completely.

I'm a pretty liberal guy who has no problems with sexuality in games, but I would find it highly inappropriate to that period. Nudity and scandal were not unheard of, and Mata Hari was not some blushing violet. However, I've read little to give me the impression that she was trashy and obvious, and I would find any game or story trying to present her as such to be poorly realized.

I've said it elsewhere, and will repeat the statement here: I think a message needs to be sent to the developers to let them know that some of us find this kind of marketting unappealing and offensive. I don't want to turn this into some lame petition thread, but perhaps some thought should be put into how to word an email (or campaign) to contact the developers and let them know there are some serious concerns about their marketting strategy.

[AndreaDraco83]

Perfectly said, Lee.

[eriq]

I am sitting on the fence here. (And it hurts.) I can definitely see both sides of the story. I, personally, do not find the cover offensive. However, it's because I KNOW what the game is about. I would probably buy it if Whoopi Goldberg were on the cover dressed as Mata Hari. It's the developers that are sealing the deal for me.

However, I will repeat that I think the cover is gorgeous. Very well painted, sexy, and exciting. I especiallly love the background details and how the scene "fades" from an ornate ceiling decoration to the sky on the right side with the exploding airship. It's really warm and alluring. But what do I know? I have pretty extreme tastes.

As I said earlier, this would not have been what I would have painted for the box cover. I would have done an "Indiana Jones" style collage painting with different scenes - ONE of which would feature a scantily clad Mata Hari doing her thing.. perhaps as the centerpiece of the illustration. This style is perfectly fit to a multifaceted character like Miss Hari. It could be quite a painting! The "veil" imagery Lee conceptualized has my mind reeling...

Wouldn't that be delicious? I think so. maybe I'll start drawing.

[AndreaDraco83]

Originally Posted by eriq

I especiallly love the background details and how the scene "fades" from an ornate ceiling decoration to the sky on the right side with the exploding airship. It's really warm and alluring. But what do I know? I have pretty extreme tastes.

You're right: the ceiling is very well done. Aside from Jenna Hari, the other characters aren't particularly polished, in my opinion, as is the red curtain. But the exploding... airship is indeed pretty good

[Squinky]

Originally Posted by Lee in Limbo

I've said it elsewhere, and will repeat the statement here: I think a message needs to be sent to the developers to let them know that some of us find this kind of marketting unappealing and offensive. I don't want to turn this into some lame petition thread, but perhaps some thought should be put into how to word an email (or campaign) to contact the developers and let them know there are some serious concerns about their marketting strategy.

One of the people in charge did specify that this box art is specifically for the European market, so I sort of doubt they'd listen to the complaints of a militant feminist Canadian. Hence, I thought I'd do a little survey to figure out what everyone else thinks, then figure out what to do accordingly. Feel free to participate.

[ozzie]

Originally Posted by Squinky

One of the people in charge did specify that this box art is specifically for the European market, so I sort of doubt they'd listen to the complaints of a militant feminist Canadian.

Well, I'm from Germany and I hate it. Maybe they will now!?

[Ascovel]

I must agree with Lee that the publisher seems to shoot himself in the foot with this kind of cover. What After the Brisk Nap said about the target audience is the most important factor in this.

Regardless of the audience, I still think the art is badly drawn, especially in there being no aspects of the game that are easily discernible from it beyond a scantly clad woman of questionable profession - everything else fades into the background without giving any message to the potential buyer. I'd never guess it's a spying-centered game from passing such a box on a store shelf.

[Henke]

Originally Posted by Ascovel

Regardless of the audience, I still think the art is badly drawn, especially in there being no aspects of the game that are easily discernible from it beyond a scantly clad woman of questionable profession - everything else fades into the background without giving any message to the potential buyer. I'd never guess it's a spying-centered game from passing such a box on a store shelf.

Hmm, this may sound stubborn of me but all the things in the background just screams "Adventure" to me.

I doubt that Mata Hari will be wearing next to nothing the entire game, but I still think that the fact that she is famous for the rumours of being a spy while she worked as an exotic dancer is well portrayed on this cover. Of course one can always argue about how naked people should be or not be.

[Jackal]

Originally Posted by After a brisk nap

I actually agree that it's not a great cover for selling the game. I think it's fairly well established that the core audience for most adventure games is middle-aged women...

Merely to play devil's advocate in this suddenly-interesting discussion, I'd point out that the prime demographic for Cosmopolitan and countless other fitness/fashion/society magazines with often-scantily-clad women on the cover is likely middle-aged women as well. I think it's wrong to assume even the majority of women would inherently be turned off by such a cover as Mata Hari's when they're already happily buying similarly packaged products already.

On a personal note, though, I will say that the teaser art is a hillion jillion times sexier than the box art.

Also, hi dtp Chris! Long time no see. Good to see you again, even if it took a controversy to lure you in.

[jp-30]

The full lineup with costume variations of that Teaser art in high-res is even better. Also, these costume designs are pretty sweet.

[Ascovel]

Originally Posted by Henke

Hmm, this may sound stubborn of me but all the things in the background just screams "Adventure" to me.

Maybe so... if you put the background under a microscope. Otherwise the only thing that screams from the art is Mata Hari's naked body. From all other elements of the art the most noisy are the curtains.

[Henke]

Originally Posted by Ascovel

Maybe so... if you put the background under a microscope. Otherwise the only thing that screams from the art is Mata Hari's naked body. From all other elements of the art the most noisy are the curtains.

That is (almost) true. If the cover was the same size as a stamp that is.

[Squinky]

Originally Posted by Jackal

Merely to play devil's advocate in this suddenly-interesting discussion, I'd point out that the prime demographic for Cosmopolitan and countless other fitness/fashion/society magazines with often-scantily-clad women on the cover is likely middle-aged women as well. I think it's wrong to assume even the majority of women would inherently be turned off by such a cover as Mata Hari's when they're already happily buying similarly packaged products already.

I personally feel as though the cover looks more like Maxim than Cosmo, particularly where Mata Hari's body language is concerned. Still, you make a very good point; although I myself don't read women's magazines, many women do, and that shouldn't be discounted.

[misslilo]

The middle-aged women I know, that read women's magazines - do NOT play adventure games..
In fact they don't play computergames at all.

[After a brisk nap]

Originally Posted by Jackal

Merely to play devil's advocate in this suddenly-interesting discussion, I'd point out that the prime demographic for Cosmopolitan and countless other fitness/fashion/society magazines with often-scantily-clad women on the cover is likely middle-aged women as well. I think it's wrong to assume even the majority of women would inherently be turned off by such a cover as Mata Hari's when they're already happily buying similarly packaged products already.

True enough. However, I think Squinky is right. I can't quite put my finger on it, but the visual language of this cover seems different than Cosmo and similar magazines, or even the covers of romance novels.

[Lee in Limbo]

Most fashion models in magazines and on billboards are usually either more pretentious or more dramatic. Whereas, models in men's magazines are either playing at being demure or are going for full out salaciousness. The poses and wardrobes may sometimes look similar, but the posture and expressions change things entirely. Sometimes teh differences are so subtle, it's hard to pinpoint just why one thing looks more taseful than another. We tend to make sweeping generalizations like 'oh, she has more/less covering her' and 'the expression in her eyes is less/more innocent' and such. And some of it really is pretty subjective. However, a good art director usually has their eye open for where to draw the line on how much sex goes into a sexy ad. Knowing where the line is and how to handle it is part of the gig.

I just think the cover we're seeing here looks tacky. nothing to do with how much flesh I'm seeing. The model isn't doing anything for me, but I think that's just down to the personality she's projecting. She isn't intriguing me in the least. She's actually a bit of a turn off. *sigh*

[crabapple]

My problem with the cover isn't the "scantily clad" part -- it's that the woman's looks are too "modern" -- the makeup, the way she's standing, the expression on her face... If you compare the box shot with photographs of the real Mata Hari that you can find using Google, it isn't the same woman and it isn't even a woman from the same time period as the real Mata Hari.

[Ascovel]

Originally Posted by Henke

That is (almost) true. If the cover was the same size as a stamp that is.

Touche

[usman]

http://www.matahari-game.de/ The game looks very very intresting............I wonder if it will come out in English speaking contries as well soon.............

[usman]

The game is out in Germany I wish English Version will also come out soon...