You are viewing an archived version of the site which is no longer maintained.
Go to the current live site or the Adventure Gamers forums
Adventure Gamers

Home Adventure Forums Gaming Adventure Secret of Monkey Island Virgin


 
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 09-16-2006, 07:29 PM   #1
Super Moderator
 
Melanie68's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Ohio
Posts: 8,907
Default Secret of Monkey Island Virgin

So I finally got my CD of the White Label Double Pack that contains The Secret of Monkey Island and Monkey Island 2. Some novice questions:

I've heard SoMI has a text parser. Is that true for the CD version?

Any advice before I get started?

Many thanks.
Melanie68 is offline  
Old 09-16-2006, 07:47 PM   #2
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Oregon
Posts: 10
Default

I just got the first two Monkey Island games for the first time too (on the Monkey Island Madness CD). My version of SoMI was point and click, but I can't say about the White Label pack. I just finished it yesterday and am about ready to start in on the second game. My only advice would be to jump right in. I loved the game and have found a new personal favorite puzzle. Enjoy!
HannibalUltor is offline  
Old 09-16-2006, 08:07 PM   #3
Diva of Death
 
Jeysie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Western Massachusetts
Posts: 1,402
Send a message via MSN to Jeysie
Default

None of the MI games have text parsers proper, meaning typey-typey ones.

Instead, the first couple games have a PnC command line, as it were. There's three sections... command words (like Push, Pull, Pick Up, Use, etc.) an inventory section, and the main "world" screen.

To make your actions, you click on a command word, then click on either inventory or on something in the world screen. Like, you might click on "Use", then a fish in your inventory, then a bucket on the world screen, to get "Use fish in bucket."

I personally found it to be a rather nice blend between the flexibility of a typey text parser, and the ease of PnC, and it's one of my favorite interfaces. Plus, there's one section of Secret of Monkey Island that makes utterly hilarious and creative use of the command line, and is one of my favorite adventure game scenes in general.

Peace & Luv, Liz
__________________
Adventures in Roleplaying (Nov. 19):

"Maybe it's still in the Elemental Plane of Candy."
"Is the Elemental Plane of Candy anything like Willy Wonka's factory?"
"If it is, would that mean Oompa Loompas are Candy Elementals?"
"Actually, I'm thinking more like the Candyland board game. But, I like this idea better."
"I like the idea of Oompa Loompa Elementals."
Jeysie is offline  
Old 09-16-2006, 08:13 PM   #4
Super Moderator
 
Melanie68's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Ohio
Posts: 8,907
Default

Thanks HannibalUltor and Jeysie.

I've played some of DOTT and that had the same thing. An amateur game, No Action Jackson, had a similar interface as well. Cool, cool, cool.
Melanie68 is offline  
Old 09-16-2006, 08:13 PM   #5
Tactlessly understated
 
Kingzjester's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Niceshire
Posts: 2,045
Send a message via AIM to Kingzjester
Default

Text parser in SoMI? Cripes! Where in the world did you hear that?!
Kingzjester is offline  
Old 09-16-2006, 08:16 PM   #6
Unreliable Narrator
 
Squinky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Le Canada
Posts: 9,873
Send a message via AIM to Squinky Send a message via MSN to Squinky
Default

Virgin indeed...
__________________
Squinky is always right, but only for certain values of "always" and "right".
Squinky is offline  
Old 09-16-2006, 08:20 PM   #7
Senior Member
 
jp-30's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 413
Default

In post MI2 releases (or possibly CD Rom versions) the SoMI interface was changed from text (lots of verbs / text inventory) to the more streamlined 9-word choice & Icon based inventory of MI2.

Image comparison

The image above shows the 2 interface styles, though the top one's in German obviously.

There are very slight spoilers in the inventory listings, so excercise caution if clicking.

Edit: Here's an english version, but at a different location.

Last edited by jp-30; 09-16-2006 at 08:25 PM.
jp-30 is offline  
Old 09-16-2006, 08:21 PM   #8
Super Moderator
 
Melanie68's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Ohio
Posts: 8,907
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kingzjester
Text parser in SoMI? Cripes! Where in the world did you hear that?!
I saw something posted on here but knowing me, I probably remembered what I read incorrectly. My old brain doesn't always function as it should.

Edit: Seeing what JP-30 posted (thanks for that), they were probably referring to the above interface.
Melanie68 is offline  
Old 09-17-2006, 03:05 AM   #9
Easily amused
 
colpet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 1,091
Default

I hope you enjoy them more than I did. I bought The Curse of Monkey Island with a bonus Monkey Island Madness (MI1 and 2) after hearing so much praise for the games. MI 1 was cute and funny, but MI 2 was just too goofy and over the top for my tastes. I never bothered with MI3. I've got the games listed at GTZ if anyone is interested .
__________________
Occasionally visiting Uru Live (KI 00637228).
colpet is offline  
Old 09-17-2006, 03:14 AM   #10
Senior Member
 
Kurufinwe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Santa Barbara, CA
Posts: 3,038
Default

I'll hope you'll have fun with it, Mel. I've always loved MI1 (and never cared much for MI2).

And I guess it's a good time to re-read Emily's own account of her first experience.
__________________
Currently reading: Dune (F. Herbert)
Recently finished: Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban (J. K. Rowling) [++], La Nuit des Temps (R. Barjavel) [+++]
Currently playing: Skyrim
Recently finished: MCF: Escape from Ravenhearst [+], The Walking Dead, ep. 1 [+++], Gray Matter [++]
Kurufinwe is offline  
Old 09-17-2006, 03:19 AM   #11
Senior Member
 
Wimli's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Belgium
Posts: 146
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kurufinwe
I'll hope you'll have fun with it, Mel. I've always loved MI1 (and never cared much for MI2).

And I guess it's a good time to re-read Emily's own account of her first experience.
I liked the first game, but for some reason never got round to finishing it. Hm, should try again one of these days. Never played the second one, pretty rare around where I live apparently , but the third one was great fun!

@Colpet:
do try the third Monkey Island game, it's hilarious!
Wimli is offline  
Old 09-17-2006, 08:26 AM   #12
Diva of Death
 
Jeysie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Western Massachusetts
Posts: 1,402
Send a message via MSN to Jeysie
Default

Colpet: I'd definitely recommend playing Curse of Monkey Island. It plays a lot like the first game (and tends to flip-flop with such for being my favorite game in the series). I wasn't that fond of MI2 either. At the very least, I don't like it anywhere near as much as a lot of people here do.

Peace & Luv, Liz
__________________
Adventures in Roleplaying (Nov. 19):

"Maybe it's still in the Elemental Plane of Candy."
"Is the Elemental Plane of Candy anything like Willy Wonka's factory?"
"If it is, would that mean Oompa Loompas are Candy Elementals?"
"Actually, I'm thinking more like the Candyland board game. But, I like this idea better."
"I like the idea of Oompa Loompa Elementals."
Jeysie is offline  
Old 09-17-2006, 08:41 AM   #13
Tactlessly understated
 
Kingzjester's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Niceshire
Posts: 2,045
Send a message via AIM to Kingzjester
Default

MI2 is a work of art. As they say, to some people that doesn't say much, to others it leaves nothing to be said. It is also likely to polarize people. I played SoMI recently and was kinda bored, it is a neat game, quaint almost. MI2 is mind-blowingly awesome by comparison on many, many levels.
Kingzjester is offline  
Old 09-17-2006, 09:06 AM   #14
Diva of Death
 
Jeysie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Western Massachusetts
Posts: 1,402
Send a message via MSN to Jeysie
Default

I'll be cautious and avoid garnerning any potential rude implications of the "work of art" sentence.

As for the rest, well, I obviously disagree. Perhaps some specific reasons *why* you find MI2 mind-blowing instead of simply a superlative that's rather hard to discuss with?

It's been a while since I played the game, but going from what I remember...

1. I found the characterization of Guybrush/Elaine to be too big of a change from the first game. I found myself wanting there to be a transition game in between, somehow. One reason I liked Curse of Monkey Island was because they went back to being closer to their SMI selves, with (IMHO) a more realistic amount of development.

2. I found the middle of the game too open and aimless. I found myself losing track of the plot and devolving into the realm of "Go here. Solve puzzle because it's there. Go to next place. Solve puzzles because they're there. Go to next place. Try to solve puzzle because it's there. Have to backtrack to places one and two because you need stuff to solve puzzle. Etc."

I don't expect or desire an adventure game to be totally linear, but there's a balance between totally linear and "Wait, what was the plot, again?". For me personally, at least, MI2 was on the wrong side of that balance.

3. Has its fair share of "LucasArts" puzzles... as in, puzzles that are obtuse and require lateral thinking to the extent of almost needing a jump to alternate dimensions.

Spoiler:
Yes, I'm looking at you, monkey wrench puzzle, in particular. Everything about that puzzle, method of getting the monkey included, was a giant, unsatisfying stretch.


4. Color me as one of the people who didn't like the ending. That gimmick has been *so* overused to the point it's lame.

And no, the whole, "But if Ron Gilbert made MI3, it would make sense!" argument doesn't wash with me. Unless you're releasing a game as a blatant two-parter, or releasing the game and its sequel at the same time, a game's ending needs to stand on its own. IMHO it doesn't.

Do I hate the game or think it's bad? No. I had fun playing it (although I have no desire to play it again). I just don't agree with some people who think it's totally awesome. Which is fine... in the end, taste in games is subjective.

Peace & Luv, Liz
__________________
Adventures in Roleplaying (Nov. 19):

"Maybe it's still in the Elemental Plane of Candy."
"Is the Elemental Plane of Candy anything like Willy Wonka's factory?"
"If it is, would that mean Oompa Loompas are Candy Elementals?"
"Actually, I'm thinking more like the Candyland board game. But, I like this idea better."
"I like the idea of Oompa Loompa Elementals."
Jeysie is offline  
Old 09-17-2006, 09:14 AM   #15
Senior Member
 
Kurufinwe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Santa Barbara, CA
Posts: 3,038
Default

^ Seconded, from the first word to the last (well, apart from signing "Liz", obviously ).
__________________
Currently reading: Dune (F. Herbert)
Recently finished: Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban (J. K. Rowling) [++], La Nuit des Temps (R. Barjavel) [+++]
Currently playing: Skyrim
Recently finished: MCF: Escape from Ravenhearst [+], The Walking Dead, ep. 1 [+++], Gray Matter [++]
Kurufinwe is offline  
Old 09-17-2006, 09:19 AM   #16
Super Moderator
 
Melanie68's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Ohio
Posts: 8,907
Default

Now I need to play both games to the end to see what camp I fall into. I also have MI3 as well that I started playing a while ago but didn't get far into it. I had it on my old laptop then I got my new one and never reinstalled it. I also wanted to play the first two games before that one.

I've also read Emily's article before. I really enjoyed it. Edit: She evoked the atmosphere of the houseboat and her experience really well and made it seem like I was there (this is why I'm not a writer, I can't describe it well). I could also identify with her impatience with gaming. I tend toward hints rather quickly myself.

The thing that has cracked me up so far is how everything is trademarked. That and the "Ask me about Loom." There will be more, I know.

I've also found the
Spoiler:
chicken with the pulley in the middle
that I've heard so much about.

Last edited by Melanie68; 09-17-2006 at 10:02 AM.
Melanie68 is offline  
Old 09-17-2006, 11:08 AM   #17
capsized.
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 5,534
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kingzjester
MI2 is a work of art. As they say, to some people that doesn't say much, to others it leaves nothing to be said. It is also likely to polarize people. I played SoMI recently and was kinda bored, it is a neat game, quaint almost. MI2 is mind-blowingly awesome by comparison on many, many levels.

The first part of SoMI is the finest and cleverest and most adventurous piece of game design in the whole series, though. It has it all! Treasure hunting and dog poisoning and sword fighting and bad breath and 100 pieces of eight and woods and drinks and girls and excessive trademarking and in-game advertising and WOAH. "That's a lot of mostly very clever stuff", you say? Yeah, that's a LOT of mostly very clever stuff indeed. Sigh.
__________________
Look, Mr. Bubbles...!
samIamsad is offline  
Old 09-17-2006, 12:23 PM   #18
Unreliable Narrator
 
Squinky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Le Canada
Posts: 9,873
Send a message via AIM to Squinky Send a message via MSN to Squinky
Default

I agree with Jeysie and Kurufinwe. I also wonder whether the concept of what is "art" (as well as the concept of what is "good art") can really be defined objectively. Then again, I haven't taken an art class since junior high, and haven't taken any classes in art history or philosophy as it pertains to art at all, so maybe my opinion doesn't matter.
__________________
Squinky is always right, but only for certain values of "always" and "right".
Squinky is offline  
Old 09-17-2006, 12:55 PM   #19
Super Moderator
 
Melanie68's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Ohio
Posts: 8,907
Default

I'm having a senior moment. I've visited the general store once and now I that I have some money, I need to go back but I've already forgotten where it is.

Mel


Edit: Nevermind. I looked on UHS hints and they had a map of the town. Never ask me to navigate for you.

Last edited by Melanie68; 09-17-2006 at 01:03 PM.
Melanie68 is offline  
Old 09-17-2006, 03:15 PM   #20
The Dartmaster
 
Jake's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: San Rafael, California
Posts: 3,084
Send a message via ICQ to Jake Send a message via MSN to Jake Send a message via Yahoo to Jake
Default Oh man I shouldn't have read this thread...

Fanboy vomit post incoming! I haven't been able to write about MI for a while...

While I love Monkey Island 1 and its pure simplicity, I definitely fall in the "majorly prefer Monkey 2" camp.

I think the writing is stronger, the storyline feels more deep and original than the first even if in many ways it's structurally identical to Monkey 1 and every other well-made 3rd person point and click from that era. I really really like that the story delves deep into the lore of its own universe, with the history of the four map pieces and the legend of Big Whoop, but it does it without turning the game into a continuity bog-down "uncover the past" festival - Monkey 2's storytelling just has a great strong undercurrent to it... if that makes sense? It feels like there's a ton going on just beneath the surface, that the world you're playing in is very substantial and there are events going on stretching well before you got there, but it's done without getting in the way of Guybrush's piratey adventure and without stepping on the jokes. I think the game is just very well balanced on almost all sides from an overall plotting/storytelling/dialogue perspective. It feels adventurous, it feels big and epic, it feels old, and it somehow manages to be genuinely hilarious and occasionally very dramatic, sometimes seemingly at the same time.

The artwork in 2 is amazing, and though the game's 320x200 256 color technology hasn't held up, the background paintings themselves and the art direction by Steve Purcell and Peter Chan are still some of the most engrossing and atmospheric pieces of game art I've seen (and their general visual aesthetic and color palette were amazingly basically lifted wholesale for the first Pirates of the Caribben film - possibly unintentionally, but its nice that MI 2 was 15 years ahead of the curve on that look). Though next to nothing was animated in those games due to technology and budget, the world of Monkey Island 2 still seems amazingly alive and real to me - moreso than most games I've ever played.

Granted, it does have the infamous monkey wrench puzzle among others, but IMO that's par for the course for games of that era, and therefore MI2's handful of hideous logic leaps are forgiveable. The game doesn't allow you to accidentally walk off cliffs by clicking on them, for instance, nor does it have you sticking scotch tape on a hole to get some cat hair which you combine with syrup to make a mustache to immitate a man who does not in fact have a mustache. Worse things have happened in the history of adventure gaming than MI2's one or two overly-obtuse puzzles.

Monkey Island 2's ending, from a purely "make me feel good about myself at the end of the story" fulfillment point of view, definitely stinks, but I think it totally holds up thematically. I think the first two games make plenty of soft allusions to where the end of the game is headed, and though when I was 12 it confused me more than anything, at this point I have a huge amount of respect for the end of MI2 and enjoy it quite a lot. I think it's the closest you can get to pulling off a great David Lynch style thematic but not plot-based wrap-up in what is essentially a comedy/adventure cartoon. Hats off to them for having the balls to do it, and double hats off for successfully pulling it off (as long as the player is willing to check their expectations at the door).

As for Guybrush and Elaine, and Monkey Island 3, I think where they ended up as characters throughout Monkey 2 is really good and far more accurate than where the writers of Monkey 3 made them end up. The way they end up in 3, to me, seems overly trite and predictable, and I think that the ending (and, come to think of it, overall plot) of Monkey 3 was only allowed to exist because the writers of 3 grossly dumbed down both Elaine and Guybrush.

In 1 and 2, Guybrush is a bit of a goof, yes, but it's his spirit of adventure and desire to never give up - rather than, as the writers of Monkey 3 would have you believe - his desire to be a lackluster do-gooder, that drives him through the story and makes him an interetsing character. The same with Elaine - in Monkey 1 and 2 the character she most closely resembles is Marian from Raiders of the Lost Ark - a bit immature at times, maybe a bit bitchy/spoiled, but by and large her main strengths as a character lie in her being an independent woman with a quick wit, able to not just play with the big boys but often beat them at their own game. In Monkey 3 she was reduced largely to a whiney demanding woman with a poor posh British accent who complains about jewels and punches Guybrush in the face. This gross misinterpretation of the two main characters got even worse in the fourth game. I say "boo" to that.*

I don't want to spoil any big plot bits for Melanie, so I won't go any further than that, though my internal nerdometer is telling me I've gone too far already.

* I guess it should be said that despite my extreme fanboy nitpicking and dissection, the things I brought up don't actually diminish my enjoyment of Monkey Island 3. It's a great game. I think it rightly earned its place as one of the true classics of the adventure game genre. I just also happen to think that their portrayal of some previous characters and themes was a bit weak.

Last edited by Jake; 09-17-2006 at 03:22 PM.
Jake is offline  
 



Thread Tools

 


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.