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Old 05-03-2009, 09:24 AM   #40
darthmaul
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Join Date: Jun 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by imisssunwell View Post
@Find Therma, I used to play adventures (I still do but to a much lesser extent) when the genre was at its zenith. Adventure games then weren't content to low crafting & halting evolution. Tech-wise they used the best that was available, when the CD-rom came (before that we had only floppy disks), adventure developers immediately took advantage of the new technology and created more impressive worlds+added voice acting, they used point & click instead of /open in an era without MS-Windows & web, back then it was one of the best ways to interact with the game world. They had VGA graphics and took advantage of SoundBlaster cards. If these things sound pretty standard today, it wasn't necessarily so back then.

King's Quest V had made use of actors in order to make the movements of characters look realistic, a big step forward for it's time (seeing the movement of some characters today I wonder if this is done for some "modern" adventures). They were top notch, produced by companies that were willing to build something innovative (for that time!), use intelligent scripts, humor (intelligent humor that is) and take the risk to create a big budged game (iirc KQ5 cost 1 million dollars, huge amount for the development costs of the era). Games that were interactive with the user, had interactive worlds, in some cases even had multi-linearity and very importantly had a very high level of craft for that time. No wonder these times are considered by many people as the Golden Era, TLDR: the games were really top quality, while current ones don't take similar steps towards the advancement of visuals/audio quality, interaction with the user, interactivity of the game world, replay value, most new AGs seem content to stay repetitive & have a low craft quality.

Regarding rpgs, nomalsoul said many nice points so I'll just mention the points I would like to add, imho puzzles are a means to interact with the game world/storyline if this is done in a dull way and the storyline is not calibrated, I'd rather play an rpg game. It is also a matter of overall craft, how dynamic is the world? how good are the graphics? does the game have replay value? I don't think that the rpg market is full of boring narrative, sure there would be low-quality games like in every genre, but the good ones really shine and that is what AG are missing lately, good games which shine. I find most actions you have to do in rpgs relevant to the storyline or at least to the physical space surrounding your character and I like that.

Also regarding thought, I'll have to disagree, take for example high end WoW raiding, in order to min/max your performance and find optimal rotations/best in slot gear people even had to code simulators or do some math, people also try to find the economic impact of a future patch and take advantage of the market changes to make virtual gold, I find this sort of mini puzzles interesting. In AG you never reach that level to tackle a problem, it's always a finite puzzle that, in the worst case be brute forced, given enough patience.

Regarding drakenshard, I haven't bought the game but I can think of quite a few rpg games that are very good, KotOR, Mask of the Betrayer, Mass Effect, Oblivion and WoW from WRPGS, FF games from JRPGs also, while strictly speaking, Zelda games are not RPG, they provide a similar experience & are very good value for money.


"KotOR, Mask of the Betrayer, Mass Effect, Oblivion and WoW from WRPGS, FF games from JRPGs also,"

Funny, I played those genres at their zenith and now they are just the same game with better graphics over and over again.

FF was better at 4 and 6. Now it is too mind numbingly repetitive for me. They haven't done anything new besides for graphics and voicework in 20 years.

BG2, Fallout 2, and Planescape. The newer ones are the same thing I have done 1000 times before. Nothing new but voice and graphics.


Same goes for the Morrowind clones with better graphics. Same thing as Daggerfall done with better graphics over and over again.

As for Wow... I've had top level characters before, but the idea of sitting in a dungeon I've done 10+ times before for 4 hours for a 2% chance at an item, just to be played in that same 2-5 hour dungeon again infinity is as unintelligent and mindless as it gets. It isn't like you are doing anything more than aggroing a group of 3-6 and hitting the same 4 buttons that you have for the last 70 levels... I would rather mow the lawn over and over again than be stuck in that "puzzle."


Some of the best things are unknown and underappreciated. Doesn't make it dead. Sci fi tv, sci fi/fantasy books, bands like Phish, great comics, adventure games, etc. This often attracts great indie talent as well.

You liked the king's quest series, as do many others. However, I think the constant deaths, frustrating puzzles, irritating bugs, mazes, etc turned a ton of people off.

With games like Lost Crown, Barrow Hill, Nikopol, Dark Fall, and the dozens of others that come out each year, the genre is better now than it ever was in the nostalgia laden time of the 90s. I actually walked away at the time and came back 10 years later, finding the games MUCH better now. All imo, but the great games keep coming out.

Bottom line is dead to the mainstream is not dead for the genre.

Being mainstream brings a ton of potential downside. Nostalgia does not equal reality.
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